Where to for Super Rugby?

[WorkingClassRugger]

Yep it maybe simple Kiap, but think it would help, seriously the game really only exploded when Wallabies got WC, and I just trying hard to think what else is required to get people interested again. See people like most of us on here don't need rugby on front page, but to get enough money to do things we want, we need a lot more interest in game from Joe Blogg. I believe FTA was a great start, now we need enough watching it consistantly to attreact the sponsors etc.

A winning Wallabies team will help. One that manages to win the god damn Bledisloe would definitely help. But that's only a piece to the larger puzzle. More exposure on FTA, better implementation and retention in development and club programs are all very much needed to capture any level of interest generated from such results.

 

[wamberal]

There was an article in today's SMH talking about the booming ratings for the Storm in Melbourne. They also get good crowds at their games. If we want to know what it takes to be popular, they are a good example.

They hired an excellent coach, he has turned out to be arguably the best club coach in either rugby code. He laid down some markers, right from the start. Every player had to undertake some sort of technical or academic training. Every young player was given very clear objectives to achieve, in terms of fitness, weight, etc. They have had some hiccups (the salary cap shambles for example), but they do seem to have established a pretty good culture.

They hired astutely and successfully. They won early and often. They were innovative (eg the use of a wrestling coach).

They had plenty of money.

They came from nowhere, very little league culture in Melbourne, but they persisted, and now look at the buggers.

 

[Derpus]

There was an article in today's SMH talking about the booming ratings for the Storm in Melbourne. They also get good crowds at their games. If we want to know what it takes to be popular, they are a good example.

They hired an excellent coach, he has turned out to be arguably the best club coach in either rugby code. He laid down some markers, right from the start. Every player had to undertake some sort of technical or academic training. Every young player was given very clear objectives to achieve, in terms of fitness, weight, etc. They have had some hiccups (the salary cap shambles for example), but they do seem to have established a pretty good culture.

They hired astutely and successfully. They won early and often. They were innovative (eg the use of a wrestling coach).

They had plenty of money.

They came from nowhere, very little league culture in Melbourne, but they persisted, and now look at the buggers.

The NRL was entirely geared to propping the Storm up for years, including cap exemptions and greater funding than other teams.

I'm not sure feeding endless titles to the Rebels is a palatable path to success in Melbourne for RA. Plus, if there is to be a TT the idea is in the bin already.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

The NRL was entirely geared to propping the Storm up for years, including cap exemptions and greater funding than other teams.

I'm not sure feeding endless titles to the Rebels is a palatable path to success in Melbourne for RA. Plus, if there is to be a TT the idea is in the bin already.

And for all their success it has done very little in the way of local talent development and participation. Say what you will about the record of the Rebels but at least when you look at the squad you can point out the local boys to kids that play the game and say 'that could be you one day'.

 

[wamberal]

The NRL was entirely geared to propping the Storm up for years, including cap exemptions and greater funding than other teams.

I'm not sure feeding endless titles to the Rebels is a palatable path to success in Melbourne for RA. Plus, if there is to be a TT the idea is in the bin already.

Is there nothing we could learn from the success of the Storm? I confidently predicted that they would be a failure (based on a few years living there): I was certain that our game would prevail after we went professional. After all, rugby had been an established presence there for many years, some great Wallabies came from Victoria, it was played in some of the private schools. I thought that the Rebels would do the trick. The Premier of Victoria (Ted Ballieu) was a well known rugby tragic, and Harold Mitchell was tapped for financial and other involvement for the franchise. But they are still struggling.

Incidentally, the old rugby league adage used to be that you "cannot buy a premiership". I do think it is a bit simplistic to say that the Storm have been successful just because of money: a helluva lot of good decisions and clever innovative management have gone into their success.

As for the steady build up in their success, especially compared to the Rebels and as much as I hate to admit it, league is a more attractive game than rugby to Australian sports fans.

 

[Derpus]

You can totally buy premierships.

