Waratahs 2017

[barbarian]

Was thinking last night, is it time for a player loan system in Super Rugby?

This would work in two ways:

- Loaning a 3rd or 4th stringer out for a season. So let's say Jake Gordon goes to the Force on loan for a year. Who loses out of that scenario? Jake gets a year of Super experience (whether it's as a starter or off the bench), while the Force get a good stop-gap 9 while they look for a longer term option.

- Borrowing a player when there is an injury crisis. So if the Tahs lose 3 hookers, they can borrow a guy like Siliva Siliva instead of grabbing someone out of club rugby.

There are plenty of issues that even I can see with this, and plenty of things that would need to be worked through.

But it might be in the best interests of Aussie rugby, ensuring talented guys don't spend whole years sitting in the stands stuck behind established Wallabies.

 

[amirite]

Quietly a bit excited for the Tahs next season. We've got a fair bit of new talent coming through - Simone is very exciting, Fitzpatrick is in form, as is Gordon and Lucas. Throw in the good form of Hanigan and Dempsey, Robertson getting test experience, and it all looks pretty good.

If you can get Viiga cheap on a development contract you're laughing, a great squad.

Then again, the Tahs' issue is never the quality of their squad.

 

[amirite]

Was thinking last night, is it time for a player loan system in Super Rugby?

This would work in two ways:

- Loaning a 3rd or 4th stringer out for a season. So let's say Jake Gordon goes to the Force on loan for a year. Who loses out of that scenario? Jake gets a year of Super experience (whether it's as a starter or off the bench), while the Force get a good stop-gap 9 while they look for a longer term option.

- Borrowing a player when there is an injury crisis. So if the Tahs lose 3 hookers, they can borrow a guy like Siliva Siliva instead of grabbing someone out of club rugby.

There are plenty of issues that even I can see with this, and plenty of things that would need to be worked through.

But it might be in the best interests of Aussie rugby, ensuring talented guys don't spend whole years sitting in the stands stuck behind established Wallabies.

The Force lose, they become a dumping ground for development players with a high turn over. I just can't see much life and passion behind a team that's an also ran (they might seem that way in practise now, but not in theory).

Connacht was used as a development team for ages by Ireland and it never worked really.

 

[Lindommer]

I thought the same thing myself a few years ago, b, when the Reds were losing flyhalves like, well, flies and the Brumbies had more than enough 10s. The same scenario's going to occur in 2017 at the Force for both rakes and scrummies. Someone put up a theoretical drafted squad for our five Super Rugby sides a few years ago where there was an established player followed by a few promising youngsters in every position. It looked good, on paper.

In this instance maybe the ARU could use a bit on influence to encourage 2s and 9s to make the trek across the Nullabor. The suggestion on the blog for Lucas to captain the Force rather than ride the pine at the Tahs is an excellent one: Lucas gets game time and we get to see how good Gordon could be. Same for rakes, Latu, Roach and Fitzpatrick all at the Tahs results in one player twiddling his thumbs when he should be playing.

 

[Braveheart81]

- Loaning a 3rd or 4th stringer out for a season. So let's say Jake Gordon goes to the Force on loan for a year. Who loses out of that scenario? Jake gets a year of Super experience (whether it's as a starter or off the bench), while the Force get a good stop-gap 9 while they look for a longer term option.

The problem is that if you loan Jake Gordon to another team (and he's your third choice halfback), as soon as there is an injury for even a week he is in your matchday 23 and you need him.

If he has been on loan then he hasn't been training with your side and you're now at a disadvantage heading into the game where he'll be needed.

I just don't see it being possible with squads that are only 35 players.

It would work with larger squads but would then provide teams with a chance of warehousing more players and loaning them out to teams that are desperate to let someone else pay their salary and develop them.

 

[Wilson]

Wessels proposed a loan system a few weeks ago but stiles and Gibson both shot it down because of player depth. They weren't completely opposed to the idea though.

 

[barbarian]

Maybe you just have it as a 'break glass in case of emergency' style thing?

So to cover my second scenario, where it makes much more sense to recruit another Super team's 3rd stringer than it does to sift through local club rugby to find a battler.

It's an interesting discussion, though I can't see it ever happening.
.

