Bledisloe IV 2010 Hong Kong
- Thread starter Hugh Jarse
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Lee Grant
John Eales (66)
Going on from Ruggo's quirky initiative of discussing the thread topic:
Our chance of winning is probably not as good as it was in Sydney; but one can always hope that our team will get the top few inches right collectively one day and it could be in Honkers. After all: they have illustrated their capability of beating the Blacks twice this year.
The weren't competitive in Melbourne but there was a whiff of what if Christchurch. What if warnings to NZ were converted into cards; what if we played as well in the 1st half as in the 2nd; yarda yarda.
Then we went to the RSA and we lost that game at Ellis Park. The Boks did well to come back, but our top inches were defective. But still, I thought, not bad for a game on the veld with the inexperienced team we had; not too bad. Then come the game at Bloem and it was exactly the same except for one heroic kick at goal.
But there was a trend there said the straw catching part of me - and when I saw the Kiwi team for the Sydney Bledisloe, I thought we had a great chance. By their standards is was not a cracking side - and when Kev went off early, things looked better for us.
But the top two inches and the egregious McCaw try put paid to my fondest hopes.
So that (imagined) promising trend ended and now we see a NZ team announced that is the real thing
As for the Oz team. I was at the game in Sydney and thought that Turner played like a real pro. He would have made more of defending the McCaw try notwithstanding the spurious nature of it. In my view JOC (James O'Connor) is an impact player better used from the bench. He should not be assessed on how he plays against the likes of Fiji or even South Africa if they are defending poorly. Also, his defensive qualities should form 50% of the assessment.
That was the selection I disagreed with; the rest was unexceptionable given who we had.
As always, we have to perform well when the ball is on the floor in Honkers and commit to counter-rucking when it is on the cards. And let's hope that our fellows have learned a few mental things to go along with some of the good physical stuff we have seen this year.
Maybe we can start another trend; a real one this time.
Our chance of winning is probably not as good as it was in Sydney; but one can always hope that our team will get the top few inches right collectively one day and it could be in Honkers. After all: they have illustrated their capability of beating the Blacks twice this year.
The weren't competitive in Melbourne but there was a whiff of what if Christchurch. What if warnings to NZ were converted into cards; what if we played as well in the 1st half as in the 2nd; yarda yarda.
Then we went to the RSA and we lost that game at Ellis Park. The Boks did well to come back, but our top inches were defective. But still, I thought, not bad for a game on the veld with the inexperienced team we had; not too bad. Then come the game at Bloem and it was exactly the same except for one heroic kick at goal.
But there was a trend there said the straw catching part of me - and when I saw the Kiwi team for the Sydney Bledisloe, I thought we had a great chance. By their standards is was not a cracking side - and when Kev went off early, things looked better for us.
But the top two inches and the egregious McCaw try put paid to my fondest hopes.
So that (imagined) promising trend ended and now we see a NZ team announced that is the real thing
As for the Oz team. I was at the game in Sydney and thought that Turner played like a real pro. He would have made more of defending the McCaw try notwithstanding the spurious nature of it. In my view JOC (James O'Connor) is an impact player better used from the bench. He should not be assessed on how he plays against the likes of Fiji or even South Africa if they are defending poorly. Also, his defensive qualities should form 50% of the assessment.
That was the selection I disagreed with; the rest was unexceptionable given who we had.
As always, we have to perform well when the ball is on the floor in Honkers and commit to counter-rucking when it is on the cards. And let's hope that our fellows have learned a few mental things to go along with some of the good physical stuff we have seen this year.
Maybe we can start another trend; a real one this time.
N
Newter
Guest
Lee, I'm frankly astonished they have dropped Turner. The guy was safe as houses in Sydney and, as you say, knows exactly what he's doing. Hopefully next year he, Peter Hynes and Digby Ioane will all be fit and consistently selected on the wings.
We're carrying too many passengers to beat the All Blacks today. Chisholm will jog from ruck to ruck and get there after the ball is gone, so right from the whistle we're playing a man down in the pack. Quade won't tackle near the goal line, so we're a man down in defence in the red zone. James O'Connor will miss half his tackles on the wing.
Meanwhile Van Humphries, Berrick Barnes and Rod Davies get to watch from the stands.
Gnostic
Mark Ella (57)
The problem will be Newter that the stats will not reflect this as JOC (James O'Connor) will not be in position to miss them so they will count as misses for somebody else who attempt to cover for him.
en_force_er
Geoff Shaw (53)
Davies, despite his merits is a known poor defender.
Van Humphries is untried at this level and as needs to bide his time, what little he has left.
Barnes doesn't cover either position you discussed so I don't know what you'd do with him.
I know Deans has had his highs and lows in his coaching reign but you can't knock a bloke for using players that are known quantities and trying to build some consistently in selection.
Gnostic
Mark Ella (57)
Chisholm is a well known quantity and it hasn't been stellar. Van could not do worse. I like many others wouldn't pick Davies but would definitely have picked Turner over JOC (James O'Connor). Barnes over Giteau simply on form. Giteau is most definitely not needed for his kicking and can you show me a game where the man with more crabs than a two dollar hooker has played at a level any where near the hype?