But, sure. The money needs be combined with competent management. I think that's the best thing to learn from the NRL and AFL. Look at their governance structures, grassroots approach etc.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

Is there nothing we could learn from the success of the Storm? I confidently predicted that they would be a failure (based on a few years living there): I was certain that our game would prevail after we went professional. After all, rugby had been an established presence there for many years, some great Wallabies came from Victoria, it was played in some of the private schools. I thought that the Rebels would do the trick. The Premier of Victoria (Ted Ballieu) was a well known rugby tragic, and Harold Mitchell was tapped for financial and other involvement for the franchise. But they are still struggling.

Incidentally, the old rugby league adage used to be that you "cannot buy a premiership". I do think it is a bit simplistic to say that the Storm have been successful just because of money: a helluva lot of good decisions and clever innovative management have gone into their success.

As for the steady build up in their success, especially compared to the Rebels and as much as I hate to admit it, league is a more attractive game than rugby to Australian sports fans.

Winning helps. No one is doubting that. But if the Storm collapsed tomorrow League in Victoria will be pretty where it was before they arrived. Which does support the concept that you can buy a Premiership. Several actually. The NRL has pumped a lot of money into the Storm which has allowed them to develop fantastic development systems which draws talent in. The roots of the game haven't really progressed. Hell, Cam Smith. A legend of the club has retired and almost immediately moved back to Queensland where the have much of the development players operating out of the Queensland Cup.

 

[Rebel man]

Winning helps. No one is doubting that. But if the Storm collapsed tomorrow League in Victoria will be pretty where it was before they arrived. Which does support the concept that you can buy a Premiership. Several actually. The NRL has pumped a lot of money into the Storm which has allowed them to develop fantastic development systems which draws talent in. The roots of the game haven't really progressed. Hell, Cam Smith. A legend of the club has retired and almost immediately moved back to Queensland where the have much of the development players operating out of the Queensland Cup.

Look the Rebels have a stronger base in terms a club system beneath them in Melbourne. Also a lot of blokes in Melbourne play union but primarily support the Storm. Now if the Rebels were to be successful then they would win fans who have walked away from the sport back

 

[Rebel man]

Further to my last post a lot of juniors also play footy on a Sunday. The more successful the Rebels become the more desirable the idea of playing there becomes and that will help keep more kids in the sport as opposed to leaving for footy

 

[Braveheart81]

What would the Storm look like if they hadn't had Craig Bellamy as coach for the last 18 years?

He's clearly one of the best couple of coaches in the whole competition.

 

[hoggy]

Success would help the Rebels a lot, it has a greater grassroots base than league, but I would argue that any possible growth in support was tempered by the ridiculous set up of Super rugby, most fair weather fans had turned off well before the end of the first sentence trying to explain Super Rugby.

 

[Jimmy_Crouch]

Winning helps. No one is doubting that. But if the Storm collapsed tomorrow League in Victoria will be pretty where it was before they arrived. Which does support the concept that you can buy a Premiership. Several actually. The NRL has pumped a lot of money into the Storm which has allowed them to develop fantastic development systems which draws talent in. The roots of the game haven't really progressed. Hell, Cam Smith. A legend of the club has retired and almost immediately moved back to Queensland where the have much of the development players operating out of the Queensland Cup.

Amen. That has been my point for years. The Storm are actually a drain on the competition and not responsible for the growth of the sport in Victoria.

Hugely successful team by on the field measures but in terms of developing Victorian league talent nowhere.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

Amen. That has been my point for years. The Storm are actually a drain on the competition and not responsible for the growth of the sport in Victoria.

Hugely successful team by on the field measures but in terms of developing Victorian league talent nowhere.

Which is why rugby still has a chance to be successful in Victoria with a quality team playing an attractive brand of rugby as a starting point...

 

[KevinO]

Look the Rebels have a stronger base in terms a club system beneath them in Melbourne. Also a lot of blokes in Melbourne play union but primarily support the Storm. Now if the Rebels were to be successful then they would win fans who have walked away from the sport back

The massive difference in this argument is NZ Warriors, they are not well supported and a lot of the kiwis who play league and union in Melbourne choose to support Storm. They don't choose to support the Rebels and will go for any of the 5 kiwi teams playing in Melbourne over the Rebels.

