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The Wallabies Thread

Killer

Cyril Towers (30)
In basic terms in recent decades we have had a society that has been inclusive and works.
We need to protect this freedom and inclusiveness from the more extreme elements.
IMO that means not allowing, condoning or protecting these extreme elements who don't want that type of open inclusive society.
Not saying Folau is an extremist but his comments are thoughtless and possibly the thin edge of the wedge.
 

wamberal

Phil Kearns (64)
So where exactly do you stand on Folau?


By the way, "the thin edge of the wedge"? We are long past the days when gays were persecuted, gaoled, attacked, blackmailed, etc.


That is what "extremism" looks like. Prattling religious doctrine is not extremism, and it is only the thin end of a wedge if you let it affect you.


Gays today are widely and happily accepted in society. Nothing that a bible thumper says will change that.

Are you seriously suggesing that players should be censored?
 

Killer

Cyril Towers (30)
So where exactly do you stand on Folau?


By the way, "the thin edge of the wedge"? We are long past the days when gays were persecuted, gaoled, attacked, blackmailed, etc.


That is what "extremism" looks like. Prattling religious doctrine is not extremism, and it is only the thin end of a wedge if you let it affect you.


Gays today are widely and happily accepted in society. Nothing that a bible thumper says will change that.

Are you seriously suggesing that players should be censored?


I'm too busy to argue about words etc, surely you understand the point I am making.
 

wamberal

Phil Kearns (64)
No, I don't.


This is all about words, if you are too busy to explain yourself, sorry, I cannot read your mind. The wedge has past us by, and it is not coming back.


Players can say what they like, as long as it is within the law, and does not infringe the terms of their contract. No wedge in sight. There is nothing special about football players, the famous ones are just a few of the thousands of famous people who sprout their opinions.
 

Killer

Cyril Towers (30)
No, I don't.


This is all about words, if you are too busy to explain yourself, sorry, I cannot read your mind. The wedge has past us by, and it is not coming back.


Players can say what they like, as long as it is within the law, and does not infringe the terms of their contract. No wedge in sight. There is nothing special about football players, the famous ones are just a few of the thousands of famous people who sprout their opinions.


well then I would be wasting my time discussing it with you.
 

Braveheart81

Will Genia (78)
Staff member
Players can say what they like, as long as it is within the law, and does not infringe the terms of their contract. No wedge in sight. There is nothing special about football players, the famous ones are just a few of the thousands of famous people who sprout their opinions.


This is the relevant part and more so, it's the reaction they have got from their sponsors who are unhappy with Folau's comments.

Of course what he said is legal but that isn't really relevant.

At the end of the day it's about money and RA is under pressure from their three major sponsors over this and need to take some action even if that is just discussing the issue with Folau and explaining why they don't want him doing it again.
 

Zero_Cool

Arch Winning (36)
Does anyone think this will push Folau to seek a contract elsewhere (maybe New Zealand, or France as examples)?
Or push the ARU to not renew his contract?
Or make it more difficult to select him?

Because ultimately that's what we are really concerned about in this thread. (Also maybe the Folau Thread should be unlocked for this kind of discussion, if it hasn't been already.)
 

KOB1987

John Eales (66)
Castle has just spoken and it sounds as though any action will be around his use of social media, not his views. As it should be.

Onwards..
 

KOB1987

John Eales (66)
This is the relevant part and more so, it's the reaction they have got from their sponsors who are unhappy with Folau's comments.

Of course what he said is legal but that isn't really relevant.

At the end of the day it's about money and RA is under pressure from their three major sponsors over this and need to take some action even if that is just discussing the issue with Folau and explaining why they don't want him doing it again.

You're a true prophet BH ;-)
 

brokendown

Bill McLean (32)
well the gentleman in question is an important cog in the Wallabies and very much affects the wallabies onwards--one would have thought.



I'll shut up now!
 

neilc

Bob Loudon (25)
So based on the Super Rugby matches so far who do we think are going to be new faces (if any) or recalls to the squad?
Who will get the backup hooker role (assuming that TPN is the starting hooker, or if not him, who will be the hookers)?
Props and locks?
Centre? TK has to be under some pressure but who would you like to see there?
 

Up the Guts

Steve Williams (59)
So based on the Super Rugby matches so far who do we think are going to be new faces (if any) or recalls to the squad?
Who will get the backup hooker role (assuming that TPN is the starting hooker, or if not him, who will be the hookers)?
Props and locks?
Centre? TK has to be under some pressure but who would you like to see there?
I would like to see BPA picked at 16 for the first Irish test at least. 13 is a tough one as it’s unlikely we’re going to play strong defenders at 10 or 12 in Beale and Foley and they are going to get chopped and changed in the defensive line so even though Kurindrani might not be lighting up the world in attack his defensive solidity is needed.
 

