Melbourne Rebels 2011
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Lee Grant
John Eales (66)
The length of the new players contracts are not mentioned - a fairly typical situation with inexperienced recruits. They could all be signings for the Rebels professional academy also.
If you look at the needs of the Rebels as I saw it a while back they needed:
- another hooker, as Tessman was not experienced (and perhaps a pro academy signing himself).
- another midfielder
- another winger at least
JPdP has no track record here in rugby union and perhaps is just another league player discarded because he is too old for the Toyota Cup the following year. Let's not take the remarks of players joining a new club or rugby code too seriously folks. If this is wrong and he is a decent player he could be a developing foreign player as he wouldn't qualify on residency yet.
Phipps is probably a pro academy signing because it is unlikely the Rebels would give out 3 S15 contracts to scrummies. These kind of things happen more when an experienced third player in a position like 1,2,3,9 and 10 becomes available and you have to grab him. You never know though: he's seems like a good 15s player on TV evidence.
21 y.o. 2nd rower Pyle is from my local club, the Rats. He's big enough at 199cms and 113 kgs, and is a good lineout man, but you wouldn't throw him at Bakkies Botha or Brad Thorn in a hurry. He's exactly the type of player you'd like to see in an ARC to assess him at a higher level than club rugby - and to improve his play and season him at the same time. Saw him at the ground last Saturday though he didn't play, but he looked pretty pleased with himself.
Some or all of these three could be astute pro academy signings. I have mentioned before that the building up of a pro academy stable is going to be more important for the Rebels than anybody else because the excess foreigners have to be replaced sooner rather than later. These three could form the first tranche of the 2012 vintage.
If you look at the needs of the Rebels as I saw it a while back they needed:
- another hooker, as Tessman was not experienced (and perhaps a pro academy signing himself).
- another midfielder
- another winger at least
JPdP has no track record here in rugby union and perhaps is just another league player discarded because he is too old for the Toyota Cup the following year. Let's not take the remarks of players joining a new club or rugby code too seriously folks. If this is wrong and he is a decent player he could be a developing foreign player as he wouldn't qualify on residency yet.
Phipps is probably a pro academy signing because it is unlikely the Rebels would give out 3 S15 contracts to scrummies. These kind of things happen more when an experienced third player in a position like 1,2,3,9 and 10 becomes available and you have to grab him. You never know though: he's seems like a good 15s player on TV evidence.
21 y.o. 2nd rower Pyle is from my local club, the Rats. He's big enough at 199cms and 113 kgs, and is a good lineout man, but you wouldn't throw him at Bakkies Botha or Brad Thorn in a hurry. He's exactly the type of player you'd like to see in an ARC to assess him at a higher level than club rugby - and to improve his play and season him at the same time. Saw him at the ground last Saturday though he didn't play, but he looked pretty pleased with himself.
Some or all of these three could be astute pro academy signings. I have mentioned before that the building up of a pro academy stable is going to be more important for the Rebels than anybody else because the excess foreigners have to be replaced sooner rather than later. These three could form the first tranche of the 2012 vintage.
rustycruiser
Billy Sheehan (19)
JP du Plessis was in the winning WP Craven Week team, and then selected for the 2009 SA Schools team, so he has a bit of talent. From Paul Roos in Stellies, so I am sure PB will know all about him in detail.
D
daz
Guest
Would he even be interested in residency? I assume you are alluding to potential future Wallaby selection if warranted?
en_force_er
Geoff Shaw (53)
I don't see why he'd be playing here and not SA if he wanted an SA international future.
DPK
Peter Sullivan (51)
Cipriani said he wanted to represent England again, but he's playing even further from home than JPdP...
rustycruiser
Billy Sheehan (19)
He turned down offers from multiple SA provinces to sign for the Roosters. Not sure if the motivation was money, a way to leave SA for greener shores, or just the challenge.
en_force_er
Geoff Shaw (53)
Yes, but Cipriani has international caps and his country has a coach that doesn't fancy his playing style. His career is at a cross-roads of sorts and he is, if you believe the media, very unhappy with the life he was leading back home. Who knows where the move might of taken him had he not been capped.
Compare this to JPdP, no international caps and touted as a future Springbok in the making. He has opted out of at least a probable run with SA U20s in the next year or two. He can still play for whatever country he wants, eventually, yet chose to not stay in his country of birth.
They arent similar cases at all.
