Melbourne Rebels 2011
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Lee Grant
John Eales (66)
Re: Rebels deadline ends, update here on what you hear.
Agree, especially on the X-factor - but these opinions sometimes get into the "which games were you watching in the last decade" category. Both sides know they are right and honestly can't understand the view of the other fellow.
To me BOD is like a Tim Horan playing 13, and he was as good in 2009 (Player of the 6N) as he was in 2000. He has a lot more to his game than Mortlock, is a superior ball player, and has a higher work rate - moving to different spots where he can be more useful more often whichever side has the ball - a Horan.
I'm not putting down Mortlock. I saw every test he played; I love the guy and IMO he's probably the best Oz outside centre we've had in the last 50 years, but that doesn't make him better than O'Driscoll in my eyes.
I'll take BOD every day of the year.
Agree, especially on the X-factor - but these opinions sometimes get into the "which games were you watching in the last decade" category. Both sides know they are right and honestly can't understand the view of the other fellow.
To me BOD is like a Tim Horan playing 13, and he was as good in 2009 (Player of the 6N) as he was in 2000. He has a lot more to his game than Mortlock, is a superior ball player, and has a higher work rate - moving to different spots where he can be more useful more often whichever side has the ball - a Horan.
I'm not putting down Mortlock. I saw every test he played; I love the guy and IMO he's probably the best Oz outside centre we've had in the last 50 years, but that doesn't make him better than O'Driscoll in my eyes.
I'll take BOD every day of the year.
S
Spook
Guest
Re: Rebels deadline ends, update here on what you hear.
:nta: Who decided that? Over McCaw, Smith, Matfield, FdP and various others? Lee, you need to lose these romantic notions concerning Eurotrash players and Eurotrash competition.
Lee Grant said:
:nta: Who decided that? Over McCaw, Smith, Matfield, FdP and various others? Lee, you need to lose these romantic notions concerning Eurotrash players and Eurotrash competition.
S
Spook
Guest
Re: Rebels deadline ends, update here on what you hear.
For a start, the player of the 6Ns is a joke. It is voted by the public and the Irish voters always organise their voting via emails, etc. For example, Tommy Bowe won it this year over the likes of harinordoquy :lmao: I think even BOD won 30% of the vote even though he was outplayed by the likes of Bastareaud and Hook.
In 2009, BOD wasn't as good as the 2000 version unless the 2000 version was a flanker. I can't recall any line breaks by BOD in the 2009 6Ns.
Lee Grant said:
For a start, the player of the 6Ns is a joke. It is voted by the public and the Irish voters always organise their voting via emails, etc. For example, Tommy Bowe won it this year over the likes of harinordoquy :lmao: I think even BOD won 30% of the vote even though he was outplayed by the likes of Bastareaud and Hook.
In 2009, BOD wasn't as good as the 2000 version unless the 2000 version was a flanker. I can't recall any line breaks by BOD in the 2009 6Ns.
C
CanadianRugby
Guest
Re: Rebels deadline ends, update here on what you hear.
1.
2.
3.Laurie Weeks (plays THP now anyway)
4.Luke Jones
5.Adam Byrnes
6.
7.
8.Gareth Delve
9.Richard Kingi
10.
11.
12. Stirling Mortlock (can't see him having the pace for 13 anymore)
13. Lachlan Mitchell (wasn't he playing in the centers for the Wasps?)
14.Peter Betham (who just signed)
15.Danny Cipriani
The way I think its actually going to be.
[/quote]On the subject of this thread, Rod Macqueen is recruiting nicely. Very nicely indeed.
[/quote]
Agree mostly. Certainly dispointing that they haven't gotten a big name player yet, who is still in his prime. Also, No 7, 10 are kind of a problem, since those are key positions. What does anyone know about Betham?
While we are on the subject, what is the logic behind Frier staying with NSW, as is rumoured. I think Frier is a great player (well, very good) and I suspect an excellent teammate, but he wants to stay in NSW where he is behind two other hookers? Does that make sense? I really want Frier to sign with the Rebels. Seriously. Just sign. please.
1.
2.
3.Laurie Weeks (plays THP now anyway)
4.Luke Jones
5.Adam Byrnes
6.
7.
8.Gareth Delve
9.Richard Kingi
10.
11.
12. Stirling Mortlock (can't see him having the pace for 13 anymore)
13. Lachlan Mitchell (wasn't he playing in the centers for the Wasps?)
14.Peter Betham (who just signed)
15.Danny Cipriani
The way I think its actually going to be.
[/quote]On the subject of this thread, Rod Macqueen is recruiting nicely. Very nicely indeed.
[/quote]
Agree mostly. Certainly dispointing that they haven't gotten a big name player yet, who is still in his prime. Also, No 7, 10 are kind of a problem, since those are key positions. What does anyone know about Betham?