 

[Lindommer]

If the NH clubs can sign players as injury/RWC cover maybe we can look at doing something similar here.

 

[amirite]

If the NH clubs can sign players as injury/RWC cover maybe we can look at doing something similar here.

I have no problem with signing a medical joker (maybe from the Japanese Top League?).

Anyone that thinks sending a 3rd stringer over is a no-brainer has not seen a club struggle to find 30 guys for an opposed run mid-season.

 

[Braveheart81]

Damien Fitzpatrick's signing has finally been officially confirmed.

Signed with the Tahs for two seasons.

http://www.waratahs.com.au/Waratahs...firm-return-of-hooker-Damien-Fitzpatrick.aspx

 

[Forcefield]

you could take it that way Forcefield, as the controlling body ARU sits idly by as quality players drain away without adequate replacement. With Mathewson gone (plus Alcock and Godwin to Brumbies, Mafi to Castres and Nathan Charles released) you could use both a quality halfback and good leader - you haven't even got a single hooker on the books yet! My comment was intended as a win-win option for player and club, it's not as though Perth is going to be able to produce its own talent while the east coast teams stockpile theirs. With either Jake Gordon or Matt Lucas missing out on game day and Scott Gale unsigned, the ARU should move someone West - not to mention that hookers such Hugh Roach, Robbie Abel and Siliva Siliva will also be third-stringers while the Force still contemplates resigning Tessman.

I didn't take it negatively. I thought it was funny. I have nothing against Lucas signing, although I am happy with Prior and Louwrens. We also have Angus Taylor who could consider himself very unlucky not to have made the Aus U20s this year. The funny part is- why does he need to become captain?

 

[topgun]

Keen to see us actually attempt to work Mr T into our attacking plans next season, 2015 was so frustrating to have him waiting out on the wing never getting the ball. He must have scored half of the times he actually touched the pill...

Was it Mvovo or Ndungane that he carried about 15 metres to the tryline?

 

[topgun]

I really resent our lack of resources to persuade younger players to stay in the game. heres one that looks like he's got away

http://www.couriermail.com.au/sport...s/news-story/c2924b8773e67717540b5aeb593e30ef

We just don't give substantial attention to up and coming players ready for and going through the colts system.

 

[Braveheart81]

I really resent our lack of resources to persuade younger players to stay in the game. heres one that looks like he's got away

http://www.couriermail.com.au/sport...s/news-story/c2924b8773e67717540b5aeb593e30ef

We just don't give substantial attention to up and coming players ready for and going through the colts system.

How much money can be thrown at a kid like this though?

Like Tepai Moeroa, was his exposure to rugby because he went to Newington and played rugby and actually most of his childhood sport has been based around rugby league?

Without knowing more details it's hard to say whether it's one that got away or one that only played rugby because it was the best offer at the time.

 

[topgun]

That's a fair point, but the main idea not being just those two players but the talent that silently seeps away into league, Tyson Frizzell was a union junior wasn't he?

 

[amirite]

That's a fair point, but the main idea not being just those two players but the talent that silently seeps away into league, Tyson Frizzell was a union junior wasn't he?

Yep. If I was Wales and I was completely fucked for centers post Jamie Roberts, I'd show up on his doorstep with fists full of money.

As for Australia, we have good young centers and don't need a bloke with an issue with high tackles.

 

[Mustafa]

A lot of the hype is from player agents to get a good deal. Young Polynesian players especially need to stay fit, lets see what he is like in a couple of years

 

[amirite]

The fact is I've heard of 3 or 4 young league boys refusing massive Toulon deals, but I haven't seen any league boys actually sign with them. I feel like it's a bit of BS used for contracts.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

That's a fair point, but the main idea not being just those two players but the talent that silently seeps away into league, Tyson Frizzell was a union junior wasn't he?

Yes he was - we don't have the professional set ups to retain young kids for sort of money league can offer


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[Pfitzy]

Yes he was - we don't have the professional set ups to retain young kids for sort of money league can offer

That is largely player agent influence.

And, in a way, that's where we have to say "Well, if you're chasing the money NOW, then good luck to you"

Because if a kid stuck with union long enough, and spent a couple of extra years learning their craft, a smart agent could get them signed in France for charge de la merde!