Wallabies 2025

[Wilson]

Ignoring the shot at Larkham, Dru, otherwise I am saying exactly the same thing about Kiss. He needs to achieve more at Super Rugby level before he is at the head of the list of coaches in this country. There are in fact quite a few posters here and on the Roar site who are very vocal about Les being the annointed one just because he has worked with Joe previously.

As far as here goes, I think you're confusing people trying to explain why RA are seem to be looking at Les Kiss first (based on a decent weight of reporting) with people campaigning for him as the next wallabies coach above all others.

As far as the roar comments go, they couldn't be more irrelevant to this discussion.

 

[Derpus]

Ignoring the shot at Larkham, Dru, otherwise I am saying exactly the same thing about Kiss. He needs to achieve more at Super Rugby level before he is at the head of the list of coaches in this country. There are in fact quite a few posters here and on the Roar site who are very vocal about Les being the annointed one just because he has worked with Joe previously.

I mean Kiss may well be the head of the list of coaches in the country having achieved nothing and therein lies the problem. We don't have a coaching pathway.

 

[Braveheart81]

My case study for this is (shocker) the All Blacks. They went from Henry (Ast. Hansen), to Hansen (Ast. Foster), to Foster - and say all you like about Fozzie relative to his predecessors, but what I would give for a Wallabies coach to have a 70% win record. I don't necessarily think it automatically means that the Wallabies become one dimensional for a decade, or that there is no evolution in the team either.

The All Blacks won two RWCs in a row in 2011 and 2015 but have then stumbled a bit and they're no longer the dominant team in World Rugby.

It's impossible to tell what the best option would have been for them because you can't observe the thing they didn't do but have they ended up creating the best possible outcome?

You could argue that they have done an incredibly good job of preserving the status quo through succession planning while other teams have evolved and moved to a new level.

It definitely works both ways. The All Blacks enjoyed huge continuity of having very good experienced assistant coaches for a long time because the opportunity to progress to being the head coach was there and was rewarded (eventually). There's no way they retain Hansen and Foster for that long if they didn't see themselves as ultimately being appointed the head coach.

 

[Wilson]

Gleeson dropped from the first wallabies camp, CHarlie Cale replaces him:

https://www.theroar.com.au/2025/01/09/exclusive-wallaby-shunned-by-schmidt-at-first-camp-of-2025-after-signing-with-overseas-club/

Don't mind this from Schmidt, sends a very clear message. Hopefully buys RA a bit more time to get the TV deal done before anyone else signs OS.

 

[PhilClinton]

I mean Kiss may well be the head of the list of coaches in the country having achieved nothing and therein lies the problem. We don't have a coaching pathway.

Is there anything more Australian than wanting to follow the bloke who comes across as genuine and 'one of the boys'?

Per their actual resumes - someone like Michael Cheika would be far more qualified to step into the role of Wallabies Coach, but I think we all know the rugby public think it would be a bad choice because of his personality.

Mal Meninga was severely under qualified to coach the QLD SOO team, but he was a natural leader and it helped that the team contained a half dozen of the best players in the world. I don't know if the Wallabies player stocks are quite at that level.

 

[The Ghost of Raelene]

Gleeson dropped from the first wallabies camp, CHarlie Cale replaces him:

https://www.theroar.com.au/2025/01/09/exclusive-wallaby-shunned-by-schmidt-at-first-camp-of-2025-after-signing-with-overseas-club/

Don't mind this from Schmidt, sends a very clear message. Hopefully buys RA a bit more time ti get the TV deal done before anyone else signs OS.

No problem with the messaging but I don't think it will stop any player from accepting an offer.

Is there anything more Australian than wanting to follow the bloke who comes across as genuine and 'one of the boys'?

Per their actual resumes - someone like Michael Cheika would be far more qualified to step into the role of Wallabies Coach, but I think we all know the rugby public think it would be a bad choice because of his personality.

Mal Meninga was severely under qualified to coach the QLD SOO team, but he was a natural leader and it helped that the team contained a half dozen of the best players in the world. I don't know if the Wallabies player stocks are quite at that level.

We need a coach. Not a man manager right now. That could change if the core group of the side continue to develop and get to that 50-60 Test stage but right now they need the Xs & Os. So do our domestic coaches. They need to be drilled from the top as well and make them better which flows on over the next decade.

 

[Wilson]

No problem with the messaging but I don't think it will stop any player from accepting an offer.

Not so much stop as delay (until RA have more room to move and hopefully money to offer) - we're talking about contracts that don't start until after the EOYT, so the front line wallabies players who have some degree of negotiating power would be risking something unnecessarily in signing early. Mid-tier and fringe guys not as much, they may feel need to jump on a good offer earlier.

 

[Dctarget]

It's a bit rough to release Gleeson since we're considering taking Skelton, Kerevi and in theory any NH player who kills it this year.

 

[The Ghost of Raelene]

If Gleeson is the best player in the comp come the Lions he'll be picked.

I can get it right now though. Get your point though.

 

[stillmissit]

I don't have a problem with Schmidt's decision, rather have Charlie Cale in there anyway. If Gleeson was as great as many hoped he didn't show it in his Wallaby time, a good enough bench player but hardly a world beater. I'm very interested in how Charlie Cale develops this season.

Regarding this decision, I agree with DC. He will play if he is outstanding (and there are injuries). If not, I hope he does well in France.

 

[rugbyAU]

We do have Wright, Leota and Cale coming back from injury for the #20 jersey

 

[Derpus]

It's a bit rough to release Gleeson since we're considering taking Skelton, Kerevi and in theory any NH player who kills it this year.

Those blokes have a few more runs on the board.

 

[Strewthcobber]

Always an interesting dynamic when a coach who hasn't/won't sign for next year doesn't select a player who hasn't/won't sign for next year

 

[stillmissit]

Always an interesting dynamic when a coach who hasn't/won't sign for next year doesn't select a player who hasn't/won't sign for next year

Slightly different dynamic Strewth, one is planning for the future of Australian rugby and the other is looking after his future.

 

[The Ghost of Raelene]

Would be interested to know if the same actions would have taken place had it been a genuine starter.

 

[Mick The Munch]

Nah...Tom Hooper would star.............ah sheet

 

[stillmissit]

Would be interested to know if the same actions would have taken place had it been a genuine starter.

Ah! Reality striking idealism.

 

[stillmissit]

The great thing is Schmidt didn't have to risk much, all of us know there are good prospects in the backrow, Leota, Cale, Hooper et al. Had it been 10, centre or full-back would have been interesting.

 

[dru]

It's a bit rough to release Gleeson since we're considering taking Skelton, Kerevi and in theory any NH player who kills it this year.

I checked the Squad of 40, correct if if I am wrong, but I couldn't find either Skelton or Kerevi on the list. If right, Schmidt is being entirely consistent.

 

[Wilson]

Worth noting that Gleeson doesn't meet the current Giteau law threshold as it stands - 30 test caps/5 years at Super. While they could absolutely turn around tomorrow and remove the restriction they haven't, and leaving Gleeson out is in line with other recent departures like Perese and Swinton.