Lee Grant
John Eales (66)
Folks we should not talk about players who have played bugger all significant rugby in a long time - or in some cases, any rugby.
Thus the comments implying in some posts from time to time in this thread that the likes of Van, Hodgson, Davies, Higginbotham and Hynes should be used in big games straight off can't be taken seriously.
Thus the comments implying in some posts from time to time in this thread that the likes of Van, Hodgson, Davies, Higginbotham and Hynes should be used in big games straight off can't be taken seriously.
Lee Grant
John Eales (66)
I'd play them in the first midweek game on Tuesday week to see how they scrub up. It's nothing original and probably the same as last year, without looking it up.
But you never know: maybe there are a couple of players who haven't played for a while are training the park down in a way that indicates to Deans & Co. they can play a test from the bench. But it the absence of knowing such stuff I'll go with what I mentioned.
PS Not to any point, but I see that Higginbotham is listed as 100kgs by the ARU who must have weighed him last. I thought he was a bigger lad.
But you never know: maybe there are a couple of players who haven't played for a while are training the park down in a way that indicates to Deans & Co. they can play a test from the bench. But it the absence of knowing such stuff I'll go with what I mentioned.
PS Not to any point, but I see that Higginbotham is listed as 100kgs by the ARU who must have weighed him last. I thought he was a bigger lad.
farva
Vay Wilson (31)
Im with Lee on this. We critise Deans for chopping and changing. Then when he maintains a consistent squad we critise him for leaving out players that have yet to play at the top level.
The Bledisloe is not the place to blood new players, regardless of the odd gem we have come across from doing that in the past.
The fact that these guys are in the squad should mean game time on the tour. And that will allow us to see how they go. But against the best team in the world, lets make sure we use our best team.
The Bledisloe is not the place to blood new players, regardless of the odd gem we have come across from doing that in the past.
The fact that these guys are in the squad should mean game time on the tour. And that will allow us to see how they go. But against the best team in the world, lets make sure we use our best team.
Gnostic
Mark Ella (57)
I haven't seen anybody criticise Deans for chopping and changing, probably because he hasn't he stays firmly with those he has tried unless he cannot through injury. WHen his injured favourite returns the one in place is dropped like a hot rock no matter his performance. If the favourite is a non-performer or under performer it doesn't matter because he will still get picked if not in the run on then at least on the bench.
T
TOCC
Guest
Davies was shit defensively in the his appearances for the Reds in 2009, but so was every other member of the Reds back line that year..
He improved massively in the off season and I didn't see anything throughout the 2010 apseason to suggest he is a defensive weakness
Cutter
Nicholas Shehadie (39)
Players like Ben Alexander? The amount of time off is irrelevant. Its the perceived value of that player to the team in light of other players competing for the same position. Ioane, TPN, Horwill and Palu would be talked about (and possibly selected) if they were available notwithstanding their absences as well.
Gnostic
Mark Ella (57)
Half time and only brilliance by Cooper and Beale have Oz in this. Defence is terrible from the Wallabies. They are static and wait for the contact, no advancing line is it anywonder the attacker carry them 5 to 10 metres before either offloading or setting up quick ruck ball.
Rolland is holding the engage too long and is inconsistant with the timing between scrums. Lineout is the only bright spot for me. The ABs are very shakey at Lineout time.
Rolland is holding the engage too long and is inconsistant with the timing between scrums. Lineout is the only bright spot for me. The ABs are very shakey at Lineout time.
Q
QuadeCooperFan
Guest
wait, so Aus won?
I stopped watching with 7 minutes to go thinking NZ had it in the bag.
Good on Aus for winning.
I stopped watching with 7 minutes to go thinking NZ had it in the bag.
Good on Aus for winning.
Hugh Jarse
Rocky Elsom (76)
Yee haa.
Our reverse psychology worked out as anticipated.
On All Hallows Eve, despite the 21st century enlightenment, Jinx's prevail. Awesome performance from the Golden boys. We never doubted you.
Bring Back Bill!!!!!
Our reverse psychology worked out as anticipated.
On All Hallows Eve, despite the 21st century enlightenment, Jinx's prevail. Awesome performance from the Golden boys. We never doubted you.
Bring Back Bill!!!!!
aussie1st
Alfred Walker (16)
Finally a win against the ABs. JOC (James O'Connor) stepped up towards the end especially with that kick. I wanted him subbed and dropped to the bench but that effort puts him into the 12 jersey. It's not like we lose anything having him over Giteau and we definitely gain in the goal kicking. Beale was fantastic, boy hes going great guns at fullback. The try by AOC will give him a lot of confidence and has given me more confidence in him as a 13. Pocock was brilliant, its good having a 7 that can get turn overs again, Smith was clearly past it.
On Davis, I liked what I saw in attack and he has a ton of speed. Didn't pay attention to his defence but I'm happy to give him a shot on this tour.
On Davis, I liked what I saw in attack and he has a ton of speed. Didn't pay attention to his defence but I'm happy to give him a shot on this tour.
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