Aussie Player Exodus

[Braveheart81]

The domestic economies of the various Pacific Nations are the biggest hindrance to professional rugby in those countries. Realistically they already punch well above their weight on that front in terms of international results. Even if you wanted a team of PI players it would make little sense to base it in any of those countries because the local economy wouldn't support it. As Wamberal said, Fiji would be the only potential one and even that would be dubious.

If anything, the ability for PI players to get professional contracts overseas is improving rugby for those countries, not making it worse.

The US, Canada, and Japan are amongst the biggest potential growth markets you could look to in terms of rugby and certainly it would be great if SANZAR can tap into those markets and boost their revenue in the future.

On a side note, the falling AUD will make heading offshore more lucrative for players but on the flipside should improve things for the ARU who should make more money from international broadcast rights.

 

[wamberal]

The single most important thing that we can do, as a code here in Australia, is to set achievable objectives.


There is absolutely no point deciding that we can be the dominant code. Unless, and until, the IRB wakes up to itself and changes the Laws of the game, we have to work out ways to survive. We cannot prosper, the golden days of apparent prosperity are long gone.


The high point for our code was in the late nineties, early noughties. We benefited from a perfect storm, our main rival was tearing itself apart in the Super Loig wars, we had won two World Cups and then hosted our own.

We should not delude ourselves that the popularity we enjoyed in those halcyon days can be achieved any time soon, save, as I say repeatedly, wholesale changes to the Laws of the game.

Maybe we ned to draw back into our strongholds, and forget all about expansion.

Surivival matters a lot more than egos.

 

[Slim 293]

Unless, and until, the IRB wakes up to itself and changes the Laws of the game, we have to work out ways to survive.

 

[swingpass]

not certain much of the above discussion relates to local players going OS.

although i agree we need to build the base, both for longterm player numbers but also followers i.e. consumers, who can generate revenue.

i agree with wamberal, we are sadly deluded if we think rugby is ever again going to compete with the other three "football" codes, that boat unfortunately sailed a few years ago.

cannot ever see the PI nations being anything other than feeders for NZ, OZ and France

 

[Quick Hands]

I think we can all agree that rugby will never be the dominant football code in Australia. That doesn't mean we can't grow the game here. It will never be the dominant football code in the US or Canada either, but the same applies.

It's a long hard slog from where we are now, it needs a lot of people at the grass roots doing as TOCC described on the previous page.

 

[Quick Hands]

The domestic economies of the various Pacific Nations are the biggest hindrance to professional rugby in those countries. Realistically they already punch well above their weight on that front in terms of international results.

I agree with this.

The US, Canada, and Japan are amongst the biggest potential growth markets you could look to in terms of rugby and certainly it would be great if SANZAR can tap into those markets and boost their revenue in the future.

This is what I'm talking about. This is the only thing which will substantially reduce the exodus of players to Europe. The islands may or may not be dragged along and improve with the others.

 

[Bullrush]

1. PI kids. They will play whichever code is closest to their house and/or look to have a financial payoff. Simple as that. The kids will play both codes as long as they can/are allowed to but if it looks like one in particular is going to start paying bills, that's the one they will be sticking with. It helps if they don't have to spend much money/gas to get to trainings and games etc.

2. IMO, to keep players here, you need to:

*Keep building and pumping up the NRC. This is where the future Quade Coopers, David Pococks, Stephen Moores etc will be found. The better the comp gets, the better exposure it will get and hopefully more grass roots involvement.

*Build the 'mana' of the Wallaby jersey. It's the biggest threat, to my mind, that a guy like Beale (and I've been a big KB (Kurtley Beale) fan) poses. He potentially degrades the value and honour of the green n gold. It's also why you SHOULDN'T select overseas players. The team culture and everything that players does off the field either adds or detracts from what it means to represent Australian rugby. Walking away to play in France or Japan etc should basically be seen as admitting that one probably isn't good enough - on the field or off it - to wear the Wallaby jersey.

Most guys don't play rugby to make a lot of money. It's nice and it's a huge consideration but the real players, the true future-Wallabies will play because they want to be the best player they can be. They want to test and prove themselves. They want to play the Boks, the All Blacks, the Poms, the froggies etc because that's where they will become known as great rugby players. The cost of being the best isn't always just measured in effort, hard work and determination. It will normally cost you in $$ as well if you live in Australia/NZ/SA.....

How much do you think McCaw would have been worth to a rich Frenchy over the past 10 years? Stephen Moore? Conrad Smith? How much do you think Savea or Ben Smith could get? James Slipper? I think these guys stay, despite probably being able to make more overseas, because they still have things they want to prove and achieve.

Money is obviously important but I think there are other factors that can heavily weigh against it.

 

[wamberal]

*Build the 'mana' of the Wallaby jersey.
Most guys don't play rugby to make a lot of money. It's nice and it's a huge consideration but the real players, the true future-Wallabies will play because they want to be the best player they can be.

