Shute Shield 2017

[WorkingClassRugger]

Because the current system is unfair. Some teams play the weaker teams twice and others only once so we don't have a level playing field. Plus the extra 4 rounds provides more rugby across all the grades and colts for us club rugby tragics.

But wasn't the rationale behind the move to 16 rounds in 2012 about addressing the competitive games issue. The idea being everyone would play each other once for 11 rounds and then split in two groups of 6 teams each for the next 5 rounds.

 

[the coach]

But wasn't the rationale behind the move to 16 rounds in 2012 about addressing the competitive games issue. The idea being everyone would play each other once for 11 rounds and then split in two groups of 6 teams each for the next 5 rounds.

I can't remember what the rationale was, or if I ever knew, but I've never been happy with it. Every year I look at the draw and note which teams have to play the previous year's playoff teams twice, which teams play the bottom teams twice, etc, and think this is so not a level playing field.

I think back in 2012 the draw for the 2nd round wasn't made until after the first round was completed with the split being top 6 and bottom 6 and the winner of the bottom 6 then going into the playoffs with the top teams from the top 6 group (or something like that), but we've left that system behind. The full year's draw is now done at the start of the year and seems very arbitrary --- drawn out of the hat?

 

[Dave Beat]

I think back in 2012 the draw for the 2nd round wasn't made until after the first round was completed with the split being top 6 and bottom 6 and the winner of the bottom 6 then going into the playoffs with the top teams from the top 6 group (or something like that), but we've left that system behind. The full year's draw is now done at the start of the year and seems very arbitrary --- drawn out of the hat?

Yep you were right, top 6 / bottom 6 based on club championship points not were each grade was sitting on the table. As we know some teams could be in the top 3 in there grade, but the club maybe floundering in the CC points

 

[amirite]

Because the current system is unfair. Some teams play the weaker teams twice and others only once so we don't have a level playing field.

This is true, but at the end of the day whilst this can mean maybe positions 3-6 on the ladder could be unfair, the best team still wins the league.

 

[sidelineview]

I believe the draw has been released.

 

[the coach]

This is true, but at the end of the day whilst this can mean maybe positions 3-6 on the ladder could be unfair, the best team still wins the league.

I completely agree, but every team aspires to make the playoffs as their first goal and the draw shouldn't make this harder for some teams than others.The current system can also impact on the club championship results.

I really haven't heard a good reason from anyone to justify NOT having full home-and-away so why the bloody hell can't we have it?

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

I completely agree, but every team aspires to make the playoffs as their first goal and the draw shouldn't make this harder for some teams than others.The current system can also impact on the club championship results.

I really haven't heard a good reason from anyone to justify NOT having full home-and-away so why the bloody hell can't we have it?

I'm not actually against reverting back to 22 rounds. Just the timing. I cannot see why they couldn't start the season 4 weeks earlier as not to conflict with the NRC. The arguments I've had so far essentially comes down to ground availability. Which could be addressed with scheduling. The weather, which again could be addressed with scheduling. Amd finally, that they won't make as much money that early in the year as compared to later on. While pverlooking that by the fact they'll have two extra revenue generating games they'll still earn more than they currently do.

 

[amirite]

I completely agree, but every team aspires to make the playoffs as their first goal and the draw shouldn't make this harder for some teams than others.The current system can also impact on the club championship results.

I really haven't heard a good reason from anyone to justify NOT having full home-and-away so why the bloody hell can't we have it?

I think the only reason is timing. If the timing works with the other pieces in the rugby calendar, then it's all good.

If fairness is an issue perhaps a conference model could be explored? Though, I can already see clear and obvious issues with it.

 

[the coach]

The grade cricket season preliminary rounds finishes on 11/3/17 and the SS started on 19/3 this year. So the 4 (?) clubs who share grounds with cricket may have to play their fist few games away which is not ideal but has happened in the past when cricket semis were being played. Dare I suggest some early season double headers at the non-cricket grounds like Uni, Forshaw and Concord to boost early season interest?

