Reds 2018

[Scrubber2050]

sorry trying to answer my own question.

Family moved here at the end of 2010, he was contracted to the Brumbies from QLD in 2013. Made his debut for them in 2014. Moved back to SAF in 2015.

But does that 3 years in Oz make him eligible for selection>?

Why would you even ask ?

 

[Braveheart81]

sorry trying to answer my own question.

Family moved here at the end of 2010, he was contracted to the Brumbies from QLD in 2013. Made his debut for them in 2014. Moved back to SAF in 2015.

But does that 3 years in Oz make him eligible for selection>?

The World Rugby regulations say that the 36 months needs to be completed immediately before the time of playing.

I thought they were Aussie citizens but that in itself doesn't make you eligible. There's a possibility he could be an Aussie citizen but not eligible to represent the Wallabies.

 

[upthereds#!]

Ruan Smith left the Sunwolves for personal reasons (I thought I read). Was surprised to see him dressed in the formal Reds outfit (white shirt, reds tie etc) doing the line of handshakes at the end of the Reds v Brumbies game.

 

[Sully]

I think I heard there was a family illness. They live on the sunny coast. Looks like the Reds picked him up.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk

 

[upthereds#!]

Good pickup. With Manu around as well. Not actually bad depth

 

[Zero_Cool]

sorry trying to answer my own question.

Family moved here at the end of 2010, he was contracted to the Brumbies from QLD in 2013. Made his debut for them in 2014. Moved back to SAF in 2015.

But does that 3 years in Oz make him eligible for selection>?

My understanding is it doesn't given he's broken that 3 years of residency, it needs to be 3 years of residency before the selection, not 3 years at some point in my life. I recall there being issues with a South African in Ireland or Scotland or something.
But regardless I don't think Cheika would pick Smith, he'll go with Tom Robinson... because ... reasons.

 

[emuarse]

My understanding is it doesn't given he's broken that 3 years of residency, it needs to be 3 years of residency before the selection, not 3 years at some point in my life. I recall there being issues with a South African in Ireland or Scotland or something.
But regardless I don't think Cheika would pick Smith, he'll go with Tom Robinson. because . reasons.

Luv child?

 

[Brumby Runner]

I think I heard there was a family illness. They live on the sunny coast. Looks like the Reds picked him up.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk

Always thought Ruan was the better player of the two, though by all accounts JP is having a very strong beginning to the year. It would be a bonus if either or both were eligible. Incidentally, saw a photo of JP playing v the Brumbies. He's had his hair cut and now (unsurprisingly) looks the image of Ruan.

 

[fish59]

sorry trying to answer my own question.

Family moved here at the end of 2010, he was contracted to the Brumbies from QLD in 2013. Made his debut for them in 2014. Moved back to SAF in 2015.

But does that 3 years in Oz make him eligible for selection>?

I think his family moved here earlier than that (2006?)- JP and Ruan spent a year or so at Toowoomba Grammar but went back to SA to finish school

 

[jimmydubs]

I thought they were Aussie citizens but that in itself doesn't make you eligible. There's a possibility he could be an Aussie citizen but not eligible to represent the Wallabies.

Really?
Pocock went back to zim for a bit is he now not eligible?

 

[Braveheart81]

Really?
Pocock went back to zim for a bit is he now not eligible?

He is already a Wallaby. Of course he is eligible to continue playing for the Wallabies.

If you aren't eligible via the birth, parent or grand parent rule and need to rely on residency then you need to play immediately after fulfilling the residency requirement.

Citizenship is not relevant for the qualifications because it isn't uniform from country to country.

 

[mst]

Both emigrated in 2010 and are Australian citizens (did the citizenship thing while at the Brumbies 2015/ early 16'ish). Ruan played for the Force then Brumbies (2012-2016) then played in Japan. I think he might be eligible. JP only had about 3yrs in the Brumbies / Vikings set up then recently has played is SA @Western Province / Stormers. Unsure where that puts him.

