Reds 2013
- Thread starter MrTimms
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There are lots of issues with how the ARU allow the Australian Super teams to run. Salary cap, limited squad size, centralised academy system and restriction of imports that don't allow them to compete on an even playing field. But that's the system and teams have to work within this structure.
liquor box
Peter Sullivan (51)
but if the talent is too spread around then we will only ever get one team into the finals, we are much better off having 2 teams that are outstanding as they will get enough points to make the finals
ChargerWA
Mark Loane (55)
Here's an idea......what's the penalty for failing to adhere to the salary cap?
Considering the other two countries involved don't have salary caps, I doubt they would be willing to enforce a penalty such as a loss of competition points, so that leaves an internal financial penalty from the ARU. Considering the Red's are pretty financial and could afford to pull the finger at the ARU, why not just splash the cash and see if they get caught.
Considering the other two countries involved don't have salary caps, I doubt they would be willing to enforce a penalty such as a loss of competition points, so that leaves an internal financial penalty from the ARU. Considering the Red's are pretty financial and could afford to pull the finger at the ARU, why not just splash the cash and see if they get caught.
tigerland12
John Thornett (49)
McArdle just stated he had confirmation that "Higginbotham has agreed to terms with the Reds and is only working out his top up with the ARU"
Dunno if we can trust Foxsports anymore but hope this is true! He'll definatly get a top-up from the ARU as he is now our premier 6
Dunno if we can trust Foxsports anymore but hope this is true! He'll definatly get a top-up from the ARU as he is now our premier 6
Bowside
Peter Johnson (47)
So from the original list in the OP,
James Hanson - Yet to re-sign
Greg Holmes - Yet to re-sign
Ed Quirk - Yet to re-sign
Scott Higginbotham - believed to have re-signed
Will Genia - Re-signed
Ben Lucas - Re-signed
Quade Cooper - Yet to re-sign
Ben Tapuai - Yet to re-sign
Dom Shipperley - Yet to re-sign
Rod Davies - Yet to re-sign
Guy Shepardson - Yet to re-sign
One would think Shipperly, Hanson and Tapuai will be next in line to negotiate new deals. Cooper's negotiations will drag on for a while as ever.
Not sure about quirk but with samo on his last legs, higgers getting some time at 8 and schatz not looking overly convincing I suspect he may stick around for a bit.
I doubt there will be much money left by the time they get to davies and shep.
James Hanson - Yet to re-sign
Greg Holmes - Yet to re-sign
Ed Quirk - Yet to re-sign
Scott Higginbotham - believed to have re-signed
Will Genia - Re-signed
Ben Lucas - Re-signed
Quade Cooper - Yet to re-sign
Ben Tapuai - Yet to re-sign
Dom Shipperley - Yet to re-sign
Rod Davies - Yet to re-sign
Guy Shepardson - Yet to re-sign
One would think Shipperly, Hanson and Tapuai will be next in line to negotiate new deals. Cooper's negotiations will drag on for a while as ever.
Not sure about quirk but with samo on his last legs, higgers getting some time at 8 and schatz not looking overly convincing I suspect he may stick around for a bit.
I doubt there will be much money left by the time they get to davies and shep.
TheBigDog
Nev Cottrell (35)
Yeh i'd be very surprised if Davies gets a new contract at the Reds for 2013. With Shipperely coming along in leaps and bounds he would have to be main priority re-signing in the winger position.
Shepardson has seen limited time with the Reds and with Anae able to cover both Hooker and Prop it seems we're covered there also.
I reckon Taps could be on the move. I just have this feeling that the Force are going to throw some big money at him that the Reds can't/won't match.
Shepardson has seen limited time with the Reds and with Anae able to cover both Hooker and Prop it seems we're covered there also.
I reckon Taps could be on the move. I just have this feeling that the Force are going to throw some big money at him that the Reds can't/won't match.
tigerland12
John Thornett (49)
Agree with Shipperely, Taps and Chibba being the next in-line to sign. I hope Quirky stays, I feel he has now established himself as a consistant member in the 22 and with Radike playing poorly and Shatzie not cementing himself, there are alot of opportunities for Eddie to take.
Holmes is another must, I'd actually place him above Hanson in importance, finding commited, loyal, tough, experienced props who can play both sides is a rariety in Australia. Slipper and Daley will develop further having Spud there aswell. Shepherdson isn't needed, which I think has been exemplified by Anae chosen as reserve prop this week. Give Anae the full contract and bring in another EPS.
Finally, I can't see us holding onto Davies, and to be honest it doesn't bother me. Diggers and Shipperely are out premier wingers, Morahan is still contracted, as is the ever talented pair of Toua and Feaiu-Sautia
Holmes is another must, I'd actually place him above Hanson in importance, finding commited, loyal, tough, experienced props who can play both sides is a rariety in Australia. Slipper and Daley will develop further having Spud there aswell. Shepherdson isn't needed, which I think has been exemplified by Anae chosen as reserve prop this week. Give Anae the full contract and bring in another EPS.