Zero_Cool

Arch Winning (36)
So based on the Super Rugby matches so far who do we think are going to be new faces (if any) or recalls to the squad?
Who will get the backup hooker role (assuming that TPN is the starting hooker, or if not him, who will be the hookers)?
Props and locks?
Centre? TK has to be under some pressure but who would you like to see there?

Forwards

Hooker


Honestly, I'd much prefer us not picking TPN -- he's too weak with his lineout and if we are going with Pooper (Hooper being Capitan and Pocock playing like he's the second coming of 'Mr Nobody' or fucking George Smith! Also I can't believe he's still fucking playing!). While TPN gives you PLENTY around the park I'm not sure he'd be so much of an upgrade (around the park) over say Slipper as an example.

BPA has looked very solid, I'd still like to see Ready get some Super Rugby time because I think he's got that capacity to be an excellent test Hooker (reminds me of Adriaan Strauss). Latu is similar to Ready in that he could be a very good test player but can't get consistent Super Rugby form.

I'm not sold on Uelese yet, he could be as good as everyone is making out but I haven't seen enough from him yet. Like he wasn't even starting over Hugh Roach (IIRC) or whoever it was at the Rebels last yet. If you are Tupou good and you aren't forcing your way into the starting side over who is a very average Hooker at best maybe you aren't all that and you are just potential. Having said that, I'd much rather Uelese get the start over TPN because Cheika has proven he doesn't have a long term plan and he doesn't look to try to set things up for the future with his selections.

Other options are Anaru Rangi, Folau Fainga'a, and if you are planning on playing TPN you may as well consider Josh Mann-Rea/Robbie Able. Hooper is pretty open, I'm disgusted in the way Chekia has handled the long term planning particularly for this position, but even more broadly; most of the time when he's looked at young prospects or even made tweeks/changes they have largely been forced by injury or untenable form. But Cheika has his favorites and will pick TPN and Uelese.

Props

Props is probably some combination of Kepu, Ala'alatoa, and Sio. Probably Slipper and Tupou being given 10-30 min off the bench and told to go NUTS (Tupou might actually kill someone!).

Locks

Locks at the moment will probably be Coleman and Rodda. Coleman's numbers generally are actually down, and he hasn't looked the most impressive (43 TKS and 68 MR) but surely he'll find some form before the June Tests. Interestingly Douglass has probably the best numbers of the Aussie locks, but I want to push him out of the Reds side. But I'm sure Tui will be made to earn his way back in. Rodda's numbers really don't tell the whole story for him only a tick over 8 tackles a game, but he gives you good front foot ball and fuck me he hits some ungodly number of rucks (I don't have stats for this)! Matt Phillip has been good for the Rebels but I feel like he'll be benched for Parling and we will forget about him. Simmons has been okay, but he's Rob Simmons -- he's just fine and does a dickheaded thing every now and then (also I don't trust that Waratahs scrum outside Kepu).

Backrow

The Backrow can go so many ways, I think the only viable player not yet mentioned in this conversation is George Smith and that's because he's semi-retired from International Rugby. Apparently, we aren't considering Higginbotham but surely if available and fit he's gotta at least be in the squad and if he's in the squad I think he should be starting.

Angus Scott-Young and Liam Wright are building nice cases for inclusion in the Squad but I don't think we'll see them start unless there's a bus crash or something crazy! Korczyk could be a decent option for that 'Ned Hanigan' role last year except he's less poo. I was one of his biggest criticizers last year and sometimes get down on him this yet, but credit where credit's due Ned has been one of my most improved players for this season, he might now be approaching where he needed to be last year given his playing time / selection et al.

Pocock at the moment is locked in somewhere, Hooper hasn't been super impressive yet, and I'm growing more and more worried about his leadership style/abilities particularly the walking away from the referee (I know a few former Wallabies captains who think he should be booted out of the capitancy at the Waratahs for it, but that's probably a bit extreme). I'd love to see Finga'a in the squad, Ross HP has been impressive for the Rebels too, Dempsey is expected to be very good when he's back, Wells has been good, there is something kicking about regarding McMahon but let's wait till that's confirmed/sorted. Timu is my pick for 6/8. If we go with Pooper we might go the 'Dean Mumm' route, and could see Simmons or Hanigan or Tui selected here as well as Timu. (what do people think about Ross Haylett-Petty here?)

Ultimately it's Cheika we will see Hanigan, Hooper and Pocock. Timu on the bench.

Backline
I've written far more than I intended so I'll keep the backline short (I hope!). Looking back... I failed.


Scrum Half

Willy-G backup will be Nick 'fucking hell' Phipps. But should be Gordon or Powell, maybe Tuttle at a stretch if we are in need of a goal kicker.

