Wallabies Watch

[KevinO]

He's allowed to be considered, but it comes back to what Richo says. Out of position + debutant = no spot at 10 against the Lions. You could probably have one or the other, but certainly not both.
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10 is going to be the Lions weakest position on the field, Sexton has never really shone at international level in the same way he has for Leinster and will be coming back from injury. Farrell is still young and not proven, only two options they have for 10. I think Lilo is quite capable of playing 10 and would nearly be the best option as no one in the Lions team would know what to expect from him.

Everyone gives Deans crap for not bleeding new players, well this is a chance to do it and get a guy ready for the All Blacks and Boks. You don't give him a cap against the Lions he isn't going to get one until November, too good of a player to be keeping on the sidelines for that long.

 

[barbarian]

I'd use him off the bench as a 10/12 utility, that way you can 'blood' him without completely throwing him in at the deep end.

 

[Tomikin]

So with Barnes not being as injured as we thought, and with Cheika pointing towards him being the Waratahs 12, might we see him return to the G&G in the 12 jersey? Last time we saw him there (2009-11), he and Gits were the two best 12s in Australia, kept the 10-12 channel closed and were threats in attack by running, kicking or passing.

They said his out for 6 weeks on foxsports today broken thumb

 

[BDA]

Re Palu, firstly I think its a bit rich to suggest that he is "out of form" when he appeared to be playing pretty well before joining the injured list.

Secondly, he has shown time and again (at least in my eyes) that he belongs at test level. Not only that, but he has proven that he can come into the side with little to no warm up games (ala the Wales series last year - where he was very effective), and play the role we need him to play.

For me, without question, if he is fit he's in the starting 15 no debate. In my view the wallabies have always been best served having a big physical wrecking ball at no.8 to off-set the fact that we play a less physical style. It also helps having an extra 20kg anchoring the scrum. It's a relatively easy role for a guy of palu's size. push at scrum time, a few hit ups here and there, hurt people in defense, get substituted after 50 minutes. It's no surprise that he looks comfortable at test level. His role is pretty straight forward.

Who else can play that role?! No one!

Fotu is probably the first guy in a long time to emerge that looks like he could play that same role, which is exciting. if he continues to make an impact this year he might be a viable option at no.8.

 

[en_force_er]

Who else can play that role?! No one!

Fotu is probably the first guy in a long time to emerge that looks like he could play that same role, which is exciting. if he continues to make an impact this year he might be a viable option at no.8.

What?

 

[BDA]

What?

The emphasis goes on the word "might". We have 1 other guy that could potentially fill that same role, and that is a stretch quite frankly given that he is untested at test level and he wasn't even on anyone's radar two weeks ago. But in theory, physically he fits the criteria of what im looking for for a wallabies no.8. Its a wait and see with Fotu i think.

 

[en_force_er]

The emphasis goes on the word "might". We have 1 other guy that could potentially fill that same role, and that is a stretch quite frankly given that he is untested at test level and he wasn't even on anyone's radar two weeks ago. But in theory, physically he fits the criteria of what im looking for for a wallabies no.8. Its a wait and see with Fotu i think.

I don't think it's too dour. If we look at a back row as a sum of it's parts then in 1 or 2 years time we could easily be fielding a back row of Quirk at 6 and Higgers at 8. They'd go alright, we'd also have a pretty impressive lineout.

 

[qwerty51]

I think there's a bit to consider with Fotu. He appears to be a worse lineout option than Palu (big deal against the Lions) and doesn't play at the back of the scrum with the Brumbies. Palu has a lot of Test experience at the back of scrums, especially those under pressure.

 

[Merrow]

You have to have new players in at some stage. Personally I'd rather get a couple of newbies in for the Lions so they're ready for the AB's. When's Palu back from his latest injury?

 

[qwerty51]

You have to have new players in at some stage.

Definitely and I don't think a Lions series is any time for experimentation or big change. We have little preparation as it is.

Personally I'd rather get a couple of newbies in for the Lions so they're ready for the AB's. When's Palu back from his latest injury?

So you're prioritising the Bled over the Lions? I think that's very wrong.