 

[Braveheart81]

Both emigrated in 2010 and are Australian citizens (did the citizenship thing while at the Brumbies 2015/ early 16'ish). Ruan played for the Force then Brumbies (2012-2016) then played in Japan. I think he might be eligible. JP only had about 3yrs in the Brumbies / Vikings set up then recently has played is SA @Western Province / Stormers. Unsure where that puts him.

If you are relying on qualifying under the residency qualification and you leave, doesn't it break the residency and you need to start again?

Unless they had played for a team tying them to Australian rugby (Australia, Australia A, Aussie 7s), I don't see how they remain qualified.

 

[Zero_Cool]

If you are relying on qualifying under the residency qualification and you leave, doesn't it break the residency and you need to start again?

This is my understanding, I'm not 100% sure if you have to completely start over or if there is some kind of 'discount' or something but in 90% of cases they get capped pretty quick for some scrub match somewhere.

 

[mst]

If you are relying on qualifying under the residency qualification and you leave, doesn't it break the residency and you need to start again?

Unless they had played for a team tying them to Australian rugby (Australia, Australia A, Aussie 7s), I don't see how they remain qualified.

Yep. I agree and that's why I am unsure about either.

 

[Wilson]

Section 17 of world rugby regulation 8:

17. Does the 36 month period of Residence have to immediately precede
playing for a Union?

Save in exceptional circumstances, the 36 months Residence will be
expected to have been completed consecutively and be achieved
immediately before the Player represents a Union. This is designed to
create a contemporary national link with the country of the Union
concerned. This factor will be particularly significant if a Player has
moved to make a “new” country his Residence having been Resident in
another country previously. In essence, in such circumstances, the Player,
as well as demonstrating his commitment to a new country, must also be
(and seen to be) relinquishing his ties with the country in which he lived
previously. For the avoidance of any doubt, seeking to rely on short
periods of Residence as a child in a particular country, combined with a
short period of Residence in that same country prior to playing for a
Union, is likely to create a link that would be too tenuous to satisfy the
underlying intentions of establishing a contemporary, permanent, national
link with a Union. However, each case will be assessed on its overall
merits to establish if a Player is able to demonstrate a genuine, close,
credible and established national link by reference to the amount of time
the Player can demonstrate that he has treated the “new” country as his
home and other relevant factors.

So there is provision for the period not being immediately prior to playing. The citizenship should help and if he hadn't returned to south Africa it looks like he'd be a pretty good shot of an exemption, but because it was a country he otherwise qualifies for he probably won't get it. At least that's my reading of the above.

It does look like Ruan would qualify, the time in Japan probably wouldn't be too detrimental. Not that I'm advocating it, but I wonder if Ruan getting capped for the wallabies would add weight to JP's claim.

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

 

[jimmydubs]

He is already a Wallaby. Of course he is eligible to continue playing for the Wallabies.

If you aren't eligible via the birth, parent or grand parent rule and need to rely on residency then you need to play immediately after fulfilling the residency requirement.

Citizenship is not relevant for the qualifications because it isn't uniform from country to country.

Fair enough but if they aren’t wallabies eligible then they aren’t eligible for anyone which seems a strange boat to be in and I would’ve thought that boat didn’t exist.

 

[TOCC]

Fair enough but if they aren’t wallabies eligible then they aren’t eligible for anyone which seems a strange boat to be in and I would’ve thought that boat didn’t exist.

That boat doesn’t exist, unless you Tom Hanks in The Terminal and your country ceases to exist or be recognised

 

[Strewthcobber]

Fair enough but if they aren’t wallabies eligible then they aren’t eligible for anyone which seems a strange boat to be in and I would’ve thought that boat didn’t exist.

They are eligible for South Africa (at least, depending on parents/grandparents) right?

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

 

[Braveheart81]

Fair enough but if they aren’t wallabies eligible then they aren’t eligible for anyone which seems a strange boat to be in and I would’ve thought that boat didn’t exist.

They are eligible for their country of birth, countries of their parents birth and countries of their grandparents birth.

Every single one of those might be South Africa, but theoretically they could each be eligible for 7 different countries.