Continued decline in Sydney Junior Rugby

[Hugh Jarse]

^^^^ But the strength of NZ rugby is also the schools, but it is every school, not a small number of schools in two cities. NZRU probably sit back and dribble over the quality of product that Christchurch Boys High School, Hamilton Boys High, St Kentigens, Waiopehu College, and Waikickamookau Boys High (and many others) turn out year in year out, with little resource input from them.

I'm pretty sure that there is no village club option in NZ between 13 years old and 18 years old. That is one distraction that they don't have to face over the Tasman.

The answer is theoretically simple - Get Rugby back into the CHS, AICES and CCC system. The execution of that simple answer is not so simple, and is even more difficult to implement when the peak body has no money.

In NZ, after school footy is finished, there is only one organisation running rugby in each town. Subbies footy and premier footy is administered by one body. There is a geographic heirarchy from the town and district structure into the ITM cup and Heartland cup teams. Fairly simple really.

Fully professional Players get told where they will go under the NZRU central contracting system, but this sits on the top of a very logical, simple and broad based pyramid and well lit and paved pathway to Black.

At times one feels that the ARU pyramid is so narrow in base that it could be more accurately described as a needle.

 

[mangled]

Thanks hugh jarse...

While a take your concerns on board re Saturday in the older age groups. .. I have to correct you re the numbers. .. About 4 or 5 years ago before zones were dropped there were over 10 teams in the u17s in Western zone. ... it was only when clubs "jumped" to Sunday with the relaxing of the zones that we got a really small Comp... nothing wrong with combining zones if need be at older age groups. ...

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[Quick Hands]

Not sure if you are aware QH, but private school rugby (on a Saturday) starts at U9's so not sure this would work.

The only reason my son can play club & school is that club rugby is on Friday night/Sunday.

For a very small minority of players - 13s (Year 7 is the big entry point to private schools.

 

[Quick Hands]

Not sure that Zones, as they were previously incarnated, is the way to re-organise the SJRU.

While these are very convenient for travel purposes, there was always major discrepencies in opportunities for "rep development" at Zone Level and in standard of competition within and between the village clubs in the Zones. The Northern Zone with a bazillion players could potentially field 3 or 4 rep teams, while the Southern Zone had less players than an average Northern Zone district. Easts usually didn't play at >U15. Wicks usually petered out at U16. SD typically had 2 clubs at U17.

All these rep teams ARE the problem HJ - there should be less of them not more.

 

[Quick Hands]

Thanks hugh jarse.

While a take your concerns on board re Saturday in the older age groups. .. I have to correct you re the numbers. .. About 4 or 5 years ago before zones were dropped there were over 10 teams in the u17s in Western zone. . it was only when clubs "jumped" to Sunday with the relaxing of the zones that we got a really small Comp. nothing wrong with combining zones if need be at older age groups. .

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Many clubs just take Sunday as the default position without even asking their constituents.

 

[mangled]

Many clubs just take Sunday as the default position without even asking their constituents.

That's the big issue.. SJRU can only do what the clubs/district push for. .... parents need to stop talking in the forums/sidelines and talk to Club presidents etc.. It is too late for the older age groups as they have suffered a demise which left alot of players out of the picture .. no reason you can't start back at square one with the 10s next year. ..... talk to other parents on the sidelines from other clubs. . The majority are not being heard as the club presidents are doing all the talking
. ...

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[Quick Hands]

From the NSWRU Annual report - NSWJRU section:

The introduction of the Junior Gold Cup by
Australian Rugby Union will see a change in role
of NSWJRU, in relation to representative fixtures.
This may necessitate changes to our representative
calendar but the challenge will be to retain some of
the traditional aspects such as the City Country Day.
There is a need to embrace new initiatives which
give benefit to all of junior rugby, not just our most
talented players.
The forthcoming 2014 season promises to be a
very challenging year, with participation numbers
across all constituents the hot topic of conversation
and a cause for concern. The rugby landscape is
changing and there are many issues which will need
to be addressed. The traditional rugby heartlands are
suffering decreases in player numbers and we must
reach out to areas thought of as non-traditional. With
the reduction of funding at all levels and diminishing
numbers, all involved in junior rugby face a big
challenge but one that they are very capable of
surmounting

http://www.nswrugby.com.au/Portals/3/PDFs/NSW Rugby-web.pdf

 

[Runner]

Its a noble sentiment but its tempered by a very cold reality: the strength of Australian rugby is the schools.
Letting them do the heavy lifting suits the ARU down to the ground because it costs nothing.
Its not a long term plan - its not even a medium term plan: but its THE plan.

Worth remembering that many schools are now diversifying the sports that they offer. Football and AFL have made in roads where some schools have more soccer that rugby teams while 10 years ago there was a very small soccer crowd.