D
daz
Guest
Agreed. Whatever benefit Cips provides is counter-balanced by the fact that he cannot progress beyond the Rebels in Oz. He has stated that going back to the England setup a more rounded player is the long term aim. MJ doesn't want him right now, so there you go. I think he has done the best thing for his career. I'm sure he could have taken a few extra dollars in Europe or Japan. Whether he has taken a place that a locally produced kid could use as a development pathway is debatable.
JPdP is a whole other ball game. If he shines, expect a bidding war between the Boks and Oz rugby for that first cap.
JPdP is a whole other ball game. If he shines, expect a bidding war between the Boks and Oz rugby for that first cap.
T
tranquility
Guest
JP Du Plessis is such an exciting prospect from my perspective because he sounds as if he is a genuine football player, as he can play 12 and 13 and wing at a pinch. He also appears to have been a fairly outstanding schoolboy centre. He may not have had any game time at the Roosters, but the fact that he been in a full-time professional environment means that he will probably be more physically advanced that the centers of the same age in the other Super 14 academies. It also sounds like he wants to be the next Clyde, and that is gooood news.
MrTimms
Ken Catchpole (46)
I am in UN ZUD right now and the news on the street here is Luke Rooney is playing this years NPC for Hawkes Bay, so there should be a few more opportunities to see him play before the S15 kicks off.
T
TOCC
Guest
Yes, it was in the news, Rooney signed with hawked bay
Lee Grant
John Eales (66)
daz
I forgot that Melbourne are allowed to have 10 foreigners in Year 1 so the residency thing doesn't apply as it would to other franchises, unless he was recruited as the single developing foreign player allowed to them. As you were.
He must be a good player to have played for SA Schools. I am a bit suss about his stated reason for leaving the Roosters as there is the possibility that he just wasn't cutting it. This may seem harsh but there are a few players, 2 at my local club, who come back to rugby union after getting a tap on the shoulder that they are not wanted for the Toyota Cup ( for U/19 players) and especially when they turn 19 during the year and they aren't good enough to progress to the NRL the following year.
Having said that we should take his statement about missing ruby union at face value. We should also agree with tranquility in that he will be better prepared by the Roosters than other guys his age in rugby union.
The question remains: is he a S15 contracted player or a professional academy player? Ditto for the other two.
I forgot that Melbourne are allowed to have 10 foreigners in Year 1 so the residency thing doesn't apply as it would to other franchises, unless he was recruited as the single developing foreign player allowed to them. As you were.
He must be a good player to have played for SA Schools. I am a bit suss about his stated reason for leaving the Roosters as there is the possibility that he just wasn't cutting it. This may seem harsh but there are a few players, 2 at my local club, who come back to rugby union after getting a tap on the shoulder that they are not wanted for the Toyota Cup ( for U/19 players) and especially when they turn 19 during the year and they aren't good enough to progress to the NRL the following year.
Having said that we should take his statement about missing ruby union at face value. We should also agree with tranquility in that he will be better prepared by the Roosters than other guys his age in rugby union.
The question remains: is he a S15 contracted player or a professional academy player? Ditto for the other two.
T
tranquility
Guest
From the sounds of things he probably wasn't doing that well at the Roosters, but to be honest that doesn't bother me very much. It is very difficult to make the switch of code, in either direction and considering he has attempted this with such limited professional experience in a game that he is not familiar with one could only expect the return on investment to me meager. From my limited snooping I think that he has also had a few injuries and may in fact be injured at this moment in time? The positive side of the equation is that had he gone well in the Toyota Cup or even the NRL this situation may not have arisen, but as it stands Australian Rugby is in a position to scrape one of the elite juniors from another elite national system. If he fails than he may cost the Union and the Rebels $300,000 combined but we are still in front considering the amount of money that was probably spent on his rugby education through the pathways of South African rugby.
Lee Grant
John Eales (66)
That he's an elite player in league is a bit of a stretch - or you probably meant that because he has played in an elite U/19 league competition he is such.
Surely he won't cost Oz rugby $300K - just the basic S15 salary, assuming he has a S15 contract, and about $15,000 tops for a pro academy player.
Surely he won't cost Oz rugby $300K - just the basic S15 salary, assuming he has a S15 contract, and about $15,000 tops for a pro academy player.
T
tranquility
Guest
Sorry I meant, elite junior from his rugby backround and SA pathways.
D
daz
Guest
Well, given the debate around the recent Wallaby young 'uns and lack of professional development, any kid with such an impressive junior pedigree should be snaffled at the earliest opportunity!
T
TOCC
Guest
SMH believe this jersey is going to be very close to the one the Rebels have next year
RugbyFuture
Lord Logo
i was trying to find a picture after i saw that, cheers. looks decent to me (better than the waratahs jersey at present)
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