Wallabies vs England, Sydney, 3rd Test, 25 June @ 8:00pm

[Mr Doug]

Carter to Narrabri 2nd grade. Bring in a 21 year old to match their no. 4. Maybe staniforth. Youthful exuberance will offer more than unfulfilled potential.Kurindrani very quite tonight. Maybe needs a rest. Isi to oc,dhp to fullback.

Oranges, your ability to accept what happened in the second test is equal to your knowledge of NSW Central Northern Rugby .... very poor!
Carter gave away no penalties, he was at most of the rucks to protect his players from the pilfering Poms, whilst giving his half-back protection, he was the chief line-out caller, (and we didn't lose any of our throws), and he was still performing at the final whistle!
You are like so many on this forum, in that you can't accept the fact that we were beaten (twice) by a better team, we were beaten (twice) by a more-disciplined team, and we were beaten (twice) by a better-coached team.
I hate having to say that, as much as you hate being told that, but sadly, they are the unfortunate and irrefutable facts.

 

[Joe Blow]

I agree with you Swingpass.
Firstly, there is no way Cheika will not stand by his captain. Moore will start.
We will probably see changes in the second and back rows and also in the mid field.
We lacked experience and muscle in the tight 5 again. Simmons will get a reprieve from the naughty chair and will be re-instated. I would guess that either Arnold or Horwill will start next to him. I would opt for Horwill with Arnold on the bench.
In the back row we lacked authority and could not measure up to the English trio again. Fardy and Hooper will hold their places but we need a legitimate 8. I would opt for taking a look at Houston with either McMahon or McCalman on the bench but am not sure if Leroy is still with the squad and a possibility. If not him then start with Palu.
In the centers we have seen the KK play pretty well but they have been straight forward to defend against. We have also seen Lealifano get plenty of time on the pitch and he has not been effective in the second playmaker role.
If Matty To'omua is fit, which looks to be the case, he should be started at 12. He is a very polished all around 12 who can bash it up, run through holes, kick in behind and is a good second kicking option. I assume we will gravitate back to having Giteau or Beale at 12 for the RC so we may as well begin to play that way.
It may be a good opportunity to play some fringe blokes from the bench. Coleman etc but we do need to win this one.

 

[Micheal]

England with coaching inputs so far from:

Andrew Johns
George Smith
One of the Ellas (can't remember which).

When is the ARU going to use the countless resources lying on its door step?

The Waratahs / Wallabies attacking structures (second man plays) have really taken a lot from similar structures (Cheika even admitted this during his time at the Tahs) - get some of these legends in to work with our halves. Supplement these with the Ellas etc.

Get Brad Thorn down from Queensland and George Smith to work with the forwards.

Get some AFL legends down to help with the kicking.

Just fucking get anyone who can inspire the players and have an input. Why we aren't doing these things confounds me.

 

[RugbyReg]

You mean like Steve Larkham, Nathan Grey and Mario Ledesma?


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[ACT Crusader]

I don't mind seeing one or two changes for the test - but bringing in new guys from outside the main squad and chucking him into a baptism of fire without proper preparation is not the way to develop talent.

People should also consider how McMahon is going. Looked great guns in super rugby - struggling to be effective at tests.

Agree TSR. I wouldn't be making too many changes.

I know the series is now lost but does anyone else think that there is more pressure on the Wallabies this weekend? Facing a 3-0 whitewash on home soil is massive in terms of history and also the general confidence for the squad.

If there is a game that OZ want to win at all costs I think it's this weekend. Sure people won't forget the exploits of test 1 and particularly test 2, but no matter what England come out with, OZ need to bring the heat or else is suggest it's a tough road to recover from. Even though players will return to super rugby after the weekend but a 3-0 will be amplified once the RC starts.

The coaches and player leadership group will be really scratching their heads as to what next??

Sure some of the issues raised (ad nauseum) regarding kicking, skills, etc can't be addressed in 7 days, but some games are more important than others and I would say this is one of them.

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

If these boys don't come charging out of the gate this weekend then I would say all hope is lost. How about a Battle of Ballymore Pt 2 or something (joking, sort of).

 

[Brumby Runner]

I think we're getting a bit carried away with replacements here. Who are these uncapped players who are going to magically make the Wallabies better? This is our problem in Australian rugby, we get too hung up on bringing individuals in and expecting them to perform miracles. It's a team game guys, our strategy and formations were bad on the weekend, not necessarily the individual players themselves. Some were below par, yes, but just chucking out half the team, as I've seen suggested here, is not the answer. With a smarter game plan and better execution we should have won on Saturday night. When you have that amount of possession and don't win it's not the players necessarily, but the mental side of the game. If we'd lost every set piece and breakdown I'd be saying the opposite, but we didn't. We got out thought.

I'd be bringing in new faces not with the objective of magically making the Wallabies better right now, but with an eye to the future. Next year, no Pocock, To'omua, Tomane, Beale, and their absence now is probably a blessing in disguise.

