The JOC (James O'Connor) Saga

[Moses]

Speaking of building a rugby brand, http://www.bloodandmud.com/2011/03/...ept-james-haskell-has-his-own-iphone-app.html

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

I agree except for the KPI's, the employer set's the KPI's, not the employee.

That was the thing that stuck in my craw. The other stuff about money I can live with. But you don't tell a club how to run their business with zero experience in management.

 

[TOCC]

Barnes demanded changes in Reds coaching structure and left regardless

 

[hench]

Barnes demanded changes in Reds coaching structure and left regardless

And look where he is now.

 

[dobduff11]

JOC (James O'Connor) is without doubt my favourite player and I am quite sad to see him leave the Force.

Rebels - Kurtley I think wants to play 10, and they have Cips, Mortlock, Huxley, Gerrard. Don't think he will fit in very well. Plus the Rebels are worse off than the Force.

Brumbies - Blocks the way for Coleman to come through, heard he supported the Brumbies as a kid so could be a good reason. Plus White and Jones will have some presence at the brumbs.

Reds - Stupid if he goes here, Ant, Harris, Lance, Taps, Lucas and Quade. All in the 10,12,15 channels. Family and challenging for a title are main attractions.


I have a feeling he will go to the brumbies so my fickle support for australian teams will be once again tested. Then again I have always liked the brumbies. Plus its looking like a qld re-union over there with To'omua, JOC (James O'Connor), Tomane, Prior.


Seem to have missed this tweet about a brand, must have been asleep. Can someone update please as it seems to have been deleted.

 

[fatprop]

And look where he is now.

Barnes was right and the reds needed him to leave to get the impetus to force change

 

[Happy]

Seem to have missed this tweet about a brand, must have been asleep. Can someone update please as it seems to have been deleted.

It wasn't a tweet. It was a quote during an interview for TV:
http://www.foxsports.com.au/rugby/o...-e6frf4pu-1226075872020?sectionvertical=rugby

 

[lily]

I just spoke to an ARU development manager and he tells me that it is definitely the Rebels. That said I think JOC (James O'Connor) changes his mind on the hour every hour.

 

[Jnor]

Ah that Chris Hickey is so wiley, I bet he's got something special to pull out of the hat to get JOC (James O'Connor) to come to the Tahs...

 

[fatprop]

So in summary, JOC (James O'Connor) was prepared to give the Force another year (maybe two) provided they payed him plenty, showed "vision" by buying a few more world class backs and helped him grow his "brand".

 

[Moses]

I've moved a few posts into a seperate thread to debate the merits of Twitter.

 

[Tank]

Officially confirmed by the man himself by his active again Twitter account. JOC (James O'Connor) off to Rebels. The Saga is over.

And the good news is that ABC are reporting that it is a 2 year deal so it would seem we don't have to go through it all again next year!!

 

[RedsHappy]

.....Describing himself as a "brand" has exposed him to ridicule but it is probably reflective of the realities of modern professional sport.....

Indeed Bruce. Scorn has been poured on JO'C over these off the cuff remarks, but the majority of us have no great problem with, just as one example, David Beckham's skilful development of his 'personal brand' which is carrying his economic value way beyond his soccer playing peaks, from 'Beckham I: global soccer persona' to 'Beckham II: post-soccer but still global persona'. The true top sports personas today soon morph into serious businesses and, if I was one, I would do just that as well, partly to build economic value into retirement so that I surely didn't have to end up with the ignominy of doing 'pre-game sports personality breakfasts' or such like into my later years! Then, think Greg Norman: 'The Shark' brand-building strategy around Greg's skill and persona started over 20 years ago, and it's carried Greg into a highly successful multinational golf merchandising and rights business. Does anyone in 2011 seriously think this was deplorable?

I fail to see what is intrinsically wrong with a JO'C or KB (Kurtley Beale) etc doing something similar - indeed, it may be very indirectly beneficial for Australian rugby's prominence and image with the under-30s if they did.

One final point: all this anti-JO'C opprobrium will vaporise as soon as JO'C does another Hong Kong special for Australia, and has a blistering start alongside KB (Kurtley Beale) for the Rebels in 2012. Australian fans remember talent and success above almost all else; a peeved RugbyWA and all the resultant 'naughty boy JO'C' moralising that has transpired will be a distant speck by the RWC. And it could be so that history may ultimately make JO'C's June 2011 decision look the smarter one, and the final impatience and brinkmanship of RugbyWA may come to look by far the greater error.

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

Nobody is questioning the skill of the bloke RedsHappy, just the way he has reportedly (and I emphasise that word) conducted himself in the negotiations. I still think he's a brilliant footballer and hope he chops 'em up out on the paddock, but he's come across as being a bit up himself. He's far from alone, but if you look at the negotiations that other players have undertaken in recent times (Beale, for example) and it's all been pretty no fuss.

