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Wallaby Locks

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T

TOCC

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Rory Arnold is extremely raw and lock is such a technical position which takes years to become proficient at, I think Arnold will get a bit of game time for the Brumbies but can't see Cheika selecting him especially if he already has a big framed lump in Skelton.


Adam Coleman might be a bolter and I'm hoping he has a big season because i like the way he plays..
 
qwerty51

qwerty51

Stirling Mortlock (74)
Just a FWIW, the 2011 RWC squad only included 2 players who made their Test debut in that year; Pat McCabe and Nick Phipps and only Phipps debuted in Super Rugby 2011.

Quite a lot of the 2011 squad had only made their Test and Super Rugby debuts in 2010. Don't think that'll be the same (2014) this year.

Test debuts in 2010:

A Fainga'a, S Fainga'a, Slipper, Ma'afu, Simmons, Higginbotham, McCalman, Hodgson, Horne, Beale (sort of)

Only Speight, Carter, Skelton, McMahon, Charles are the ones likely to make the RWC squad who debuted in 2014.
 
Wilson

Wilson

Phil Kearns (64)
qwerty51 said:
Just a FWIW, the 2011 RWC squad only included 2 players who made their Test debut in that year; Pat McCabe and Nick Phipps and only Phipps debuted in Super Rugby 2011.

Quite a lot of the 2011 squad had only made their Test and Super Rugby debuts in 2010. Don't think that'll be the same (2014) this year.

Test debuts in 2010:

A Fainga'a, S Fainga'a, Slipper, Ma'afu, Simmons, Higginbotham, McCalman, Hodgson, Horne, Beale (sort of)

Only Speight, Carter, Skelton, McMahon, Charles are the ones likely to make the RWC squad who debuted in 2014.
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Decent chance for Faulkner as well from 2014 debutants.

Hunt is the only potential 2015 debutant I'd back to make the RWC squad, any others will likely be more injury dependant, e.g. if Kuridrani goes down it'll almost certainly mean Kerevi, Godwin or Inman comes in.
 
Braveheart81

Braveheart81

Will Genia (78)
Staff member
ACT Waterboy said:
I completely agree it is a long shot, but personally think he would be a more worthwhile project then skelton
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On what basis?

Because you've seen Skelton play a few tests and don't like what he does?

Compare that to Arnold who hasn't even played a Super Rugby game.

The big challenge we have at lock is that we're lacking options who play consistently well at Super Rugby level. The next players in line like Caderyn Neville have been very inconsistent yet are seemingly the next best players we've got.

It's taken Rob Simmons somewhere around 40 tests before he has been a reasonably good test lock.

Expecting players who aren't always that good at Super Rugby level to get into the test arena and improve the side seems like wishful thinking.

Arnold may develop nicely this season but at this stage he's only a worthwhile project at Super Rugby level. He'll be hard pressed getting much game time for the Brumbies this year.
 
wamberal

wamberal

Phil Kearns (64)
Chris McCracken said:
This. For mine, he and Neville are the two that the Wallabies need to step up and compete for a spot.
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I used to have high hopes for Neville, partly because he has a background as a rower, which means that his aerobic potential is high.


However, I have come do the conclusion that he will not make the grade, he has had his chances.

Coleman is my big hope.
 
ACT Waterboy

ACT Waterboy

Stan Wickham (3)
Braveheart81 said:
On what basis?

Because you've seen Skelton play a few tests and don't like what he does?

Compare that to Arnold who hasn't even played a Super Rugby game.

The big challenge we have at lock is that we're lacking options who play consistently well at Super Rugby level. The next players in line like Caderyn Neville have been very inconsistent yet are seemingly the next best players we've got.

It's taken Rob Simmons somewhere around 40 tests before he has been a reasonably good test lock.

Expecting players who aren't always that good at Super Rugby level to get into the test arena and improve the side seems like wishful thinking.