Rebels could actually attract more local support with out TT because those Kiwi's would not have another team to watch live with only SRAU. I always found it funny that a Blues fan who hates the Crusaders for example would still support the Crusaders this week if they were against the Rebels, but would support the Rebels next week against any Aus or SA team. Have your home team, but if you live in Melbourne then make the Rebels your second team and commit to it. Don't make them 6th choice.

 

[Jimmy_Crouch]

The massive difference in this argument is NZ Warriors, they are not well supported and a lot of the kiwis who play league and union in Melbourne choose to support Storm. They don't choose to support the Rebels and will go for any of the 5 kiwi teams playing in Melbourne over the Rebels.

Rebels could actually attract more local support with out TT because those Kiwi's would not have another team to watch live with only SRAU. I always found it funny that a Blues fan who hates the Crusaders for example would still support the Crusaders this week if they were against the Rebels, but would support the Rebels next week against any Aus or SA team. Have your home team, but if you live in Melbourne then make the Rebels your second team and commit to it. Don't make them 6th choice.

I'm from NSW but live in Brisbane. I'm a Reds member who wore a Waratahs jersey to the game in round one. This weekend I'll cheering my heart out for the Reds.

 

[KevinO]

I'm from NSW but live in Brisbane. I'm a Reds member who wore a Waratahs jersey to the game in round one.

Yeah, and I assume you support the Reds every other week of the year?

 

[Dctarget]

The massive difference in this argument is NZ Warriors, they are not well supported and a lot of the kiwis who play league and union in Melbourne choose to support Storm. They don't choose to support the Rebels and will go for any of the 5 kiwi teams playing in Melbourne over the Rebels.

Rebels could actually attract more local support with out TT because those Kiwi's would not have another team to watch live with only SRAU. I always found it funny that a Blues fan who hates the Crusaders for example would still support the Crusaders this week if they were against the Rebels, but would support the Rebels next week against any Aus or SA team. Have your home team, but if you live in Melbourne then make the Rebels your second team and commit to it. Don't make them 6th choice.

Well with the Vic Govt. being front of jersey sponsors, if Danny Andrews actually wanted to lean into authoritarianism he should force every emigrating Kiwi to declare for the Rebels.

I do wonder that if we manage to keep rugby alive in Australia for another generation or two will we see the benefit of all the Kiwis living in Aus. They might support NZ, but their kids and grandkids probably won't.

 

[Derpus]

Well with the Vic Govt. being front of jersey sponsors, if Danny Andrews actually wanted to lean into authoritarianism he should force every emigrating Kiwi to declare for the Rebels.

I do wonder that if we manage to keep rugby alive in Australia for another generation or two will we see the benefit of all the Kiwis living in Aus. They might support NZ, but their kids and grandkids probably won't.

This is where you are dead wrong. I know so many 'kiwis' who are born and bread Australians, might've visited NZ once, but support the All Blacks due to a parent. I doubt their kids would be any different, if they are raised to support the All Blacks.

And by so many i mean i know two people.....

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

Well with the Vic Govt. being front of jersey sponsors, if Danny Andrews actually wanted to lean into authoritarianism he should force every emigrating Kiwi to declare for the Rebels.

I do wonder that if we manage to keep rugby alive in Australia for another generation or two will we see the benefit of all the Kiwis living in Aus. They might support NZ, but their kids and grandkids probably won't.

I've known a number of Australian born and raised 'Kiwis' in my time. Hell, half of them had never even visited NZ but still declared themselves so. Which I never got my head around. Hell, thanks to a quirk of Irish law being that I have at least one parent born in Ireland and having lived there until at least their 18th birthday I was born an dual Australian/Irish citizen. So technically I'm Irish. But seeing as I was born and raised here. Outside of being able to cut lines at Heathrow thanks to my holding an Irish passport I certainly don't identify as Irish.

 

[Dctarget]

This is where you are dead wrong. I know so many 'kiwis' who are born and bread Australians, might've visited NZ once, but support the All Blacks due to a parent. I doubt their kids would be any different, if they are raised to support the All Blacks.

And by so many i mean i know two people...

Surely not, that's just depressing. My dad's a pom and I'd sooner use a Battenberg cake as a suppository than support England.