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

The grade cricket season preliminary rounds finishes on 11/3/17 and the SS started on 19/3 this year. So the 4 (?) clubs who share grounds with cricket may have to play their fist few games away which is not ideal but has happened in the past when cricket semis were being played. Dare I suggest some early season double headers at the non-cricket grounds like Uni, Forshaw and Concord to boost early season interest?

Could you send your thoughts to the club presidents. They make a great deal more sense than the current plan. Double headers, evening games etc. would all make starting earlier feasible.

 

[amirite]

The grade cricket season preliminary rounds finishes on 11/3/17 and the SS started on 19/3 this year. So the 4 (?) clubs who share grounds with cricket may have to play their fist few games away which is not ideal but has happened in the past when cricket semis were being played. Dare I suggest some early season double headers at the non-cricket grounds like Uni, Forshaw and Concord to boost early season interest?

I wouldn't mind that, though I do think there's merit to the argument that it isn't practical for 3rd-4th graders.

 

[Rugby Central]

I wouldn't mind that, though I do think there's merit to the argument that it isn't practical for 3rd-4th graders.

You mean organising lower grades isn't compatible with running higher level/elite rugby teams....who woulda thunk it

Sorry, had a couple of beers with a Xmas lunch....just couldn't resist.

Merry Christmas to all rugby tragics. I'd rather argue the merits of Rugby with GAGR-landers any day before facing the relo torment ahead. No matter how wrong I get it.

Chat to you in the new year.

 

[the coach]

I believe the draw has been released.

I assume this is the final version:
http://www.randwickrugby.com.au/news/news-2016/5435-2017-shute-shield-draw-now-available

 

[Dave Beat]

This maybe a dumb arse question.
People have said shift the SS forward.
Why not shift the NRC back?

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

This maybe a dumb arse question.
People have said shift the SS forward.
Why not shift the NRC back?

Because it's the Shute Shield that are altering the calendar. While yes, it can be argued that the SS moved their season forward for the NRC it didn't involved the subtraction of any actual rounds.

 

[Dave Beat]

The NRC may not have the same ground pressures the SS has.
Concord.
Rat Park.
TG Milner.
Uni
Is there anything stopping the NRC also being open to adjusting?

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

I assume this is the final version:
http://www.randwickrugby.com.au/news/news-2016/5435-2017-shute-shield-draw-now-available

So it's only 18 rounds but moved back. GF to directly conflict with the start of the NRC as it currently stands. Come on. How can anyone say this isn't an attempt to intentionally disrupt the NRC with that schedule?

If I were a player who is looking to move forward with their career I'd be less than impressed with that as obviously my interests weren't factored into the equation.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

The NRC may not have the same ground pressures the SS has.
Concord.
Rat Park.
TG Milner.
Uni
Is there anything stopping the NRC also being open to adjusting?

Mate, if that schedule is correct they've moved it back from the mid March start to April 1st without expanding the number of rounds. Grounds weren't an issue this season starting mid March and I doubt it would have next season. There's no reason for it to clash but for those compiling the schedule wanting to.

 

[Dave Beat]

So it's only 18 rounds but moved back. GF to directly conflict with the start of the NRC as it currently stands. Come on. How can anyone say this isn't an attempt to intentionally disrupt the NRC with that schedule?

If I were a player who is looking to move forward with their career I'd be less than impressed with that as obviously my interests weren't factored into the equation.

So if the SS launched and announced the draw and 22 rounds in August it would be the NRC who is playing silly buggers when the announce theirs in Nov.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

So if the SS launched and announced the draw and 22 rounds in August it would be the NRC who is playing silly buggers when the announce theirs in Nov.

You can reframe it all you want. But it doesn't change the fact that they've left the number of rounds the same (again according to the schedule on the previous page) while moving it back in order to conflict with the NRC.