Money is obviously important but I think there are other factors that can heavily weigh against it.

From what I have seen and heard, the general community attitude towards, and knowledge of, rugby is far, far greater and deeper in New Zealand than its is here. One of my neighbours, whose father was a rep player in New Zealand, tells me that the average mother knows and understands all the ins and outs of the game. The traditions that surround the game in New Zealand are orders of magnitude stronger than they are here. Unfortunately.

I am sorry to say that I have to disagree with your basic premise, that the love of the jersey will transcend everything else. Not in Australia, it won't. Money is not everything, but it is important here, whereas I suspect that life after rugby in New Zealand is more satisfying in every way for a Richie McCaw than it is here for a Stephen Moore, irrespective of how much they earn in their playing careers.

As for PI kids being willing to play both codes, my limited anecdotal experience is that they actually prefer to play league. Why wouldn't they? All their mates play it, their schools play it, it's on television all the time, and it has more of the elements of football that they like. Not too much tight stuff, lots of running around like a chook with its head cut off.

 

[qwerty51]

So the bad news about Jake White at Montpellier is he's now after Brumbies. Nic White strongly linked to Montpellier after the RWC.

 

[TOCC]

Bordeaux have signed Sekope Kepu :/


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[TOCC]

White is already signed to the ARU until 2016


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[southsider]

quickhands guess we will have to agree to disagree but think you are definitely showing your age with some of the comments you have said above about juniors and your attitude of "fuck it lets just throw imaginary money we don't have at a PI team" is also a bit of a worry

TOCC I agree with you, no it isn't JUST that but I think it is a fair part of it especially in a densely populated area where there ARE rugby options already existing as opposed to a rural setting such as the one you used as a example

 

[TOCC]

TOCC I agree with you, no it isn't JUST that but I think it is a fair part of it especially in a densely populated area where there ARE rugby options already existing as opposed to a rural setting such as the one you used as a example

Sorry should have clarified, not all QLD country is rural.. QLD Country is technically anything outside of Brisbane... The club I refer to wasn't established in a rural setting, it was established In a city with competing rugby union, Aussie rules and rugby league clubs in the catchment area...

In fact, the Aussie Rules team just down the road had a far better oval with new clubhouse and lights.. Our club after campaigning for 2 years eventually received a grant for lighting so we could actually train at night. The rugby league team nearby collapsed 3 years after we established our team due to falling numbers..




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[Quick Hands]

quickhands guess we will have to agree to disagree but think you are definitely showing your age with some of the comments you have said above about juniors and your attitude of "fuck it lets just throw imaginary money we don't have at a PI team" is also a bit of a worry

Go back and read the posts, I've never advocated throwing imaginary money at anything. In fact I've consistently said that things can only be implemented when enough money is generated to pay for it.

You've clearly a different world view. Good luck to you.

 

[Bullrush]

From what I have seen and heard, the general community attitude towards, and knowledge of, rugby is far, far greater and deeper in New Zealand than its is here. One of my neighbours, whose father was a rep player in New Zealand, tells me that the average mother knows and understands all the ins and outs of the game. The traditions that surround the game in New Zealand are orders of magnitude stronger than they are here. Unfortunately.

I am sorry to say that I have to disagree with your basic premise, that the love of the jersey will transcend everything else. Not in Australia, it won't. Money is not everything, but it is important here, whereas I suspect that life after rugby in New Zealand is more satisfying in every way for a Richie McCaw than it is here for a Stephen Moore, irrespective of how much they earn in their playing careers.

As for PI kids being willing to play both codes, my limited anecdotal experience is that they actually prefer to play league. Why wouldn't they? All their mates play it, their schools play it, it's on television all the time, and it has more of the elements of football that they like. Not too much tight stuff, lots of running around like a chook with its head cut off.

That's why I say BUILD the mana of the Wallaby jersey. It's not there right now seemingly. It hasn't always been as strong for the ABs as it is at the moment. Building and supporting the right culture will do that which is why I say that KB (Kurtley Beale) is a huge risk.

The statement about NZ mums is WAAAAAAAY over the top.

Finally, your statement about PI kids is just ridiculous. You imply that PI kids are more inclined to play a game with less tight stuff?! They would prefer to run around like chooks with their heads cut-off?!? WTF?!

Having once been a PI kid (am no longer a kid) can I just say what a load of BS.Whether a kid likes to stick their head in a scrum or a ruck or push in a maul has SFA to do with their ethnicity.

 

[matty_k]

Anyone else see Drew Mitchell's tweet?


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[Brumby Runner]

I believe Bernie likes him, but it just can't be. He's already contributed to the club falling towards the bottom of the Super table once. Don't want it to happen again.

 

[Braveheart81]

The next tweet was Drew Mitchell wearing a Tahs jersey. My bet is it's a story for Rugby HQ or something.

 

[qwerty51]

He re-signed recently for 2 years. '15/'16 and '16/'17

 

[Slim 293]

He's also wearing 2 year old merchandise..........