Salary cap shenanigans

[waratahjesus]

Nonsense, If it didn't impact in recruitment or retention then they wouldn't have paid it to start with.

With due respect. Let's say player A is on 400000 and player B is on 500000. Now salary cap is 4million or whatever and the Tahs are looking rosy coming in at 3.9 when there is injury or a player leaves and they need to bump another player up to a full time contract. They need to find 150000 under the cap but they only have 100000. Now some bright spark comes up with a plan to pay him behind dear the table through his club, but being a third of his salary it would be to obvious. Instead they divide player A & Bs payments up and pay them some money this way.

Now what advantage have they got from it? Was the player being brought into th squad in a basic contract part of a bidding war? Have Melbourne lost games without his service? Have Perth not having him been the reason poccoks left?

It just boils down to bad management doing something stupid.

I'm not arguing that no penalty should be applied, if the rules have been broken then it's completely justifiable, I'm just saying that in the scheme of over 4 million if the 50 thousand figure is correct, claiming it had an impact on recruitment of other teams is a bit of hysteria.

 

[TOCC]

WJ If the $50'000 was due to unforeseen bonuses due to winning or making the GF, wallaby selection, or even due to the larger then usual injury toll which required more players, all paid through the correct channels then naturally i would agree with you. Such things happen at NRL clubs all the time.. They receive small fines at the end of the season but it's all part of the cap.

However it's the alleged fact that a club has paid the players in a manner as to circumnavigate the rules and salary cap which makes this a bigger issue then just the $50'000 figure.

 

[TOCC]

WJ, the salary cap for 2012 was $4.5million.. Or on average $150'000/ player...

So yes, I believe a 33% better offer to a player could influence retention/recruitment

 

[Hugh Jarse]

It is to do with the intent and the principles, not the amount.

The latter is to be considered as a possible mitigating factor, but of itself it does not mean that there should not be an investigation.

The red light camera will issue the same fine to the car that is 100 milliseconds after the light turns red as it does to the car that is 30 seconds after the light goes red.

 

[waratahjesus]

WJ, the salary cap for 2012 was $4.5million.. Or on average $150'000/ player.

So yes, I believe a 33% better offer to a player could influence retention/recruitment

I just fail to see in a year that the tahs lost Beale, Mowen, Waugh, Burgess that other teams could claim that 50grand prevented them from recruiting players. We're talking an extra 1% of the cap.

 

[I like to watch]

However it's the alleged fact that a club has paid the players in a manner as to circumnavigate the rules and salary cap which makes this a bigger issue then just the $50'000 figure.

The fact that it is for $50k is the biggest disappointment.
Why on the world would they not fess up to what amounts to a technical breach, given that the cap value was not set until most of the squad had been signed up.There was an argument for extenuating circumstances.

 

[TOCC]

Anyway, I've expressed my opinion, I think the Waratahs management should be punished in some form, not through a means which impacts on the fans however.. Given this is the first instance of salary cap rorting in Australia rugby, the ARU need to demonstrate how seriously they are going to treat breaches or risk other clubs doing the same ..

 

[waratahjesus]

Anyway, I've expressed my opinion, I think the Waratahs management should be punished in some form, not through means which impacts on the fans however.. Given this is the first instance of salary cap rorting in Australia rugby, the ARU need to demonstrate how seriously they are going to treat breaches or risk other clus doing the ..

Agree with you totally.

 

[Jets]

I think whatever punishment is dished out it will impact the fans. Maybe they could force them to run the organisation better and be accountable for their actions. That would be something the fans would agree with.

 

[blues recovery]

The requirement for CEOs to sign stat decs re cap compliance does not come in until 2013
There was no official 2012 cap for teams just ARU guidelines
From 2013 the cap is 4.5 million for all 5 teams
Can not understand the elaborate lengths that appear to have been gone to to pay players outside of their Super Rugby / ARU contract, very dodgy and very unecessary
and there is no way a CEO would not know these payments were being made
Penalty will be wrist slap and further public humiliation and perhaps ultimately the appointment of the current ARU Deputy CEO as the new CEO of a re combined Waratahs/ NSW Rugby Inc
That indeed would be a penalty

 

[Inside Shoulder]

public humiliation

Doesn't work on NSWRU/Tahs - plan B?

