NSW U16 Trial Games and Selections 2011

[Man on the hill]

MOTH,

On another subject, what is your prediction for Regionals based upon the published 'Player Lists' (or 'BALANCE SHEETS' as I have now come to synically refer to them ... lmao).

I'm no where near as tuned up on the individual players as many others on this site, but I can't help but think that MSZ are making up the numbers. Like many others I think the barbarians might be the good value roughie bet - call it the brumbie factor. I know there was a stack of carry on about ratios of players from Gordon & parramatta - I watched the final, wasn't making detailed notes, but I only recall that a handful of boys were deadset standouts from either team. When did you play at the rede?

 

[Malcsy]

CHS blew any chance by their backline trying to play to fancy too early; inside passes, run arounds, cut out passes, this lead to drop ball - GPS break outs and the score blew out. Left at half-time.

Robbie Wolfgram - sorry, seems badly overweight for a boy I heard so much about.

Pitbull - goes ok but hard to have a real opinion due to the AICES team struggling.

I expect the bull to shine next weekend when he is playing in a stronger team. He will also be with the other players mentioned with the bizarre omission of Max Cook.

Having looked at CTPE's list again, its amazing how many talented boys are missing, e.g. Tepai, Brent Whicker, Jake Roberts, the injured Troy, the list could go on... Reminds you how much talent is around in this age group.

CTPE, I also note you have David Morris as a reserve. Would be interested to hear your take on him. I find him to be a top quality player and also a leader.

 

[Newbie]

Right Again!

I believe Parramatta advises their contracted SG ball players to only play school footie after that comp finishes - no club footie.

Parramatta advising their 'CONTRACTED' players to refrain from club league ... where did you hear such a slanderous rumour from ... lmao! Never would such an notion ever be countenanced, there would be an outcry from the clubs. BTW I have been led to believe that Parramatta are not the only club that engage in this behaviour, but it cannot be proved as all directions are off the record! And it is all 'HEARSAY' anyway ... lmao!

In saying that I would suggest that the Leaguies, if they ever did engage in such conduct, would have just cause for doing so! Unlike Rugby there is a distinct lack of proper policing with respect to foul play and the like within junior league, and it is generally the case that HM and SG Ball representatives become the 'ON FIELD' targets of players of lesser ability who are looking to make a name for themselves by taking out such representatives. Thuggery would be the operative word!

Regards,
Newbie.

 

[Newbie]

Under 16's Playing Up!

Leaving Kellaway aside, I was surprised to see some other U/16 boys in the opens competiton this year. Notwithstanding the fact that they represented themselves with distinction, I would have preferred to see them to play within their own age group. For me there is a huge difference between 16 and 18 year old boys, irrespective of how tall or how much the 16 year olds weigh.

I would have like to have seen a lad called Taane Milne play. He goes to Randwick Boys and to his credit he made the NSW Shadow Squad. Used to play club rugby but now plays league (only playing rugby at school now). Made the NSWCHS and Australian U/15 league teams last year and also played in the Roosters HM team from 2010-11. Good organiser and talker on the field and is lightning quick!!

He would have brought a much needed spark to the CHS boys in their game against GPS ... oh that rights ... against President's ... lmao! Its a shame really because we won't see him at the U/16 National Champs this year and he is player that deserves to be there!

Regards,
Newbie

 

[Dingdong]

Hey Dingdong,

Heard on the grapevine the only reason the CCC No:9 got a run in the 2nd half of the final game was the selectors demanded it. He was told so and was also advised by the coaching staff that because he was only 15 years old he had taken the spot of a 16 year old (someone who would only have one shot) where he was getting two because he can go back next year.How's that for treating a player and imagine the pressure he was under - 25 minutes to show what other players had up to 130 minutes to do. Nice, hey.

The way I seen it Magy, the blonde headed kid that spent most of the time at 9 (George ??) was a much better 9. I had George as the 3rd ranked 9.The fact that the CCC 9 is a year young is impressive. I wouldn't be suprised to see him ranked much higher next year.

 

[Rugby Tragic]

Why not Morgan?

I know most have moved onto to Regionals now, however I have just finished perusing these pages and have a question for RT concerning CTPE's team selection after the School Champs, in particular the preference of Moeroa over Morgan (but not even giving Morgan a spot on the bench). Moreover I have made some comments about elite juniors and injuries sustained by them as a result of excessive game-time. I would appreciate others feedback concerning the same!