Finally, I can't see us holding onto Davies, and to be honest it doesn't bother me. Diggers and Shipperely are out premier wingers, Morahan is still contracted, as is the ever talented pair of Toua and Feaiu-Sautia
Slim 293
Stirling Mortlock (74)
Unless this is true...
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/spo...-out-of-the-reds/story-e6frg7o6-1226345202652
But it also reeks of Fainga'a bargaining...
Penguin
John Solomon (38)
I remember Greg Holmes signing a rather long contract when the Reds were in the doldrums a few years ago with players leaving left, right & centre & stating that he would never play for another team in Australia, his loyalties will always be with Qld. I'd say his signature is a given unless o/s calls strongly enough. He's just getting to the age where props really mature & come into their own, I'd like to see what he can achieve in the next couple of years.
And Tapuai is a must sign imo.
And Tapuai is a must sign imo.
T
tranquility
Guest
Greg Holmes will continue to bend bananas until he gets cataracts. He is the fabric of the club.
liquor box
Peter Sullivan (51)
I think they could do what the MLB do, they have a "luxury" tax where you can spend over the salary cap, but any amount over the cap means you have to pay a percentage of that amount back to the league (ARU) and this is split to the other teams. So if the Reds spent $5m OVER the cap they would have to pay $1m to the ARU that gets given to the other 4 teams (if under the cap) to spend on players.
The beauty of this system is that a team can set up a dynasty and earn heaps of money, and be rewarded for this, and at the same time allow struggling teams to benefit froma growing sport and to compete on players.
This is why the Yankees, Red Sox and Angels can spend over $200m per season on players and still be beaten by teams with a $50 million salary.
en_force_er
Geoff Shaw (53)
Yeah, luxury tax is an Americanism but it only really works in a system of many teams. Aussie Super Rugger has 5 teams.
C
Cave Dweller
Guest
After reading this I think back to Mourad Boudjellal owner RC Toulonnais. He was interviewed and the club already sport players like Gethin Jenkins, Delon & Guy Armitage, Andrew Sheridan, Chris Masoe, Maxime Mermoz and Frederic Michalak to their Los Galacticos collection at the Stade Mayol.
The constant announcements of signing players put a strain on the club’s resources but not the way one would think.
Then he was asked about the salary cap
RedsHappy
Tony Shaw (54)
As Harris in The Aus rightly argues today, the Aus S15 salary cap is either designed to, or has the real effect of, destroying top Aus S15 champ teams when they emerge 'so the same team doesn't win it too often'.
In a country where we struggle to get even one team as S15 champ, this type of cap is sheer madness.
As I have said before, I'd rather have a system where say two top teams can hold their talent and build consistent championship capability over a 5 yr cycle, than a system where every team is 'averaged down' to mediocrity and no team ever gets strong enough to dominate the S15 on a consistent basis. Which for multiple reasons is exactly what we have in Australia today, Reds 2011 win is looking like an aberration sadly if cap effectively prevents QRU holding all its top players and building further on them.
I'm amazed people can't see how stupid this particular capping scheme is in an Australian rugby context.
In a country where we struggle to get even one team as S15 champ, this type of cap is sheer madness.
As I have said before, I'd rather have a system where say two top teams can hold their talent and build consistent championship capability over a 5 yr cycle, than a system where every team is 'averaged down' to mediocrity and no team ever gets strong enough to dominate the S15 on a consistent basis. Which for multiple reasons is exactly what we have in Australia today, Reds 2011 win is looking like an aberration sadly if cap effectively prevents QRU holding all its top players and building further on them.
I'm amazed people can't see how stupid this particular capping scheme is in an Australian rugby context.
RedsHappy
Tony Shaw (54)
But Scotty these RU's problems had nothing to do with wildly uplifted player salaries; rather it was poor team performance and/or generally poor franchise management overall that got them into near bankruptcies.
Which brings me back to my central argument: what is crucial is not salary capping, or other forms of micro management that interferes with the franchises, but to create a 'macro' system where the crucial driver/enforcement over time is the calibre of the business and coaching management of each and every franchise. Manifestly, that is not what exists in Australian rugby today, far from it.
And the prime financial risks in Aus rugby today come from the poor accretion of external income as the teams are generally ordinary as is the management oversighting them, it's not the fault of player costs.
Just look at the crowd growth at the 2012 Chiefs home ground now they're doing so well after a total coaching and management rebuild. The same will happen in Canberra if the Brums keep it up. It's all about the management and coaching calibre, little else has anything like as much significance.
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