Super Rugby 2022

[Wilson]

First two games have been rescheduled:

This will see them play two mid-week games against the Blues at Mt Smart Stadium on Tuesday 29 March and the Chiefs at FMG Stadium Waikato on Tuesday 12 April.

...

Moana Pasifika will now have the bye round in Round 8, which sits inbetween the two mid-week games.

The rescheduled matches ensure the Highlanders' Round 9 match against the Hurricanes at Forsyth Barr Stadium will be moved forward a day.

I assume that Highlanders v Hurricanes game moves forward a day so the Moana v Cheifs game in round 9 can slide to the 16th. With no other changes to the draw mentioned the turn around times look like this:

​

Game​	Turn Around​
Moana v Blues 29th March​	4 days Moana, 3 days Blues​
Blues v Moana 2nd April​	4 days both teams​
Chiefs v Moana 12th April​	3 days Chiefs​
Moana v Chiefs 16th* April​	4 days both teams​

Did not think 3 day turn arounds would be acceptable. I guess it's slightly alleviated by the teams generally sharing the same or similar turn arounds. Not sure where the Hurricanes game will fit in.

 

[Dan54]

Yep seems tough especially for MP (Moana Pasifika) who have multiple midweek games. but guessing it is best of bad situation!

 

[Wilson]

Yep seems tough especially for MP (Moana Pasifika) who have multiple midweek games. but guessing it is best of bad situation!

It doesn't even look like that at the moment to be honest. I'm also a bit confused by those turn around times, I thought world rugby mandated a minimum 4 days between games, so unless there are more games to be shifted on the schedule I don't see how it works.

 

[waiopehu oldboy]

^ Two of MP (Moana Pasifika)'s catch-up games have been announced:

"Moana Pasifika will now meet the Blues at Mt Smart Stadium on Tuesday, March 29, and the Chiefs in Hamilton Waikato on Tuesday, April 12."

Presumably they're working on 'canes match as we speak.

 

[Joe King]

Are there ever any fights in NZ games? Even a scuffle? I'm not wanting one, just curious. I know I've bought this up before, but I don't think anyone gave me a satisfactory answer. From my observation, there's a lot less spite in NZ games, and the potential for a fight to break out seems non-existent compared to Oz games. Am I imagining things? Why is that? Certainly no less passion in the NZ games. What is it? Do Oz and NZ teams direct their energy differently or something? Very curious.

 

[PhilClinton]

Let’s be honest, there are no real ‘fights’ in Oz rugby either.

A couple of private school boys grabbing collars and calling each other wankers is about as far as it goes.

 

[dru]

Let’s be honest, there are no real ‘fights’ in Oz rugby either.

A couple of private school boys grabbing collars and calling each other wankers is about as far as it goes.

There is more dirty dog growling in Oz. Seriously some of those growls are menacing. There is also a lot of "Call that a non-punch? Try this!" As they shake jerseys.

Those Kiwis, honestly it's powder fluff. Our blokes growl.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

I am back to old problem of enjoying our oz Comp games with Drua included and importantly improving. But can’t help but start to feel this enjoyment about to be rapidly diminished and quickly forgotten when we play the kiwi teams.

 

[dru]

I am back to old problem of enjoying our oz Comp games with Drua included and importantly improving. But can’t help but start to feel this enjoyment about to be rapidly diminished and quickly forgotten when we play the kiwi teams.

Yep. BUT. We've got the best chance we can. Our top teams are going to enter the TT with more points than the top teams in NZ. We have a domestic comp to build our abilities before we have to meet the Kiwis. We have a silly skewed cut off for the finals.

All these things work for us and make the casual Kiwi observer question what is going on (correctly).

Of course, we don't have a level playing field with talent in the comp, and we don't have an equitable cash return for money coming in and it's division between one side of the TT and the other.

I would still prefer to run our own show. But in a skewed TT comp, short of separating formally domestic and TT, this is as good as it gets.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

Yep. BUT. We've got the best chance we can. Our top teams are going to enter the TT with more points than the top teams in NZ. We have a domestic comp to build our abilities before we have to meet the Kiwis. We have a silly skewed cut off for the finals.

All these things work for us and make the casual Kiwi observer question what is going on (correctly).

Of course, we don't have a level playing field with talent in the comp, and we don't have an equitable cash return for money coming in and it's division between one side of the TT and the other.

I would still prefer to run our own show. But in a skewed TT comp, short of separating formally domestic and TT, this is as good as it gets.

I feel Dru that because the relevant bodies put their head in the sand and won’t resolve this elephant in the room (lack of equalisation of talent in closed borders competition) the continued imbalance of kiwi vs oz teams competitiveness means we will have no choice but to do our own domestic competition.

it is getting really silly playing out this super rugby competition year on year that continues to give other footy codes in oz a free hit at the expense of rugby. Just utter madness…

 

[Dan54]

Are there ever any fights in NZ games? Even a scuffle? I'm not wanting one, just curious. I know I've bought this up before, but I don't think anyone gave me a satisfactory answer. From my observation, there's a lot less spite in NZ games, and the potential for a fight to break out seems non-existent compared to Oz games. Am I imagining things? Why is that? Certainly no less passion in the NZ games. What is it? Do Oz and NZ teams direct their energy differently or something? Very curious.

There no fighting in any rugby anymore. I haven't seen a proper scrap in rugby in 20 years!

 

[Joe King]

Let’s be honest, there are no real ‘fights’ in Oz rugby either.

A couple of private school boys grabbing collars and calling each other wankers is about as far as it goes.

There is still an observable difference though, don't you think?