 

[en_force_er]

I think there's a bit to consider with Fotu. He appears to be a worse lineout option than Palu (big deal against the Lions) and doesn't play at the back of the scrum with the Brumbies. Palu has a lot of Test experience at the back of scrums, especially those under pressure.

Higgers is great at the back and he'll probably be our 6 (to the point that the Rebels are considering playing him at 8 on their feed), even Dennis is pretty good at the back.

Fotu could easily play an 8's role but bind at 6 on attacking scrums. That's no issue.

As for lineouts that's problematic but even the ABs are only playing tests with 3 good jumping options nowadays.

 

[qwerty51]

If we play Higgers or Dennis at the back of the scrum I think it will be a shambles. They don't add the type of weight Cliffy does there nor have the experience at dealing with the ball delivery once under pressure at that level. What I will concede is Mowen playing 8 there as from what I've noticed he does a pretty good job, although the Brumbies have been using Smith.

 

[BDA]

It's definitely all about finding the right balance.

I've posted my views a few time on this board in relation to S Timani. A lot of people have shot down his inclusion in the lions tour due to his poor lineout work. but if you played, for instance, Mowen and Higgers at 8 and 6, then Timani at lock probably balances out the pack well. I suppose i am very conscious of the physical battle and the importance of not being pushed around. it becomes even more important when your scrum is probably not a strong as some going around. Guys like Timani and Palu have value if you surround them with the right mix of players.

 

[KevinO]

Definitely and I don't think a Lions series is any time for experimentation or big change. We have little preparation as it is.



So you're prioritising the Bled over the Lions? I think that's very wrong.

Well if I was a Aussie supporter I would really want to win the Bledisloe seeing it's only been 10 years since it returned to Australia, you got the Lions trophy in the cabinet for the last 12 years.

Beating the Lions is one thing but they are still a combined tour side, but winning the Bledisloe at the moment is stripping the World Champs of one of the titles they really hold close to there heart.

 

[Scoey]

So you're prioritising the Bled over the Lions? I think that's very wrong.

They're not too dissimilar. We haven't won the Lions series in twelve years and haven't won the Bledisloe in eleven years. Just sayin'

 

[qwerty51]

It's definitely all about finding the right balance.

I've posted my views a few time on this board in relation to S Timani. A lot of people have shot down his inclusion in the lions tour due to his poor lineout work. but if you played, for instance, Mowen and Higgers at 8 and 6, then Timani at lock probably balances out the pack well. I suppose i am very conscious of the physical battle and the importance of not being pushed around. it becomes even more important when your scrum is probably not a strong as some going around. Guys like Timani and Palu have value if you surround them with the right mix of players.

Without a doubt re Timani and the scrum, only have to look at the difference between the Tahs scrum on the weekend when he was on and then went off.

They're not too dissimilar. We haven't won the Lions series in twelve years and haven't won the Bledisloe in eleven years. Just sayin'

In that sense yes but you play the Lions every 12 years, you get an opportunity for the Bled every year.

 

[RoffsChoice]

They're not too dissimilar. We haven't won the Lions series in twelve years and haven't won the Bledisloe in eleven years. Just sayin'

I'm with qwerty on this one, if we lose, we don't get it back for 12 years. Not saying I don't want the Bledisloe, I'd just rather keep the Lions then lose it for the Bledisloe.

 

[Richo]

Not to state the bleeding obvious, but the very fact that a Lions tour comes around once every 12 years is why it matters so much.

 

[KevinO]

But winning the Bledisloe means you are beating the best team in the World, that will always stand higher than beating a tour side made up of 4 teams. Two of them ranked outside the top 8.

You have won against the Lions 2 times in 8 series.

Bledisloe is 12 times in 52 attempts.

Actually means you find it had to beat NZ for the Bledisloe than the Lions when you break down the numbers, only marginally but NZ is tougher to win.

 

[gel]

South Africa beat the Lions 2-1 and New Zealand beat the Lions 3-0 which would indicate that they are more difficult opposition than the Lions. Therefore it could be argued that we should not blood any new players against those two instead as that would be throwing the new guys to the wolves.

There are plenty of guys who have debuted against the Lions in the past. Why so hesitant today?

*edit* I am not stating anything about importance here - I am strictly addressing the hesitancy towards debuting a player against the Lions.