Continued decline in Sydney Junior Rugby

[Top Cat]

This is an exert from an email sent to a B grade team who have lost their first 2 games after there comp was re-graded. They were always in B. The club only has one team in the age group, I'm sure the boys on the bench are looking forward to their 5-10 minutes of game time each week.
I'm sure this will encourage the boys on the bench to come back next year. NOT. Maybe better player management and improved coaching might actually help the team win not excluding players from game time.

"to turn our current position around and to do this means to priorities current representative players and those assessed as having reach a higher level of skill in select positions. Equal game time will need to be abolished. Substitution will be based on game outcomes."

Reminds me of when on the District Junior RU website it had various records, with one being the highest score for each age group. The highest score at the time for my son's age group was 110-0 and the coach at the time told the boys he wanted them to break the record against a team that clearly wasn't doing too well. Come half time we were up 65-0 when my son pulled off his jersey and grabbed one from the opposition bag. One of the opposition players exclaimed, "you can't play for us your their captain!" to which my son replied that he could do what he liked.

Of course there wasn't much that he could do but he did lift the players to stem the flow of scoring to only 35 points in the second half. The result was no broken record, one unhappy coach, a smirking mum and dad, and a kid that earned the respect of many.

Glad to see such stupid records have been banished from the website.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

Read clause 2.ii and 2.ix (Code of Conduct - Coach) from the NSW JRU Code of Conduct
http://www.juniors.rugbynet.com.au/verve/_resources/1.4_NSWJRU_Code_of_Conduct_FINAL.pdf

Essentially:
2.ii - Seek to maximise the participation and enjoyment for all players regardless of ability; avoid the temptation to over-use a talented player; treat all players as equals regardless of their talent.

2.x ... ... ... Do not be a "winner at all costs" Coach.

Then read this extract from the SJRU Competition Rules:
http://juniors.rugby.com.au/Portals...es - 2013 - Version 10 - 20130426 - Final.pdf

11.0 CODE OF CONDUCT

11.1 APPLICATION OF THE CODE OF CONDUCT TO CLUBS

(A) Club and Club Affiliates must comply with the Code of Conduct. The Code of Conduct defines the expected behaviour of Clubs and Club Affiliates. Each Club is responsible for the distribution and education of the Code of Conduct to Club Affiliates. The Code of Conduct is available on the Website.

(B) A Club Affiliate shall not at any time act in a manner detrimental towards the game or spirit of rugby union.

(C) All Clubs shall take all reasonable steps to ensure that Club Affiliates do not act in a manner detrimental towards the game or spirit of rugby union.

I'd suggest that parents of the Nigel Nobodies that aren't getting fair time for their kids, take up the issue with their club officials, and if they do not get any joy there, then speak directly with SJRU Competition Manager.

Unleash the inner bureaucrat.

 

[tavytoo]

Read clause 2.ii and 2.ix (Code of Conduct - Coach) from the NSW JRU Code of Conduct
http://www.juniors.rugbynet.com.au/verve/_resources/1.4_NSWJRU_Code_of_Conduct_FINAL.pdf

Essentially:
2.ii - Seek to maximise the participation and enjoyment for all players regardless of ability; avoid the temptation to over-use a talented player; treat all players as equals regardless of their talent.

2.x . . . Do not be a "winner at all costs" Coach.

Then read this extract from the SJRU Competition Rules:
http://juniors.rugby.com.au/Portals/1/Images/Sydney Juniors - Competition Playing Rules - 2013 - Version 10 - 20130426 - Final.pdf

11.0 CODE OF CONDUCT

11.1 APPLICATION OF THE CODE OF CONDUCT TO CLUBS

(A) Club and Club Affiliates must comply with the Code of Conduct. The Code of Conduct defines the expected behaviour of Clubs and Club Affiliates. Each Club is responsible for the distribution and education of the Code of Conduct to Club Affiliates. The Code of Conduct is available on the Website.

(B) A Club Affiliate shall not at any time act in a manner detrimental towards the game or spirit of rugby union.

(C) All Clubs shall take all reasonable steps to ensure that Club Affiliates do not act in a manner detrimental towards the game or spirit of rugby union.

I'd suggest that parents of the Nigel Nobodies that aren't getting fair time for their kids, take up the issue with their club officials, and if they do not get any joy there, then speak directly with SJRU Competition Manager.