While we are on the subject, what is the logic behind Frier staying with NSW, as is rumoured. I think Frier is a great player (well, very good) and I suspect an excellent teammate, but he wants to stay in NSW where he is behind two other hookers? Does that make sense? I really want Frier to sign with the Rebels. Seriously. Just sign. please.
waratahjesus
Greg Davis (50)
Re: Rebels deadline ends, update here on what you hear.
i think frier has a future in the media/coaching realm and moving to melbourne might put the brakes on it for now. He is a pretty smart dude, he is going to make the best decision for him and like mortlock, i think he has one eye on life after rugby.
i think frier has a future in the media/coaching realm and moving to melbourne might put the brakes on it for now. He is a pretty smart dude, he is going to make the best decision for him and like mortlock, i think he has one eye on life after rugby.
en_force_er
Geoff Shaw (53)
Re: Rebels deadline ends, update here on what you hear.
He has played all over the shop really. Is Rod one of those coaches that likes his utility players?
Where he plays could well be based on who else signs, for example if no other good 10s sign-up he could play 15 or if a good OC (Gasnier maybe?) signs-up he will play wing. Not a bad man to have.
CanadianRugby said:
He has played all over the shop really. Is Rod one of those coaches that likes his utility players?
Where he plays could well be based on who else signs, for example if no other good 10s sign-up he could play 15 or if a good OC (Gasnier maybe?) signs-up he will play wing. Not a bad man to have.
topo
Cyril Towers (30)
Re: Rebels deadline ends, update here on what you hear.
I've watched Betham since he was 15. On his day (and Shute Shield GF 2009 is a good example) he is sensational. Great balance, very evasive, big, fast and can tackle. Unfortunately, not every day is "his day" and he's been known to have some shockers. Lee refers to one recently for JWs against Brumby Runners. I think he would be worth a punt, though. NO definites,but I hear pretty reliably that Frier IS going south and Tim Davidson as well. I suspect that Damian Hill's Uni connection will get a few good young players down there. Look out for guys like Sam Carter, Dave McDuling, Ben Roberts and Jacob Taylor. And I think Ben Tapuai from the Reds is still in their sights.
CanadianRugby said:
I've watched Betham since he was 15. On his day (and Shute Shield GF 2009 is a good example) he is sensational. Great balance, very evasive, big, fast and can tackle. Unfortunately, not every day is "his day" and he's been known to have some shockers. Lee refers to one recently for JWs against Brumby Runners. I think he would be worth a punt, though. NO definites,but I hear pretty reliably that Frier IS going south and Tim Davidson as well. I suspect that Damian Hill's Uni connection will get a few good young players down there. Look out for guys like Sam Carter, Dave McDuling, Ben Roberts and Jacob Taylor. And I think Ben Tapuai from the Reds is still in their sights.
en_force_er
Geoff Shaw (53)
Re: Rebels deadline ends, update here on what you hear.
Hopefully they sign both Tapuai's. The Victorians deserve at least 1 or 2 of their own in the senior squad.
Surely James Hanson must be on the cards? Is he off contract?
He did great things for the ARC Rebels and through the experience showed he is willing to play in Melbourne. The man must be desperate for game time, he really deserves a S15 16 jersey at least and the Reds are really limiting his development.
topo said:
Hopefully they sign both Tapuai's. The Victorians deserve at least 1 or 2 of their own in the senior squad.
Surely James Hanson must be on the cards? Is he off contract?
He did great things for the ARC Rebels and through the experience showed he is willing to play in Melbourne. The man must be desperate for game time, he really deserves a S15 16 jersey at least and the Reds are really limiting his development.
en_force_er
Geoff Shaw (53)
Re: Rebels deadline ends, update here on what you hear.
Also, is Matt Carraro in the mix? I think he is an excellent player with WC wider squad potential. Someone get him home!
Also, is Matt Carraro in the mix? I think he is an excellent player with WC wider squad potential. Someone get him home!
Grandmaster Flash
Johnnie Wallace (23)
Re: Rebels deadline ends, update here on what you hear.
Thought I heard he was in Europe and considering having a shot at making the Italian squad?
en_force_er said:
Thought I heard he was in Europe and considering having a shot at making the Italian squad?
en_force_er
Geoff Shaw (53)
Re: Rebels deadline ends, update here on what you hear.
The double openside flanker tyle game style is a hard one to master, you really need the players to work out there balance. Force had it pretty right late last season.
If Robinson and Lipman both play for the Rats and the Rats go well, they could realistically both start Rebels. This is presuming Delve can jump (his wikipedia stats would suggest this wouldn't be a huge issue).
Yes yes, I know Lipman's is being blocked by the ARU for now but who knows.
fatprop said:
The double openside flanker tyle game style is a hard one to master, you really need the players to work out there balance. Force had it pretty right late last season.
If Robinson and Lipman both play for the Rats and the Rats go well, they could realistically both start Rebels. This is presuming Delve can jump (his wikipedia stats would suggest this wouldn't be a huge issue).
Yes yes, I know Lipman's is being blocked by the ARU for now but who knows.
Ash
Michael Lynagh (62)
Re: Rebels deadline ends, update here on what you hear.