RT most in this site think Morgan played well and I agree with them. Why do you not think he deserves a spot in the team? If so why (what is your opinion based upon)? For mine he played very well all week-end, especially in the game against ISA on day 2 (where the CCC backline finally received some decent ball). Essentially Morgan had the wood on all of his opposing centres (in fact in the ISA game they were Cotton and Wolfgramm who you might know are ARU JGS members and were also selected in the NSWJRU U/15's last year).

Essentially the lad is a decent player, however I will emphatically agree with you that Moeroa is playing well below par as result of an injury. In doing so I too have noticed that he is carrying a debilitating knee injury; in fact I believe i seen him sustain (or at least exacerbate) the same at the State Champs. With respect to his injury did his mother happen to mention to why she (or Tepai’s coach) was allowing him to even play! For mine Tepai has already played a dangerously high amount of combined League and Rugby games so far this year and needs to rest out of fear of sustaining something more serious (or permanent)! This year he would have played approximately 13 games for his Parramatta HM team (which is inclusive of trials); 6 for his Rugby team, Hills; and possibly 10 or so games for his school, Newington. Add to this the State Champs, 4 games; and the School Champs just gone, 4 games. This is a combined total of approximately 37 games of football and we are only just over half way through the season!

To put what I have stated into context I had a meeting with a very experienced assistant coach from a leading NRL club couple of weeks ago and part of our discussion concerned junior elite players and the amount of football they played during the course of any given season. He subsequently informed me that it was a rule of thumb at his club that no junior elite player should be playing over 30 games of league in a year (and this was inclusive of rep, club and school). According to this man (who has served under Wayne Bennett during his coaching career) anything over 30 games a year for a junior elite player was encroaching upon the ‘VERY DANGEROUS’. It was his experience that anything in excess of 30 games a year often resulted in junior players sustaining injuries which gradually worsened if the junior did not rest, cut back, or stop playing altogether! In the end he was able to recite a list of young lads (who were touted as the next ‘Benji Marshalls’) who were not able to finish their journey to the NRL!

I know some of you will suggest that it is not a proper comparison (i.e. League vis a vis Union), however by way of analogy I believe it highlights the point I am trying to make, that is we need to look after are talented and gifted junior players and try and deliver the same to the finishing line; the ‘WALLABIES’. This then begs the following question, “is there someone within the ARU or NSWRU (or SJRU, NSWJRU, NSWSRU) monitoring the amount of game time our junior elite players a accruing?” Maybe not, and given my earlier post about their being to many self-servient rugby structures within NSW, I would not be surprised!

And now onto the Regionals. Baa Baa's to kick ass, and MSZ to be the whipping boys is my prediction!!!

Regards,
Newbie

Newbie, i agree that Morgan played well on the weekend, but for mine the GPS centre pairings and in general there whole backline were definately a cut above the rest. If your going to cut and paste players into an already cohesive backline, that really didn't show any weakness at all across the park then you have to be an excepional player. Whist i think Morgan is very good, i don't think he is exceptional. I also Agree that Tepai needs a rest to get over his knee injury. Others have tried to get him to rest it (his two blues coach) in the final of the state champs didn't play him for that reason and yes you are right that he did aggrevate it in the game against Norths at the state champs.The kid is an outstanding athlete wheather it be league,union ,shot put or discuss but plays far to much football and i'd hate to see the kid burn out long before is expiry date. I'm also lead to beleive he himself is the one who pushes himself as he doesn't want to let others down. I think its time he put himself first and let the others worry about the others.

Cheers

RT

 

[Man on the hill]

Newbie, i agree that Morgan played well on the weekend, but for mine the GPS centre pairings and in general there whole backline were definately a cut above the rest. If your going to cut and paste players into an already cohesive backline, that really didn't show any weakness at all across the park then you have to be an excepional player.
RT

Hey RT - that's not why we have selections. We need selectors who can pick the best players going around, not the best backline. Then the coaches have to coach them to play together. The players at this level are (or at least should be) very adaptable, and capable of assimilating new players, after all, the GPS backline was not the best backline from a single school!

 

[magpie4ever]

The way I seen it Magy, the blonde headed kid that spent most of the time at 9 (George ??) was a much better 9. I had George as the 3rd ranked 9.The fact that the CCC 9 is a year young is impressive. I wouldn't be suprised to see him ranked much higher next year.

My post was more to do with the off-field antics then the on-field play.

 

[rara10]

Hey RT - that's not why we have selections. We need selectors who can pick the best players going around, not the best backline. Then the coaches have to coach them to play together. The players at this level are (or at least should be) very adaptable, and capable of assimilating new players, after all, the GPS backline was not the best backline from a single school!

Is that not what GPS did Picked the talanet and the coach brought it togeather. as you said they are not from the one team yet they were outstanding and clearly the best on display.