Unleash the inner bureaucrat.

with the "cost" of a rep jersey in excess of $250 per state championship and add more than that for tours and gold squad its not surprising that numbers are down if some parents are questioning the value of their little Jonny sitting on the bench and only getting an occasional run on . unfortunately the new brand of parent seems to expect perceived value for their $s rather than the pure honour of representing district.At least some of us older souls still see it with the traditional sense of pride. Also as the numbers of boys playing rugby drops we now see club and rep sides struggling for numbers and this makes it much harder to field balanced sides at the major competitions. the whole structure of youth rugby across all streams needs overhauling but it will take more than a side of 15 brave men to take it on!

 

[Man on the hill]

HJ - in a comp where coaches and managers are blissfully unaware of the requirement to rope a field and provide a ground marshal, you really think they have read this far or could give a proverbial about it - come on - join the real people.

 

[Top Cat]

Just dropped my son off to watch his girlfriend play in a school AFL carnival.

There were approximately 120 16 yld girls in attendance, something that was totally unheard of in this area a few years ago.

I'm just wondering what the ARU's plan is for the next 20 years.

 

[tavytoo]

Just dropped my son off to watch his girlfriend play in a school AFL carnival.

There were approximately 120 16 yld girls in attendance, something that was totally unheard of in this area a few years ago.

I'm just wondering what the ARU's plan is for the next 20 years.

I suspect nothing in the mainstream although recruitment of girls to 7s looks strong and the old barn door has been left open too long and many potential rugby players have moved onto the other code markets

 

[Hugh Jarse]

HJ - in a comp where coaches and managers are blissfully unaware of the requirement to rope a field and provide a ground marshal, you really think they have read this far or could give a proverbial about it - come on - join the real people.

Know that. Just giving a basis of fact that can be used to complain to a Club Committee or other relevant parties if anyone feels aggrieved as a consequence of practices such as has been implemented by the quoted mob to win the B Grade competition.

Not much SJRU can do if they not made aware of Club Associates acting in breach of the Rules and Code of Conduct.

I've been around long enough to know that many of the "unwanted" players at Under 14's - Under 17 level stay with the game and become the club stalwarts, with the occasional late developer going on to higher honours.

I've also seen umpteen Rockstar premiership winners at Under 14 level, be caught up and passed by U14 Nigel Nobodies. Lots of these U14 Rockstars do not stay with the game long term, particularly when the shine on their star grows dim.

The game seems to be in such a delicate state at the moment that we can not afford to piss off any kid/family who wants to participate.

 

[Whale berry]

Reminds me of when on the District Junior RU website it had various records, with one being the highest score for each age group. The highest score at the time for my son's age group was 110-0 and the coach at the time told the boys he wanted them to break the record against a team that clearly wasn't doing too well. Come half time we were up 65-0 when my son pulled off his jersey and grabbed one from the opposition bag. One of the opposition players exclaimed, "you can't play for us your their captain!" to which my son replied that he could do what he liked.

Of course there wasn't much that he could do but he did lift the players to stem the flow of scoring to only 35 points in the second half. The result was no broken record, one unhappy coach, a smirking mum and dad, and a kid that earned the respect of many.

Glad to see such stupid records have been banished from the website.

Is there a "mercy"rule in Junior Rugby?
Junior AFL is 90 point margin (at a break) for "A"level teams and 60 point margin at other levels. At the break when mercy is called the two teams are mandated to be evened up.
In Junior RL they simply stop playing when the margin hits 60.
Junior RU ???

 

[Hugh Jarse]

SJRU Competition Rules Extract.
http://juniors.rugby.com.au/Portals...es - 2013 - Version 10 - 20130426 - Final.pdf

Seems fairly practical but not sure that too many people are familiar with the execution of the provisions like removing players etc.

6.10 MERCY RULE UNDER 10’S TO UNDER 12’S


(A) If the difference in score between two Teams during Regular Season Matches reaches 50 points or more then the losing Team may call to stop the Match and declare the Match completed, irrespective of normal time remaining.
(B) For recording purposes the Match shall be declared a victory to the winning Team with the appropriate Competition points and for and against points awarded to both Teams at the time the Match is stopped.
(C) Team Officials, in conjunction with the referee, shall be expected to encourage the development and enjoyment of the game for all players by co-operating on "friendly game" initiatives.
(D) The failure of any Club to satisfy the Competition Manager regarding its course of action in accordance with this Competition Rule may lead to the loss of Competition points by the offending Team and the Competition Manager, at its absolute discretion, may impose further penalties.