Looking to 2019, probably no Moore, TPN, Horwill, Fardy, or Horne. No mileage in continuing to use these sorts of players beyond their use-by date even if they are still a bit better than their likely replacements. Just a matter of recognising when the use-by dates have arrived.

 

[Brumby Runner]

FTFY

Have you never heard of Ruan Smith? Shame on you.

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

As I said upthread, I've got no issue with a tweak here or there, but wholesale changes for a test we still want to win are wrongheaded IMHO.

 

[Brumby Runner]

But Kerevi is more of a playmaker then Folau. Folau is an average passer. A player who makes breaks shouldn't be regarded as a "playmaker" - he is a dangerous runner and a dangerous attacker.

Don't you recall the overlap he screwed up by running into Kuridrani (it think it was Kuridrani).

Having said that, I don't mind the idea of 12. Kerevi 13. Falou IF we can find someone who can catch a high ball.

Maybe it's time to move Falou back to the wing.

Still thinking that Phipps will be at No 9, hey Seb.

 

[A mutterer]

I agree with you Swingpass.
Firstly, there is no way Cheika will not stand by his captain. Moore will start.
We will probably see changes in the second and back rows and also in the mid field.

i think you're right, but moore does not look the part at the moment and probably deserves to be served notice with some time on the pine. will that happen in a game that is now about saving face for all and sundry? probably not.

if To'omua comes in then kuridrani should probably take a back seat to kerevi, his form has been good. otherwise the backline will likely remain.

the issue has definitely been upfront, and horwill probably deserves the start. i thought carter was alright, and the stats backed this up, lots of invisible work in tight. mcmahon didnt take his chance last week and the whole double 7 tactic should be shelved for this game. we need a traditional 8 looking to put some hurt on the english players - something horwill will bring back into the pack.

 

[Brumby Runner]

Agree on Sio. Slipper also benefited from poor turf, i'd imagine we would have been penalised more otehrwise.
Skelton could be interesting though. Probs see him on the bench.
No point in playing Palu - he won't be here for the RWC - might as well give others game time.

Sio won't return at Slipper's expense. It will be to replace Toby Smith who just has very little impact in open play, and certainly nowhere near as much as Sio.

 

[Brumby Runner]

As I said upthread, I've got no issue with a tweak here or there, but wholesale changes for a test we still want to win are wrongheaded IMHO.

We've been comprehensively beaten in the second test, and well beaten in the first with a bit of help from the ref. Really, what makes you think the same players are going to turn it around this week? They might of course, but the odds would have to be against it.

 

[Joe Blow]

Of course Beale will not be available for the rest of this year. So Giteau for the RC with To'omua as his back up?
Maybe we need to be taking a look at Hodge off the bench to see if he can fill this role? We are starting to look thin in the 12 department at years end.
Beale and Giteau will be available from OS but Gits may hang up the boots soon. Beale still has his best in front of him one would think.

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

Comprehensive is not the word I would use, but beaten nonetheless. As I've also said, we were beaten due to poor tactics and execution, not because of the cattle out on the park. Cheik got out thought and out coached for mine. Our decision makers on the paddock also took a lot of wrong options and didn't adjust the plan when it became obvious that England weren't committing players to the breakdown and fanning out. Those same personnel could have changed the result by playing smarter footy. All IMHO of course.

 

[Sir Eddie Jones]

Straya didn't play the conditions.

 

[Cardiffblue]

Comprehensive is not the word I would use, but beaten nonetheless. As I've also said, we were beaten due to poor tactics and execution, not because of the cattle out on the park. Cheik got out thought and out coached for mine. Our decision makers on the paddock also took a lot of wrong options and didn't adjust the plan when it became obvious that England weren't committing players to the breakdown and fanning out. Those same personnel could have changed the result by playing smarter footy. All IMHO of course.

From outsider's perspective I'd say the English forwards have been better twice now.

 

[BarneySF]

People are going just nuts with their team selections. So I'm joining in:

1 Allan Ala'alatoa
2 James Hanson
3 Tom Robertson
4 Tom Staniforth
5 Cadeyrn Neville
6 TPN
7 Liam Gill
8 Leroy Houston

9 Nick Frisby
10 Jono Lance
11 Eto Nabuli
12 Matt To'omua
13 Izzy Folau
14 Andrew Kellaway
15 DHP

16 Andrew Ready
17 Taniela Tupou
18 Angus Ta'avoa
19 Angus Coleman
20 Will Skelton
21 Joe Powell
22 Kyle Godwin
23 Michael Hooper

Hooper 12


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[No4918]

If these boys don't come charging out of the gate this weekend then I would say all hope is lost. How about a Battle of Ballymore Pt 2 or something (joking, sort of).

We came charging out of the gate in game 2 and played right into England's hands. Doing the same will have much the same result.

Yes, they need to be fired up but they need to smarter about it. If that means slowing the game down for periods instead of trying to run everything at 100 miles an hour then so be it. That strategy has failed, England are too fit.

 

[TOCC]

Laurier Fisher tweeted:

Wallabies struggling with any real semblance of forward shape off 9 to challenge the defence line and generate quality recycle.