 

[Quick Hands]

Worth remembering that many schools are now diversifying the sports that they offer. Football and AFL have made in roads where some schools have more soccer that rugby teams while 10 years ago there was a very small soccer crowd.

This is something that the ARU/NSWRU have been very slow (no surprise there) in recognising.

The reality is that the demographic of GPS schools has changed and there isn't the same natural inclination to rugby, cricket and rowing that there once was.

 

[WTF?]

For a very small minority of players - 13s (Year 7 is the big entry point to private schools.

Not a minority on the North Shore/Northern Beaches/Eastern Suburbs where most of the teams are from. My son's team play many of the same kids at school level and at club level. His U11 club team has more than half that play school rugby too, it has been the same for the last three years.

 

[Quick Hands]

Not a minority on the North Shore/Northern Beaches/Eastern Suburbs where most of the teams are from. My son's team play many of the same kids at school level and at club level. His U11 club team has more than half that play school rugby too, it has been the same for the last three years.

Well, at the junior club I'm involved with ( and I have access to registration lists) there are 2 boys between 6s and 12s that go to private schools which play rugby on Saturdays. I'd call that a small minority. That is on the northern beaches.

This is the issue, you're applying a Sydney wide solution to a Gordon problem.

 

[mangled]

Well, at the junior club I'm involved with ( and I have access to registration lists) there are 2 boys between 6s and 12s that go to private schools which play rugby on Saturdays. I'd call that a small minority. That is on the northern beaches.

This is the issue, you're applying a Sydney wide solution to a Gordon problem.

Yep... that has always been the issue.... Would it really be a problem if the was smaller if it was different kids having a go

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[WTF?]

Well, at the junior club I'm involved with ( and I have access to registration lists) there are 2 boys between 6s and 12s that go to private schools which play rugby on Saturdays. I'd call that a small minority. That is on the northern beaches.

This is the issue, you're applying a Sydney wide solution to a Gordon problem.

Still not sure about that. I noticed that many of the players in the Eastern Suburbs private school side my son played on Saturday were in the same club side he played on Sunday. The same goes for another large private Eastern Suburbs school.

Anyway, we can agree to disagree.

 

[Quick Hands]

The headline says it all

Football's growing popularity in private schools another sign game is breaking down barriers

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/sport/soccer/footballs-growing-popularity-in-private-schools-another-sign-game-is-breaking-down-barriers-20140509-zr71b.html#ixzz31IcCSlKz

The question is what is the ARU and the NSWRU going to be left with when more and more boys at GPS and CAS schools gravitate to soccer instead of rugby?

Is there a Plan B when there aren't as many private school rugby players?

 

[I like to watch]

They have already implemented plan B.
It's signing all the Wests Tigers discards.....

 

[Hugh Jarse]

The SJRU website seems to be a little out of date.

No Annual report for 2013. No Committee Minutes since December 2012. Front page news is all about Season 2014 start up stuff.

I believe that they used to get some financial support from "above" for their administration needs.

Have they fallen victim of the recent round of redundancies and belt tightening at ARU/NSWRU?

 

[Quick Hands]

The SJRU website seems to be a little out of date.

No Annual report for 2013. No Committee Minutes since December 2012. Front page news is all about Season 2014 start up stuff.

I believe that they used to get some financial support from "above" for their administration needs.

Have they fallen victim of the recent round of redundancies and belt tightening at ARU/NSWRU?

As an aside to this and possibly related to it. My son has always attended Camp Wallaby and Camp Waratah which are held at Riverview during the April and June holidays respectively. In years past, all staff and instructors were paid and in ARU/NSWRU attire.

I couldn't help but notice a not so subtle change during camp Wallaby in April. Parents received a message in March advising that we could attend a 3 hour session on the Sunday before the camp and if we acted as instructors during the camp, it would satisfy smart rugby obligations. I went to watch the last day of the camp and a number of the sub-groups were run by parents, overseen by an ARU staff member - one group (not my son's) didn't even have an adult running the team during the 7s tournament, the boys ran themselves.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

As an aside to this and possibly related to it. My son has always attended Camp Wallaby and Camp Waratah which are held at Riverview during the April and June holidays respectively. In years past, all staff and instructors were paid and in ARU/NSWRU attire.

I couldn't help but notice a not so subtle change during camp Wallaby in April. Parents received a message in March advising that we could attend a 3 hour session on the Sunday before the camp and if we acted as instructors during the camp, it would satisfy smart rugby obligations. I went to watch the last day of the camp and a number of the sub-groups were run by parents, overseen by an ARU staff member - one group (not my son's) didn't even have an adult running the team during the 7s tournament, the boys ran themselves.