 

[Joe King]

I am back to old problem of enjoying our oz Comp games with Drua included and importantly improving. But can’t help but start to feel this enjoyment about to be rapidly diminished and quickly forgotten when we play the kiwi teams.

The thing I'll miss the most is the rivalry between teams like the Brumbies and Reds. Won't be the same if one of them is mid-ladder.

It's possible for an OZ team to win Super Rugby with 5 teams (cf. Waratahs in 2014). But it may be few and far between. The real 'danger' is that for Oz fans, it will feel like your team losing 2-3 times in the one weekend, not just once. That's because most fans don't just follow one Oz team, but any Oz team playing a kiwi team. I'm sure it would be the other way round as well.

Having said all that, if there was a way to make 5 Oz teams competitive enough to win (through contractual stability, more games for Super Rugby teams in the back end of the year or an NRC, building cohesion, etc), then it would be a gigantic win for Oz rugby and SRP (Super Rugby Pacific). Question is, can it be done? Won't know until it's tested.

The reason 5 teams works better for NZ is because they have more talent in their system. If a player's skill level is ranked out of 10, then NZ have more 8/10's within their teams, while Oz has more 6's and 7's in their teams. The NPC effectively builds this talent for them.

 

[Dismal Pillock]

Our top teams are going to enter the TT with more points than the top teams in NZ.

Don't want to address the elephant in the room by pointing out this may be related to Aus sides having not played NZ sides yet b

 

[Rugbynutter39]

The thing I'll miss the most is the rivalry between teams like the Brumbies and Reds. Won't be the same if one of them is mid-ladder.

It's possible for an OZ team to win Super Rugby with 5 teams (cf. Waratahs in 2014). But it may be few and far between. The real 'danger' is that for Oz fans, it will feel like your team losing 2-3 times in the one weekend, not just once. That's because most fans don't just follow one Oz team, but any Oz team playing a kiwi team. I'm sure it would be the other way round as well.

Having said all that, if there was a way to make 5 Oz teams competitive enough to win (through contractual stability, more games for Super Rugby teams in the back end of the year or an NRC, building cohesion, etc), then it would be a gigantic win for Oz rugby and SRP (Super Rugby Pacific). Question is, can it be done? Won't know until it's tested.

The reason 5 teams works better for NZ is because they have more talent in their system. If a player's skill level is ranked out of 10, then NZ have more 8/10's within their teams, while Oz has more 6's and 7's in their teams. The NPC effectively builds this talent for them.

At this point it can’t work with 5 oz teams against 5 kiwi teams in a closed border competition for teams. Chicken and egg…you have to have the product to attract fans and talent to grow the game against heavy competition from rival oz footy codes. Yes I advocate the franchise model with quotas (ie can have x number of players from other super rugby nations who can still represent their national side). Others favour domestic pro competition and others favour domestic competition with champions league with kiwi and Japan teams.

What ever option you favour it can’t be the current status quo, and I hence would prefer any of the above 3 options.

 

[dru]

At this point it can’t work with 5 oz teams against 5 kiwi teams in a closed border competition for teams. Chicken and egg…you have to have the product to attract fans and talent to grow the game against heavy competition from rival oz footy codes. Yes I advocate the franchise model with quotas (ie can have x number of players from other super rugby nations who can still represent their national side). Others favour domestic pro competition and others favour domestic competition with champions league with kiwi and Japan teams.

What ever option you favour it can’t be the current status quo, and I hence would prefer any of the above 3 options.

The reason I favour a domestic comp is simply because NZ has shown no interest in being supportive of your franchise planning. It leaves few alternative to a) kicking the can down the road (what we have in Super Pacific); or b) domestic and disconnection with NZ below international level.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

The reason UI favour a domestic comp is simply because NZ has shown no interest in being supportive of your franchise planning. It leaves few alternative to a) kicking the can down the road (what we have in Super Pacific); or b) domestic and disconnection with NZ below international level.

Yep - if nzru won’t move on this pretty clear what the options are. But I also appreciate regardless of whether RA wanted to do this it would take money. PE deal, lions tour and RWC 27 all provide the opportunity to fill the coffers to fund this. I still have some ‘small’ hope nzru will come around to a better compromise in realising RA won’t cut teams to just meet nzru interests. In the meantime I think we will continue to muddle along with super rugby pacific for a couple more years.

 

[Joe King]

At this point it can’t work with 5 oz teams against 5 kiwi teams in a closed border competition for teams. Chicken and egg…you have to have the product to attract fans and talent to grow the game against heavy competition from rival oz footy codes. Yes I advocate the franchise model with quotas (ie can have x number of players from other super rugby nations who can still represent their national side). Others favour domestic pro competition and others favour domestic competition with champions league with kiwi and Japan teams.

What ever option you favour it can’t be the current status quo, and I hence would prefer any of the above 3 options.

There are other ways to make the Oz teams more competitive, which don't rely on first growing the game and talent from other codes.

It may not be enough, but that hasn't been tested yet.

 

[Eyes and Ears]

I would love to see a 16 team comp with an 8 team finals series (works well in 2 other sports). 8 NZ, 5 from Aust plus MP (Moana Pasifika), Drua and 1 from Japan (or a minor variation on this).

However I would drop Japan if the travel is too much.

 

[PhilClinton]

I would love to see a 16 team comp with an 8 team finals series (works well in 2 other sports). 8 NZ, 5 from Aust plus MP (Moana Pasifika), Drua and 1 from Japan (or a minor variation on this).

However I would drop Japan if the travel is too much.

I'm not sure how well Australian audiences would engage with this from a viewership perspective.