Fly Half

Could we pick Quade Cooper from club rugby?! He actually played well for Souths on the weekend, but it's likely the only way Thorn picks him for the Reds is if he becomes Queensland Premier Grade's most prolific defender. But let's pretend he's single handedly putting Souths in for 4 or 5 tries a game playing well in defence and gets his running game going (he's offloads are already fully sick!), could he be selected. (Okay enough from fantasyland.)

Our semi-viable options Foley, Beale, Lance, Hodge (according to Cheika), Stewart/Masson/Paia'aua. (IMO we can forget about Hodge playing 10 EVER.)
Foley is playing fairly poorly right now, but is kicking goals, and defending as poorly as ever. I swear with Foley it's always one, sledom two never three. I like the idea of picking Beale at 10 he'll be slightly less of a liability in defence and has been effectively playing their half the time for the Waratahs anyway.

Lance has been playing very well for the Reds -- but if you look at little deeper it's plain to see he kills any hope of any backline attack, he turned Paia'aua Australia most consistent 12 last year into an unpickable trainwreck. Paia'aua hasn't gotten any worse, Lance just doesn't shift the defence at all, and is fairly slow to get the ball on. The result is the Reds must play 'crash ball' with their centers, Lance can't be picked without size 18 centers. Despite this Lance is probably in the best form of all the Aussie 10's.

Stewart/Masson -- these two young up and coming fly halves have the ability to make an impact and would probably be amazing at the Rebels or Brumbies... But they are at the Reds and Waratahs who already have established Fly Halves. Stewart has a chance of seeing game time because the Reds more or less have no choice for next year, but Masson is probably the third option at flyhalf for the Waratahs so will be playing left-right-out.
Stewart could be a really nice option for the Wallabies, in a year or two. Big boot, one of the best defenders at 10 in Australia just to name a few things. Good as an option at fullback for the moment.

Ultimately Cheika will pick Foley, then Beale will be the backup but there are some interesting options for a third fly half in Lance or Stewart, or even Cooper. Whatever Cheika does he really should have at least one player in the squad at fly half who is the right side of 25.

Centers

On form you'd have to pick either Kerevi or CFS at 13 (maybe both). Beale is the only option if you want to go with dual playmakers; Paia'aua should have been in the squad last year and was in the conversation, but due to Lance starting at the Reds he can't be as effective as he otherwise would be, if we see Stewart (or Quade) starting for the Reds at some point Paia'aua likely becomes a very viable option.
I'd pick a backline of 10) Beale, 12) Kerevi 13) CFS, but Cheika would never do that. At the moment based on form I think we'll see Beale and CFS starting in 12/13. Hodge on the bench because he can play anywhere well enough.

Outside Backs

First the bull in the room. Naiyaravoro owns the 23 jersey, he can play on the wing and cover a center position if needed. And if you give him 20 minutes off the bench he's a fucking wrecking ball! My only question with Naiyaravoro is could we teach him to play 8 before the June Tests.

Starting on the wing I think Hodge or Maddocks are options, Perese should be in the mix somewhere, Banks has been good and Dargaville has shown some promise. But my pick to start on the wing is Koroibete and Folau (I've always said he's a winger not a fullback). Hodge or Maddocks could find himself in the starting side likely for Koroibete as it might be risky having two tactically/kicking poor wingers.

Fullback I have a few curveball candidates to go along with DHP who will likely own the 15 jersey. Lance would be a really good allowing either Beale or Foley to slink back to 15 in defence while Lance takes care of the heavy lifting -- he'd give us more defence and go forward while not giving up too much at either 10 or 12. Beale at 15 would be a nice option too. Stewart could be a nice Lance like option if we want to get a bit of youth in the backs (obviously pending some game time and form with the Reds).

Cheika will pick Koroibete and Hodge on the wing with Folau at 15.


My picks

Kepu / BPA / Sio
Rodda / Coleman
Timu / Higginbotham / Pocock (C)

Genia / Beale
Kerevi / CFS
Koroibete / DHP / Folau


Uelese / Slipper / Tupou
Arnold / Hooper
Gordon / Hodge / Naiyaravoro


Cheika's picks

Kepu / TPN / Sio
Simmons / Coleman
Hanigan / Pocock / Hooper

Genia / Foley
Beale / CFS
Koroibete / Folau / Hodge/DHP


Uelese / Slipper / Tupou
Rodda / Timu
Phipps / Maddocks / Naiyaravoro
 

Zero_Cool

Arch Winning (36)
Lost me at the first paragraph.

You'd like to stick with our 32 year old hooker who isn't playing in Australia and can't throw a lineout -- when our lineout is already going to be very poor?
I mean we could just abandon the lineout altogether... But I don't think that would work out well.

Edit: Also I forgot injury riddled.
 
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