I know you never miss an opportunity to criticise the Force and RugbyWA, but it is just possible that they may have made the right call here. Had this been the Reds of a couple of years ago in the same situation, would you have taken the same view? I seem to recall a fair bit of rancour around Berrick's departure and in hindsight, it was a good thing for QLD rugby. There is a chance of it turning out the same way here too.

 

[Grandmaster Flash]

Here's official statement from ARU: Signed with ARU and Rebels for two years.

http://rugby.com.au/news/wallabies_2011/james_oconnor_re-signs_with_australian_rugby,147761.html

Boom 20-year-old James O’Connor is the latest member of the Qantas Wallabies to re-commit his future to Australian Rugby.

O’Connor has inked a new two-year deal with both the ARU and the Melbourne Rebels, joining the fledgling Victorian franchise after playing the first four seasons of his professional career with the Western Force.

“This is great news. It provides certainty, both for James and for Australian Rugby,” Qantas Wallabies coach Robbie Deans says.

“While James has already made a significant impact in his career to date, there is a lot more that can be achieved and he is striving for that. The last three years have provided a good base. We are all going to be working hard to make sure that there is a lot more to come.”

Robbie has plenty to say but nothing from JO'C

 

[Jnor]

What does "boom 20 year old" mean???

 

[Sully]

Earthly Proportionate 20 year old

 

[Moono75]

I can't help drawing parrels between this whole saga and that of LeBron James in the NBA where he turned his signing with an new team into a TV show. This has been a massive waste of space and I can't condem enough the conduct with which JOC (James O'Connor) has conducted his affairs. Quite frankly I hope he enjoys 2 miserable seasons at the Rebels. He has come across as a self absorbed little shit in this whole affair. Weather that is from bad management, legal advice or the cousel of his family. It would please me no end to see the Force recruite Ma Nonu and have him steamrole right over JOC (James O'Connor) and his smug misdemeanour.

Rant over.....although I could elaborate on JOCS night out at Botanica on Friday

 

[RedsHappy]

Nobody is questioning the skill of the bloke RedsHappy, just the way he has reportedly (and I emphasise that word) conducted himself in the negotiations. I still think he's a brilliant footballer and hope he chops 'em up out on the paddock, but he's come across as being a bit up himself. He's far from alone, but if you look at the negotiations that other players have undertaken in recent times (Beale, for example) and it's all been pretty no fuss.

OK, JO'C has now (Herald Sun today) given elements of his side of this, and my highlights below are solely to show that there is arguably two sides to this matter, and that many observers immediately bought hook, line and sinker into the RugbyWA line partly as they were first cab off the PR rank and partly that people will so often believe what the established elite tells them:

"O'Connor revealed in an exclusive interview he had wanted to stay with the Western Force, but said he had no option but to look elsewhere when the club "changed the terms" of his contract negotiations.

"I had indicated to the Force my preference would be to stay another year and review second-year options after five months to make sure my rugby was developing," he said.

"They had agreed to these terms, but then I found out on Saturday they were changing these terms that had been agreed.

"To try to find a solution we proposed other options, but the Force gave me a deadline to make a decision.

"The deadline changed three times by the Force and in the end they gave me an hour to make a decision before they publicly announced they were withdrawing their offer."

TBH: I know you never miss an opportunity to criticise the Force and RugbyWA, but it is just possible that they may have made the right call here. Had this been the Reds of a couple of years ago in the same situation, would you have taken the same view? I seem to recall a fair bit of rancour around Berrick's departure and in hindsight, it was a good thing for QLD rugby. There is a chance of it turning out the same way here too.

I don't 'pick on' the Force at all, respectfully that is not correct. I am critical of many RUs in Australia, with IMO very good cause based upon hard results actually achieved (or not) given the player and $ resources they possess. My belief (as you'd know) is that the majority of Aus rugby RUs are (as of 2011) poorly governed and managed at the highest levels. The 'lack of depth of players excuse' for our general mediocrity of S14/5 results is a myth often perpetuated because observers are either inexperienced in assessing sports management quality (and thus focus excessively on individual players to explain a team's results), or won't hold top leaders/managers/coaches properly accountable as they should be held, or they simply don't want to offend the controllers of the game, for numerous varied and complex reasons.

In any event, are you happy with the Force's 2011 performance - 5 wins out of 16 games? 6 years and still trying to breakthrough to the finals? By objective standards, is this in aggregate an acceptable performance? Or do you just sense the need to show emotive fan loyalty (fair enough) vs a really hard look at how well the RugbyWA business is run over a number of years and thus judge them on output delivered, not sentiment?

 

[Geeves]

I haven't see it mentioned yet but Link's article is an interesting read about brands.