Wallabies v Springboks, Sat 10th August 2.30pm AEST @ Suncorp,

[Purce]

It's interesting, I would have top end speed way down the list of desirable attributes for a test 10.

Acceleration, yes. This is what challenges the line... not top end speed.

I'd think game management, vision, passing ability, general play kicking, defense, goal kicking, acceleration are all attributes you'd want over top end speed.

IMO Lynagh has most of these, and has guided the Reds around very well at an age of 19/20. Is he consistent enough right now? No. But which of the 10s are? I think he is leaps and bounds ahead of the other options when they were his age.

He has the foundations of a very good test 10. He is tough as nails too with a big ticker. Doesn't physically look it, but he is.

He isn't consistent enough at the moment but which 19/20 year olds are? At anything, let alone professional rugby.

If he keeps building on his foundations I wouldn't be surprised to see him wearing 10 at the next world cup... and excelling in it.

Schmidt is managing him well atm. A little game time, plenty or work ons in camp.

 

[Purce]

On Donaldson, the more I've seen of him the more I think he is naturally suited to fullback.

He plays better with more time. Also he is a very natural runner/athlete. Watch him in space, there is a little Greg Inglis to his stride / shape. Bigger body too with plenty of pace and his abilities / vision from playing 10... I think he would go well there.

I'm not suggesting he plays there for the Wobs, just an armchair observation.

 

[Strewthcobber]

IMO Lynagh has most of these, and has guided the Reds around very well at an age of 19/20. Is he consistent enough right now? No. But which of the 10s are? I think he is leaps and bounds ahead of the other options when they were his age.

He has the foundations of a very good test 10. He is tough as nails too with a big ticker. Doesn't physically look it, but he is.

He isn't consistent enough at the moment but which 19/20 year olds are? At anything, let alone professional rugby.

Lynagh is 21. At just about this age Lolesio had 10 test caps and had already played the All Blacks 6 times.

(I agree with most of your post, but historically most guys who end up playing a lot of tests at 10 are ready at age 21or soon after - although maybe not starting at 10, and that's where Lynagh's lack of speed becomes an issue - you can't introduce him to test rugby in other positions with less pressure).

 

[Adam84]

Excited for the game. Weather is looking slightly overcast.

We have 7 attending from my family, for a couple of the kids it will be their first Wallabies test thanks to the 2:30 kick off.

For all the hysterics about the kick off time and clashes with GPS and QPR(which were resolved), just goes to show there’s a broader rugby fanbase to be concerned about then just those who can afford to attend GPS schools…

 

[capalaba]

Garbage.

Agreed, I think Donaldson offers a lot more than Noah and will make the playing squad.

 

[Strewthcobber]

For all the hysterics about the kick off time and clashes with GPS and QPR(which were resolved), just goes to show there’s a broader rugby fanbase to be concerned about then just those who can afford to attend GPS schools…

I always thought the concern wasn't that people wouldn't attend the test, but that they wouldn't attend the other games

 

[Yoda]

Lynagh is 21. At just about this age Lolesio had 10 test caps and had already played the All Blacks 6 times.

(I agree with most of your post, but historically most guys who end up playing a lot of tests at 10 are ready at age 21or soon after - although maybe not starting at 10, and that's where Lynagh's lack of speed becomes an issue - you can't introduce him to test rugby in other positions with less pressure).

Richie Mounga didn’t get super good until way past 21. Difference though he played plenty of rugby games to hone his skills. Problem with our young blokes is they don’t play enough top rugby. The Mickey Mouse Super rugby is over before it starts and if you don’t play Test footy you are back to club which is not the hard level you need imho. Most young blokes would benefit playing in Europe or New Zealand or extend our Super Rugby season. It can take a break during Test window around now then resume, maybe finishing with a home and away local derby series. Anything to get more games in.

 

[Quick_Tap_Tony]

Excited to see how the forwards who are coming the bench are able to contain the bomb squad. I really like the pick of Josh Nasser (16) who is arguably the best scrummaging hooker in AUS rugby right now.

-QTT

 

[Braveheart81]

Excited for the game. Weather is looking slightly overcast.

We have 7 attending from my family, for a couple of the kids it will be their first Wallabies test thanks to the 2:30 kick off.

For all the hysterics about the kick off time and clashes with GPS and QPR(which were resolved), just goes to show there’s a broader rugby fanbase to be concerned about then just those who can afford to attend GPS schools…

I think the opportunity to bring younger kids is a key aspect of why some afternoon games should always be part of the Super Rugby and test schedule. I'm certainly not advocating for it to be the bulk of games but the odd one is great.

 

[Braveheart81]

Richie Mounga didn’t get super good until way past 21.

I'm not sure if that is reasonable. He didn't get a chance to play Super Rugby and test rugby at age 20 like some of our players but when he did become the Crusaders starting 10 at age 22 (2016) he was pretty good. In his second and third seasons he led them to the title (2017 and 2018).

He was the New Zealand under 20s 10 in 2014 so it wasn't like he was a late bloomer.

 

[Wilson]

I think the opportunity to bring younger kids is a key aspect of why some afternoon games should always be part of the Super Rugby and test schedule. I'm certainly not advocating for it to be the bulk of games but the odd one is great.

Yeah one offs are ok, but I generally don't like it for the bigger games. I get particularly annoyed by the set of commentators and reports who keep claiming that people are clamoring for them off the back of pretty slim and shaky evidence. I have a feeling it's a fair bit of bias on their part, with them enjoying covering afternoon games and finishing up at 5pm instead of 10pm, which is understandable, but hardly a universal experience.

 

[Strewthcobber]

Richie Mounga didn’t get super good until way past 21.

It's not about being good. It's about being good enough and ready.