Arnold may develop nicely this season but at this stage he's only a worthwhile project at Super Rugby level. He'll be hard pressed getting much game time for the Brumbies this year.
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I just don't think Skelton has the right bodyshape for a test lock, he is big and that is about it and i don't like the idea of compromising a back row because a lock cant jump in the lineouts, I think the rawness of Arnold is his advantage, could be a more aggressive lock like fardy or even retalic, anyway it is only speculation and your right the technical aspect of the position make is very tricket although it isnt like this is his first season of rugby...

Obviously as a brumbies fan i have an inherant interest in Arnold and want him to succeed, but as a wallabies fan im worried about our lack of quality locks like the rest of you.
 
Braveheart81

Braveheart81

Will Genia (78)
Staff member
The challenege players like Coleman and Arnold face is that they have to assert themselves as first choice in their Super Rugby sides before they have a chance of really going further.

It's about convincing the coach that on a consistent basis they're better than the dependable types like Sam Wykes who get the job done at Super Rugby level but have never been likely to progress to test level.

Hopefully Coleman does that this year at the Force.
 
wamberal

wamberal

Phil Kearns (64)
Well, that's the thing that Australian rugby has to come to terms with, we need the Wallabies to be successful, and if that means that a player like Coleman should be given an extended run at the Soup level, so be it.

I like Wykes, mainly because he has played for the Mighty Woods, with some distinction over the years, but he will never go any further.

Cheika would be far more aware of this sort of conundrum than us, that is why he is trying to coopt the Soup coaches into the Wallabies set-up. IMHO.
 
The_Brown_Hornet

The_Brown_Hornet

John Eales (66)
I'm looking for Coleman to have a big season. The time is right for him to step up and make an impression, because if he does then I feel he has a future at test level. He's got all the physical attributes and not inconsiderable talent, it's now a matter of converting.
 
Pfitzy

Pfitzy

Nathan Sharpe (72)
Fuck yeah. He should be out there damaging pricks with his size. Plus, being Tasmanian, the extra fingers and toes should give him an advantage.
 
Brumby Runner

Brumby Runner

Jason Little (69)
Braveheart81 said:
The challenege players like Coleman and Arnold face is that they have to assert themselves as first choice in their Super Rugby sides before they have a chance of really going further.

It's about convincing the coach that on a consistent basis they're better than the dependable types like Sam Wykes who get the job done at Super Rugby level but have never been likely to progress to test level.

Hopefully Coleman does that this year at the Force.
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BH, I see you've nominated Wykes as the man for Coleman to exceed at the Force in order to come under consideration for further honours, and I agree. But earlier you thought that Arnold wouldn't be getting much game time at the Brumbies this year. Who do you think will keep him out? Are you anticipating Scott Fardy will play lock rather than No 6, or that Blake Enever or Tom Staniforth will be ahead of him? It is a real possibility that Fardy will be put in the second row, though I hope not. I don't know enough yet about Enever to have an opinion of his talents vis-a-vis Arnold's but I thought Arnold showed quite a bit of promise in the NRC. IMO Tom won't be ready for Super rugby or beyond for another 12 months yet, so I'd count him out.

The reason I think many of us are hoping, even wishing, for a left field option is that a lot of us have seen Will Skelton play a number of tests now and we generally have the view that he is not technically sound enough at set piece to be the answer to our locking problems. We all hope he can rectify his deficiencies and become the world beater that his size alone says he should be, but he is pretty far from it atm.
 
Bairdy

Bairdy

Peter Fenwicke (45)
The_Brown_Hornet said:
I'm looking for Coleman to have a big season. The time is right for him to step up and make an impression, because if he does then I feel he has a future at test level. He's got all the physical attributes and not inconsiderable talent, it's now a matter of converting.
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Of course we all want Coleman to succeed, but I think he is going to be hard pressed to get consistent game time - pending injury and rotation.

Lock is one of a handful of areas where we have considerable strength at the Force. He's only 23 with only one full Super Rugby season under his belt; we don't want him to jump from the frying pan and into the flames too soon.
 
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