 

[Man on the hill]

Is that not what GPS did Picked the talanet and the coach brought it togeather. as you said they are not from the one team yet they were outstanding and clearly the best on display.

Not sure what you mean in the first half, but the second half supports my argument - you must bring the best players together to build a team, rather than find a combination that works and promote it through to the final selection round regardless - at this level it is reasonable to expect boys to adapt to new combinations and playing partners and to enhance each others game.

 

[gilbertt]

anyone got any feedback on CAS 2nd rower Cameron Mee?

i think from watching the games on the weekend for u16 when watching the cas game he seems to be underrated did a lot of good things and went without accolades his workrate seems to be high and his lineout ability seems to be strong
i also heard he's in nts so he should get a look in from selectors

 

[rara10]

I would have like to have seen a lad called Taane Milne play. He goes to Randwick Boys and to his credit he made the NSW Shadow Squad. Used to play club rugby but now plays league (only playing rugby at school now). Made the NSWCHS and Australian U/15 league teams last year and also played in the Roosters HM team from 2010-11. Good organiser and talker on the field and is lightning quick!!


He would have brought a much needed spark to the CHS boys in their game against GPS ... oh that rights ... against President's ... lmao! Its a shame really because we won't see him at the U/16 National Champs this year and he is player that deserves to be there!

Regards,
Newbie

Can he not be selected for the 16s??

 

[Lee Grant]

Leaving Kellaway aside, I was surprised to see some other U/16 boys in the opens competiton this year. Notwithstanding the fact that they represented themselves with distinction, I would have preferred to see them to play within their own age group. For me there is a huge difference between 16 and 18 year old boys, irrespective of how tall or how much the 16 year olds weigh.

I would have like to have seen a lad called Taane Milne play. He goes to Randwick Boys and to his credit he made the NSW Shadow Squad. Used to play club rugby but now plays league (only playing rugby at school now).

Agree with the sentiments about the young players.

Also agree about Milne: he has it all. I thought he was outstanding for CHS IIs in the open trials. I thought he could have been a smokey for one of the NSW squads.

I had no idea that he was an U/16 qualified player and it's a pity he is going to be on the Dark Side of rugby.

 

[rara10]

Agree with the sentiments about the young players.

Also agree about Milne: he has it all. I thought he was outstanding for CHS IIs in the open trials. I thought he could have been a smokey for one of the NSW squads.

I had no idea that he was an U/16 qualified player and it's a pity he is going to be on the Dark Side of rugby.

Where does that leave J Redden???

 

[Malcsy]

Where does that leave J Redden???

Good question Rara. He is the MNZ squad so you would have to figure that SJRU would snap him up if Schools don't.

 

[rara10]

Good question Rara. He is the MNZ squad so you would have to figure that SJRU would snap him up if Schools don't.

Ok so he can be picked by schools. I thought by Newbies post about the other boy he could not be picked by schools.

 

[Malcsy]

Ok so he can be picked by schools. I thought by Newbies post about the other boy he could not be picked by schools.

I'm not sure if he can, but if he can't he has another path to the nationals

 

[Dingdong]

I've had this same discussion over the years with high level (junior) coaches, players and their parents and believe the following.
1 "horses for courses". Every kid is different. Some elite juniors can play over 60 games a year and show no signs of "burn out " These players are the ones who will be wrestling and playing footy on the sideline before their 60th game for the year. Other players who have been thru the exact same pathways can show signs of burnout much earlier. In fact I've seen plenty of kids who can't cope with much over 20 games a year.
2 I also believe it's the duty of the parents to understand their own child and recognise signs of burnout. For me the alarm bells would be ringing if your child constantly complains about going to training or isn't ethusiastic about upcoming games.
3 The pathways are such, that now players don't have to play 60 + games a year to reach the highest level. Either the club or the schools pathway can get them to the nationals.

 

[rara10]

Could not agree more it is a matter of making the choices that fit the child

 

[Man on the hill]

Could not agree more it is a matter of making the choices that fit the child

NO

It should be about having a system that protects the child from themselves – they are ill equipped to make informed decisions about what is right and then to protect the player from being improperly influenced by parents or other adults who do not necessarily have the child’s GENUINE best interest at heart.

The ARU / IRB have done about 25% of the job by placing limits on a daily basis – and the examples of that being thrown in the pan at the first opportunity is legendary.

For U16s think about it – they all play intense games at school &/or club. The majority will have played at State Junior champs on the long weekend, they just played 3 big games at school titles / selection trials, and are about to go around at the regionals this weekend – that is a huge workload for a 16 year old!

The big problem with burnout is that by the time you recognize that you are experiencing it – it’s too damn late!