Rocky road ahead for Rocky...........

[Joe Blow]

We are really missing that go-forward Palu provides close into the ruck.
Higgers made good yards there late in the game in Auckland and it will be interesting to see if he can do so early against the Boks.
Samo is the closest backrower we have to Palu in the current squad in terms of strength and the ability to take the ball forward.
He needs to be given his chance. Unfortunately he will probably replace Elsom so we will not see them working together with Pocock.
Maybe Deans will give Higgers a half at 8 and Samo a half at 8 with McCalman on the bench just in case of injury?

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

I think the idea of Cliffy is often better than the reality. He's an absolutely ideal block busting style eight, but he goes missing in matches too often for my liking. Added to that, he's been crocked a lot in the last couple of years. Is he even a chance of being available for the RWC?

 

[Joe Blow]

I think the idea of Cliffy is often better than the reality. He's an absolutely ideal block busting style eight, but he goes missing in matches too often for my liking. Added to that, he's been crocked a lot in the last couple of years. Is he even a chance of being available for the RWC?

I think it is highly unlikely.
Even if he does regain fitness in time he is notoriously slow at regaining form.

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

Yep. I've pretty much taken his name out of my probable squad.

 

[Groucho]

I think the idea of Cliffy is often better than the reality. He's an absolutely ideal block busting style eight, but he goes missing in matches too often for my liking. Added to that, he's been crocked a lot in the last couple of years. Is he even a chance of being available for the RWC?

I don't agree he goes missing at all. The games where the fans says he goes missing, are the games in which he picks up player's player points, because he's smashing people at close range in the tight.

 

[qwerty51]

We're missing Palu immensely and there's no other player capable of replicating what he does, that includes Samo. Samo to me is more of a wide runner and uses his pace more than his size, he's too lanky to go straight running into contact, similar to Timani. Palu runs straight into contact and uses his bulk and strength to bash opponents. We're missing that go forward and dominant tackling he gives us close to the ruck.

 

[Joe Blow]

Should be interesting to see how Higgers goes in that role against the big SA pack.
He may just land himself a starting role there for the RWC.

 

[Scotty]

We're missing Palu immensely and there's no other player capable of replicating what he does, that includes Samo. Samo to me is more of a wide runner and uses his pace more than his size, he's too lanky to go straight running into contact, similar to Timani. Palu runs straight into contact and uses his bulk and strength to bash opponents. We're missing that go forward and dominant tackling he gives us close to the ruck.

Samo is lanky? Have you seen him up close?

 

[Scotty]

Scotty, I take a very similar view to yours. Each spot in the back row requires a different sort of player and balance is important. Like you, I feel we need:

1, A fetcher, someone who is always at the breakdown, securing our ball or stealing theirs. They have the skills to link with the backs and the pace and/or smarts to always be at the right spot at a given time.

2, An enforcer, someone who often plays blindside and puts the hurt on in defence, carries the ball into contact, cleans out at ruck time and generally puts the shits up the opposition. These guys are often the biggest mongrels in a team (that's a term of endearment, BTW).

3, A perpetual motion machine, who is consistently carrying the ball up in attack and especially around the fringes, breaks or bends the line, spot tackles, provides a lineout option and covering field position for kicks and line breaks. In other words, your classical eight.

I feel we have a great fetcher in Pocock, with Robinson as his backup. Elsom is our best enforcer when fit and firing, though we are yet to see him at his best this season. We don't have a lot of quality backup in that position, unfortunately and it worries me. Higginbotham is potentially our best perpetual motion machine, thought it is obviously yet to be proven at test level. I don't see him as a natural 6, at least not in my conception of it anyway. Samo provides backup at 6/8 and can do either capably. That's why I like him on the bench.

Comparing to one of our better balanced backrows of the professional era:

6 Cockbain - your mongrel man, high workrate in tight and lineout option
7 Wilson - your fetcher
8 Kefu - bending the line and throw in silky skills

Kefu was the widest ranging player of these three, but you wouldn't see him much past inside centre. Cockbain and Wilson would have been lucky to get 5m from the ruck. For me the natural equivalents to these guys are:

Cockbain - McCalman (Elsom doesn't play tight enough), Dennis another option as Cutter mentions
Wilson - Pocock
Kefu - Samo

 

[wamberal]

Interesting that Mumm has not been mentioned. I cannot see Deans taking too many risks with injured players - Palu in particular. I would love to see Dennis in action at the top level, he has done some good stuff at Super level.

Rocky to 8, Higginbum to start at 6, would be my top pick at this stage. I would like to see Timani given a run as a substitute 6.

 

[Scotty]

Of course the discussions as the the 'balance' of the backrow should also take into account the tight five balance. We can carry an Elsom or Higginbotham who don't do as much work in tight if we have high work rate tight forwards. I'm thinking Slipper, Robinson, Horwill, Simmons etc.

 

[Bullrush]

I don't agree he goes missing at all. The games where the fans says he goes missing, are the games in which he picks up player's player points, because he's smashing people at close range in the tight.

I've mentioned this before but against SA and NZ, Palu's average rating from this site is 5.5.

 

[Richo]

Interesting that Mumm has not been mentioned. I cannot see Deans taking too many risks with injured players - Palu in particular. I would love to see Dennis in action at the top level, he has done some good stuff at Super level.

Rocky to 8, Higginbum to start at 6, would be my top pick at this stage. I would like to see Timani given a run as a substitute 6.

Interesting, or telling?

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

Comparing to one of our better balanced backrows of the professional era:

6 Cockbain - your mongrel man, high workrate in tight and lineout option
7 Wilson - your fetcher
8 Kefu - bending the line and throw in silky skills

Kefu was the widest ranging player of these three, but you wouldn't see him much past inside centre. Cockbain and Wilson would have been lucky to get 5m from the ruck. For me the natural equivalents to these guys are:

Cockbain - McCalman (Elsom doesn't play tight enough), Dennis another option as Cutter mentions
Wilson - Pocock
Kefu - Samo

Agree with basically all of the above. But out of the current crop in McCalman and Dennis, I'd take Dennis.

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

Interesting, or telling?

I think Mumm is probably cooked as far as Wallaby selection goes. Not aggressive enough for mine.

 

[Scarfman]

OK, I'm a Tah supporter, but Dennis, Mumm and Mowen are all guys worth looking at. Like a lot of people, I think Higginbatty might be a flat track bully. But of course, he deserves his shot, let's see what he can do. But really, we are in the shit without a fit Palu. Totally in the shit.

 

[Richo]

I think Mumm is probably cooked as far as Wallaby selection goes. Not aggressive enough for mine.

Totally agree. I think few mention him here because it's almost a consensus... although Scarfy clearly disagrees.

 

[fatprop]

I think Mumm is probably cooked as far as Wallaby selection goes. Not aggressive enough for mine.

Mumm is injured, he did his ribs playing for Uni

 

[Scarfman]

Totally agree. I think few mention him here because it's almost a consensus... although Scarfy clearly disagrees.

I don't clearly disagree - Tiptop has disappointed most of us who thought he looked like the perfect lock/6. It's just that Elsom, Palu, McCalman are not performing for various reasons, and we might have to go back to some options like Mumm, Dennis, and Hodgson that have proved only moderately successful.

 

[Joe Blow]

Samo has to be the guy.

He has played in the second row in tests and was probably Australias best performed 8 in this years Super comp.
I'm sure he would not have a problem packing down at 6 if needed(which would be rarely looking at the rest of the squad).
You would have to pick Samo over Mumm every time.

Samo is the ideal bench utility with the ability to impact a test at any given point.