Mo'unga started all games for the Crusaders at 10 from age 21 in 2016. We would have had him in the Wallabies at that point, but they had the luxury of plenty of other older 10s to carry the load

Lynagh isn't some child prodigy. He's pretty much at the same stage as most good playmakers are at. Ideally he would have a couple more years before being thrust into the Wallaby 10 spot, but that isn't what happens to most of our guys. They have to step up young

 

[BDA]

Agreed, I think Donaldson offers a lot more than Noah and will make the playing squad.

The fact that Schmidt has gone with Noah at 10 and Lynagh on the bench now in both the first Wales test and now against the boks isn't great news for Donaldson. Selections seem to infer that Schmidt thinks Noah is his first choice 10 presently and Lynagh is his understudy.

Also Lynagh's combination with Tate is no doubt a big factor, but you would think Donaldson makes more sense on the bench given he's more versatile and more experienced. Is that because Schmidt has reservation about Donaldson or is it more about developing Lynagh?

Personally I'm not sold on either Noah or Donaldson - I certainly don't think Donaldson is any better than Noah. I assume Schmidt is just biding his time getting Lynagh to where he needs to be to take over the reigns. I think playing him off the bench this year is a great way to get him use to test rugby without throwing him in the deep end completely. For that reason, if Noah plays shit this weekend I'd prefer to see Donaldson at 10 next week and keep Lynagh on the bench

 

[LeCheese]

For that reason, if Noah plays shit this weekend I'd prefer to see Donaldson at 10 next week and keep Lynagh on the bench

It's been said before, but this line of thinking is genuinely problematic. We shouldn't be dropping a 10 (or most positions, for that matter) off the back of one bad game. We've consistently seen that feeling a lack of security inspires absolutely no confidence within a player.

I'm by no means a huge Noah fan, but I do hope Schmidt's told him he's got the keys for the RC. Same would go for Donaldson or Lynagh if they were called upon. Pick and stick.

 

[BDA]

I

It's been said before, but this line of thinking is genuinely problematic. We shouldn't be dropping a 10 (or most positions, for that matter) off the back of one bad game. We've consistently seen that feeling a lack of security inspires absolutely no confidence within a player.

I'm by no means a huge Noah fan, but I do hope Schmidt's told him he's got the keys for the RC. Same would go for Donaldson or Lynagh if they were called upon. Pick and stick.

yeh I don't disagree, I just mean if you were going to replace Noah I'd prefer not to see Lynagh brought into the start side this year ideally.

 

[stillmissit]

It's been said before, but this line of thinking is genuinely problematic. We shouldn't be dropping a 10 (or most positions, for that matter) off the back of one bad game. We've consistently seen that feeling a lack of security inspires absolutely no confidence within a player.

I'm by no means a huge Noah fan, but I do hope Schmidt's told him he's got the keys for the RC. Same would go for Donaldson or Lynagh if they were called upon. Pick and stick.

That's all very well but neither Lolesio nor Donalson have grabbed their opportunities and they have had plenty. 10 is not a placemat, it is a key position for any rugby team. I agree with sticking IF we have a 10 who shows some improvement over some games. Both Donaldson and Lolesio have not done this, particularly Lolesio.

 

[Purce]

Lynagh is 21. At just about this age Lolesio had 10 test caps and had already played the All Blacks 6 times.

(I agree with most of your post, but historically most guys who end up playing a lot of tests at 10 are ready at age 21or soon after - although maybe not starting at 10, and that's where Lynagh's lack of speed becomes an issue - you can't introduce him to test rugby in other positions with less pressure).

He was 19 when he debuted for the Reds, which is what I was referring to. His ability to manage games is about as good I've seen from a flyhalf of 19/20yo in Aus.

Donaldson is the only other 10 option with decent top end speed. I just don't see it as limiting and believe it is less necessary than a lot of the other skills required for a quality 10. It's nice to have however not without the other skills and attributes.

Agree with your point regarding limiting his ability to be brought in as a 15. Schmidt wouldn't be pushing Wright/Kellaway/Petaia out for him in anycase. He will get time off the bench, which is the right way to do it. I reckon Schmidt will manage this a lot better than other Wallaby coaches who came before. You could argue this is a reason Lolesio's development was stunted.

To be clear, I'm not calling for Lynagh to be starting now. I do think he has a very bright future if he keeps at it and injury free. The competition for 10 at the Reds is another positive in his development which will hopefully push him forward.

For now I think Lolesio is the right choice and he is firmly in the driver's seat for this year and the Lions tour. Hopefully he can find some consistency at test level and cut the unforced errors.

 

[Purce]

Richie Mounga didn’t get super good until way past 21. Difference though he played plenty of rugby games to hone his skills. Problem with our young blokes is they don’t play enough top rugby. The Mickey Mouse Super rugby is over before it starts and if you don’t play Test footy you are back to club which is not the hard level you need imho. Most young blokes would benefit playing in Europe or New Zealand or extend our Super Rugby season. It can take a break during Test window around now then resume, maybe finishing with a home and away local derby series. Anything to get more games in.

I couldn't agree more with this. There are a number of players in Oz who would benefit from time spent in Europe. It should be encouraged if possible.

 

[Dctarget]

I'll be happy if we're within 10.

 

[The Phoenix]

Wow man, you really don't like the Tahs, honestly the way they played this year none should get in except Bell if match fit. I rate out No 9 talent in Aus pretty lame as well. Honestly, I am a Tahs fan and I prefer Lonergan over all other 9's. I see Gordon about the same as Tate and ahead of White. Just my view.

I've always rated Gordon. He's had a thankless task at the Tahs over the past couple of years as captain of an underperforming side but was often their best player. Very happy for him to be first choice 9.