 

[Braveheart81]

The NSWRU could force (or pressure the Waratahs board to make Jason Allen to resign if the ARU doesn't.

After everything that has happened this season and the dissatisfaction of NSWRU regarding the happenings at the Waratahs in 2012, it is hard to see them not using this as an opportunity to shake things up.

 

[I like to watch]

The requirement for CEOs to sign stat decs re cap compliance does not come in until 2013
There was no official 2012 cap for teams just ARU guidelines
From 2013 the cap is 4.5 million for all 5 teams
Can not understand the elaborate lengths that appear to have been gone to to pay players outside of their Super Rugby / ARU contract, very dodgy and very unecessary
and there is no way a CEO would not know these payments were being made
Penalty will be wrist slap and further public humiliation and perhaps ultimately the appointment of the current ARU Deputy CEO as the new CEO of a re combined Waratahs/ NSW Rugby Inc
That indeed would be a penalty

Agree with most of what you say except the salary cap.
See the link attached where the ARU are reported to have increased the salary cap from this years cap of $4.0M to $4.8M for next year.
http://www.foxsports.com.au/rugby/s...-for-next-season/story-e6frf4qu-1226310114881

 

[p.Tah]

What is most embarrassing is we breach the salary cap and have one of our worst seasons. The Melbourne Storm breaches their cap and wins three premierships.

 

[blues recovery]

The story is incorrect. There was no official cap this year and the cap for next year has been confirmed as 4.5

 

[Bruce Ross]

There is one extremely worrying issue here that has not yet been addressed. If the franchise responsible is indeed the Waratahs there is the quite baffling mystery of just where they found the $50K or whatever with which to rort the salary cap. I am told that the petty cash tin has nothing but unreimbursed dockets in it - no coins and certainly no banknotes - and that the stock of postage stamps was long ago taken back to the post office to be cashed in at a discount.

$50 I can understand. They could probably get that from an office whip around, with the unpaid and gullible interns likely to be the main contributors. Even $500 if they could perhaps persuade the Board members to sacrifice a bottle of Grange from the drinks cabinet - unlikely I know but these are desperate times. But $50K? No way - unless - unless the 'Tahs have been surreptitiously privatised. But who would part with their hard-earned to buy the franchise? The only plausible explanation is that the money used to take over the franchise has not been hard-earned.

Which leads to another question. Would the few remaining die-hard Waratahs supporters - most of whom are drinking mates of waratah jesus - be prepared to come along to support the Comanchero Waratahs next season?
.

 

[I like to watch]

Bruce,I would have thought the Comanchero boys are more league types?

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Which leads to another question. Would the few remaining die-hard Waratahs supporters - most of whom are drinking mates of waratah jesus - be prepared to come along to support the Comanchero Waratahs next season?
.

Would we be game not to?

 

[Linebacker_41]

The story is incorrect. There was no official cap this year and the cap for next year has been confirmed as 4.5

There was a cap this year.

However it only applied to players signing a new contract for the 2012 season last year. Any contracts signed before last year before a cap was instigated were not included as those contracts were signed without any knowledge of the cap system.

2013 is likely to be the first year that the teams will have all players contributing to the salary cap. Mind you if someone signed at the end of 2010 for a 3 year deal for 11/12/13 then you would have to expect that they won't be included.

From a logic perspective you would hope that the salary declarations would need to occur before the start of the Super Rugby season.

Following that logic any injury replacement should not count towards the salary cap and the contracts should be short-term in nature. Eg. player out for 6 weeks with broken arm resulting in a short-term 6-8 week contract. I would hope that the this process would have a straight forward application process for exemption with the ARU.

Let's face it, it is unlikely that a club will receive competitive advantage by having injury replacements over and above the salary cap.

 

[Bruce Ross]

Bruce,I would have thought the Comanchero boys are more league types?

My mail, Iltw, is that they have diversified into the distribution of nose candy, stress reliever of choice among the A-B socioeconomic grouping.
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