It is a credit to your self control that (a) you took so long to tell us and (b) you think this is an aside.
These are also black marks against you

 

[Quick Hands]

It is a credit to your self control that (a) you took so long to tell us and (b) you think this is an aside.
These are also black marks against you

A glaring omission on my part - I think from memory I was debating which thread to put it on and then it passed from my thoughts.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

From: Kerry Brady <kbrady@nswrugby.com.au>
Subject: MESSAGE FOR PRESIDENTS and Club Committees ...Enough is enough!!
Date: 21 May 2014 12:43:46 pm AEST
To: Kerry Brady <kbrady@nswrugby.com.au>

Both Matt and I have been inundated with emails, calls and complaints from various Clubs with issues that in the main would NOT have occurred if Rules had been followed!!

I am dealing with over 5 incidents where Clubs have alleged incorrect/improper behaviour etc from spectators and coaches.
Some of these will go to the Citing Commissioner and some can be dealt with by the Clubs concerned.

I apologise to the many Clubs who do the right thing and are proactive but the following issues must be dealt with.

I appreciate that Clubs are staffed by volunteers and your time is limited but some attention to Rules and Codes of Conduct by all Coaches and Managers would help alleviate the situations.

If you wish the remainder of the draw to be completed and distributed we require time!!

And at the moment we are too busy dealing with incidents to get to it!!

I must insist on the following being followed by ALL:

1. ALL teams must have an identified Ground Marshall at ALL games. (It must NOT be the coach or trainer) If you do not have enough GM vests they are available for purchase and collection/postage from Moore Park.
AS OF ROUND 6 ANY TEAM REPORTED AS NOT HAVING A GM IN ATTENDANCE WILL BE DEEMED TO HAVE FORFEITED. (Rule 9.2.1 (B)) There will be NO appeal to this decision...either you have a GM or you do not....NO EXCUSES.

2. GAME ABANDONMENT: There have been several instances lately of Games being abandoned for various reasons. COACHES MUST NOT ENTER THE PLAYING ENCLOSURE TO SPEAK TO THE REFEREE AND ABANDON THE GAME. The REFEREE will make the decision to abandon a game if he considers a safety issue exists. He may seek advice/direction from the Ground Marshalls and Assistant referees.
As of ROUND 6 any team whose Coach makes the decision to abandon a game will incur a bond being paid by their Club. The Coach will also need to show cause as to why he entered the playing enclosure and he and his President will be required to attend the Judiciary!


3. REFEREE ABUSE...This will not be tolerated from anyone. Some of the young referees are refusing to ref due to the inappropriate behaviour of idiot spectators and even some coaches! We are desperately short of refs and many Clubs complain when a ref cannot be appointed...so do something!!!!
Stop your spectators being abusive, tell your coaches to pull their heads in and encourage parents to take up refereeing! The game is for the kids NOT for the parents!!

4. RACIAL COMMENTS....As most of you are aware there are persons from all ethnic groups participating in Rugby. IF YOUR PARENTS CANNOT ACCEPT THIS TELL THEM TO FIND ANOTHER SPORT!
I have had a number of reports about various unsavoury comments being directed at both players and spectators...if the persons making these comments are identified they will be cited. Recommended sanctions if found guilty of racial vilification are extremely severe!


5. ASSISTANT REFEREES...All teams MUST have an accredited referee officiating. Some Clubs have been very proactive in getting their U10-U12 officials accredited via the new on line Course whilst other Clubs have had no one do the course!
AS OF ROUND 6 ANY TEAM WITHOUT AN ACCREDITED ASSISTANT REFEREE WILL NOT RECEIVE THE 1 POINT BONUS. ONE TEAM HAS ALREADY HAD A POINT REMOVED BECAUSE OF A COMPLAINT OF NO ACCREDITED REFEREE.


6. ATTACHED ARE THE RULES AND MATCH DAY MANUAL DISTRIBUTED EARLIER....MAKE SURE ALL TEAMS ARE AWARE OF THEM.

7. TEAMS ENTER RESULTS....MATT AND I DO NOT NEED CALLS AND EMAILS ON A MONDAY STATING THAT A TEAMS RESULTS HAVE NOT BEEN ENTERED IN BUDDHA...WE DO NOT ENTER RESULTS...MANAGERS DO!!! The “cheat sheet” re using Buddha is attached AGAIN!

Hopefully this is the last email I need to write with such strong comments....Can I please implore all Clubs to get on board, cooperate and make sure ALL Managers and Coaches get the message!!!!!!
(My patience is running thin!!!)

Kerry



Kerry Brady SJRU Competitions Manager| NSW Rugby Union
IBM Centre, Sydney Football Stadium, Driver Avenue, Moore Park NSW 2021
T +61 2 9323 3401 | F +61 2 9368 7326 |M 0405 386 392 W www.juniors.rugby.com.au