6.11 MERCY RULE UNDER 13’S TO OPENS (UNDER 17 / UNDER 18)


(A) If the difference in score between two Teams during Regular Season Matches reaches 40 points or more then the winning Team must reduce the number of players on the field by one (1). However if the difference reduces to less than 40 points then the player can return to the field.
(B) If the difference in score between two Teams during Regular Season Matches reaches 50 points or more then the winning Team must reduce the number of players on the field by another player so that the Team is two (2) players short. However if the difference reduces to less than 50 points then one (1) of the players can return to the field.
(C) Teams who are required to reduce players in accordance with this Competition Rule must not remove front row players so as to cause the Team to play uncontested scrums. Teams must have sufficient front row players to play at hooker, tight-head prop and loose-head prop as per Competition Rule 6.9.
(D) In applying this Competition Rule when a Team has less than fifteen (15) players then the Team with the least number of suitably trained players for its scrum determines the number of players in the scrum.
(E) The failure of any Club to satisfy the Competition Manager regarding its course of action in accordance with this Competition Rule may lead to the loss of Competition points by the offending Team and the Competition Manager, at its absolute discretion, may impose further penalties.

 

[Quick Hands]

How sad that we have to have rules which say that people have to act with common decency and respect for the opposition.

Some of these parents and coaches have lost all perspective on what kids sport is about.

 

[forwards4ever]

But also a prevalent attitude at too many clubs.

 

[Top Cat]

SJRU Competition Rules Extract.
http://juniors.rugby.com.au/Portals/1/Images/Sydney Juniors - Competition Playing Rules - 2013 - Version 10 - 20130426 - Final.pdf

Seems fairly practical but not sure that too many people are familiar with the execution of the provisions like removing players etc.

I managed to find them again on an old web page. Little wonder it is hard to keep kids in Junior sport.

Age Group​

Club​

Score​

Year​

Under 11​

​

102-0​

Rd 1, 2003​

Under 12​

​

141-0​

Rd 11, 2007​

Under 13​

​

103-0​

Rd 9, 2006​

Under 14​

​

110-0​

Rd 11, 2007​

Under 15​

​

118-0​

Rd 17, 2010​

Under 16​

​

109-0​

Rd 14, 2006​

Under 17​

​

62-24​

Rd 6, 2009​

​

​

54-0*​

Rd 13, 2009​

Under 18​

​

85-7​

Rd 12, 2007​

 

[I like to watch]

Who wants to bet the coach of U13 team that put 141 another team,never tackled anyone in his life?
They should have his name and his photo next to the score,he was obviously proud of it.

 

[Quick Hands]

I refereed juniors for a lot of years and there's no way any game I refereed would have reached those scores. One of the first things I was told was if things are too one sided, stop the game early. Scores like that just shouldn't exist in junior sport.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

The positive news is that scores of that nature can not exist under current SJRU arrangements. One hopes that this has also flowed through into the District Mini competitions as the Under 6's to Under 9's games are not bound by SJRU competition rules.

 

[Jaghond]

Hopefully so HJ,

In fact, IIRC no "score" is to be kept as per the Pathwwau guidelines / rules(and certainly wasn't in the 3 (different) Minis competitions that I have experienced over the years since the introduction of "the pathway").

That is not to say that the kids don't have an idea of how they have travelled following a match ( depending upon the copaches post-match "de-brief", of course !), however, interest turns quickly turns to a good sausage & egg sambo & a drink or some lollies - and the result, whatever it was, disappears into the ether pretty quickly, which is tremendous !

 

[S'UP]

I refereed juniors for a lot of years and there's no way any game I refereed would have reached those scores. One of the first things I was told was if things are too one sided, stop the game early. Scores like that just shouldn't exist in junior sport.

I'm a current referee while i don't stop the game and there are rules in place to prevent stupid scorelines, we a team is clearly dominating and scoring at will my refereeing style will change the dominant side gets refereed at a very strict level of the law. Its a win win the donimant team learn and the weaker team gets a bit of momentum. Everyone needs to play a part.

 

[Whale berry]

Thanks for the rule info Hugh

 

[Gregor]

Good to see some sensible thought going into refereeing juniors, S'UP. I have seen your refereeing style working first hand and it makes the game a more enjoyable contest with the kids of both teams getting something out of it.

 

[S'UP]

Good to see some sensible thought going into refereeing juniors, S'UP. I have seen your refereeing style working first hand and it makes the game a more enjoyable contest with the kids of both teams getting something out of it.

Thanks I appreciate the feedback, we don't often hear any except for the negative stuff as you would expect.