The comparisons between the Rebels and Force in their first years will be interesting.
Remember MacQueen at the Brumbies - signed fringe players from both NSW and Queensland with a few (extremely) good local ACT lads. These players stepped up and did the job. It's apparent that MacQueen is trying the same formula again. Good luck to him.
In contrast the Force went after stars by offering big money and paraded them happily around. When the money went so did plenty of the "stars". Only recently do they have more of a team ethos and seem to have recruited great players who will stick by the team, like Pocock. One wonders how differently they would've gone with the MacQueen/Brumbies method.
The comparisons between the Rebels and Force in their first years will be interesting.
Remember MacQueen at the Brumbies - signed fringe players from both NSW and Queensland with a few (extremely) good local ACT lads. These players stepped up and did the job. It's apparent that MacQueen is trying the same formula again. Good luck to him.
In contrast the Force went after stars by offering big money and paraded them happily around. When the money went so did plenty of the "stars". Only recently do they have more of a team ethos and seem to have recruited great players who will stick by the team, like Pocock. One wonders how differently they would've gone with the MacQueen/Brumbies method.
Biffo
Ken Catchpole (46)
Re: Rebels deadline ends, update here on what you hear.
I would not. On days when "our" team was playing the big dogs - RSA, NZ and France - I wouldn't have O'Driscoll in my 22. For the big time, Mortlock's my man.
"Player of the decade" is a nonsense. Compartmentalizing decades into years starting with 0 and ending with 9 seriously biasses judgement of those whose careers were split over two such ten-year periods.
IMVHO, the best outside centre who played in the first decade of this century was the outside centre of the previous decade.
Lee Grant said:
I would not. On days when "our" team was playing the big dogs - RSA, NZ and France - I wouldn't have O'Driscoll in my 22. For the big time, Mortlock's my man.
"Player of the decade" is a nonsense. Compartmentalizing decades into years starting with 0 and ending with 9 seriously biasses judgement of those whose careers were split over two such ten-year periods.
IMVHO, the best outside centre who played in the first decade of this century was the outside centre of the previous decade.
Biffo
Ken Catchpole (46)
Re: Rebels deadline ends, update here on what you hear.
We should all recognize a few of Rod Macqueen's qualities before we rush to judgement on the Rebels' progress. Macqueen:
(1) has rugby smarts in abundance - probably exceeding the sum of those of the other Australian S15 coaches.
(2) is a brilliant man manager who will get the very best out of every player in his squad.
(3) doesn't squander resources - watch for his management of those in the squad who some have foolishly labelled "injury prone"; Macqueen will manage Mortlock to get all he can from him, recognizing fully that he is needed for S15 only and is probably not required for Wallaby duties and thus tailoring his training and playing regime.
(4) almost certainly knows precisely how he wants his team to play the game - can you say the same for his four Australian rivals?
(5) is a great improviser (come on down, Bernie), while a great believer in specialization
(6) is very patient indeed.
(7) is very organized and knoew exactly what he wants.
(8) does not have much tolerance for fools.
We should all recognize a few of Rod Macqueen's qualities before we rush to judgement on the Rebels' progress. Macqueen:
(1) has rugby smarts in abundance - probably exceeding the sum of those of the other Australian S15 coaches.
(2) is a brilliant man manager who will get the very best out of every player in his squad.
(3) doesn't squander resources - watch for his management of those in the squad who some have foolishly labelled "injury prone"; Macqueen will manage Mortlock to get all he can from him, recognizing fully that he is needed for S15 only and is probably not required for Wallaby duties and thus tailoring his training and playing regime.
(4) almost certainly knows precisely how he wants his team to play the game - can you say the same for his four Australian rivals?
(5) is a great improviser (come on down, Bernie), while a great believer in specialization
(6) is very patient indeed.
(7) is very organized and knoew exactly what he wants.
(8) does not have much tolerance for fools.
C
CanadianRugby
Guest
Re: Rebels deadline ends, update here on what you hear.
Big fan of Beau, after I saw him replace Waugh for that 'Tahs season. Kinda surprised he hasn't signed yet.
Scarfman said:
Big fan of Beau, after I saw him replace Waugh for that 'Tahs season. Kinda surprised he hasn't signed yet.
en_force_er
Geoff Shaw (53)
Re: Rebels deadline ends, update here on what you hear.
He is gunning for a Rebels contract for sure in my opinion.
This is considering the time he returned to Australia and the fact that the Tahs will certainly not have a opensider squad spot open next year, nor will the Force or Brumbies.
I suppose the Reds could be on the cards as well by they have a couple of their own development 7s and the Rebels have been denied Lipman.
CanadianRugby said:
He is gunning for a Rebels contract for sure in my opinion.
This is considering the time he returned to Australia and the fact that the Tahs will certainly not have a opensider squad spot open next year, nor will the Force or Brumbies.
I suppose the Reds could be on the cards as well by they have a couple of their own development 7s and the Rebels have been denied Lipman.
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