2012 Rugby Championship R5G1 Springbokke vs Wallabies @ the Bull Ring

[emuarse]

It is taute he is a good rugby player, but nobody really knows. (Saffa's won't understand this).

 

[fatprop]

I just don't rate him, simple as that. In my opinion calling him talented is drawing a long bow.

I reckon Cummins is pretty good and deserves a shot at some time, you may be using your early impressions of the guy, reports a while ago said for his first few years of pro rugby he wasn't that focussed on pro rugby. But that changed about two years ago and this season he was one of the best backs in the Aus S15 sides.

He can make things happen in both attack and defence. His only weakness is his first option is not to pass

 

[The Red Baron]

Heyneke's grown a pair and dropped Morne completely.

Kirchner, Habana, De Villiers (c), Steyn/Taute, Hougaard, Goosen, Pienaar, Vermeulen, Alberts, Louw, Bekker, Etzebeth, Du Plessis, Strauss, Beast

Bench: Liebenberg, Oosthuizen, Van der Merwe, Coetzee, Jantjies, Taute/De Jongh, Lambie

That is a good team. After their so-so form in the RC so far, they will be desperate to turn it around. Not to mention that SA have to snap a 7 match losing streak against us.

Boy this is going to be a tough game.

 

[Brisbok]

A lot has been made of the Springbok losing streak against the Wobs and there is no doubt that it is a significant streak. Particularly frustrating for myself, a South African based in Aus. There is no doubt this is something the Boks desperately want to rectify. The one thing that doesn't get a lot of air time though is the fact that for 6 of the 7 game losing streak the Boks played under PdV.

Wallaby fans spend a lot of time whinging about Robbie Deans and his record against the AB's. At the end of the day, Deans had been a very successful and well regarded coach by most rugby people around the world prior to his time with the Wallabies. There was very little negativity among fans at the time of his appointment. I wonder how they would cope with suffering under a coach like PdV for four years, a coach who it was confirmed at the time of his appointment, was not picked for rugby reasons.

I have a feeling the Boks record agains the Wobs might be slightly different in the next 4 year period. Time will tell.

 

[Scotty]

I reckon Cummins is pretty good and deserves a shot at some time, you may be using your early impressions of the guy, reports a while ago said for his first few years of pro rugby he wasn't that focussed on pro rugby. But that changed about two years ago and this season he was one of the best backs in the Aus S15 sides.

He can make things happen in both attack and defence. His only weakness is his first option is not to pass

Not exactly Robinson Crusoe when it comes to the current Wallaby backs then.

 

[BDA]

Grumbles is reporting that Timani has lost 5 kilos due to not being able to eat for two days. Anyone know what that's all about? Sounds like Douglas will be starting

 

[Braveheart81]

I expect there will be a multitude of people on this site complaining that Deans should be sacked if we lose on Saturday night.

The fact that the Wallabies have never won at Loftus will be quickly forgotten.

I think it will be a close game. South Africa have to start as favourites though.

 

[BDA]

A lot has been made of the Springbok losing streak against the Wobs and there is no doubt that it is a significant streak. Particularly frustrating for myself, a South African based in Aus. There is no doubt this is something the Boks desperately want to rectify. The one thing that doesn't get a lot of air time though is the fact that for 6 of the 7 game losing streak the Boks played under PdV.

Wallaby fans spend a lot of time whinging about Robbie Deans and his record against the AB's. At the end of the day, Deans had been a very successful and well regarded coach by most rugby people around the world prior to his time with the Wallabies. There was very little negativity among fans at the time of his appointment. I wonder how they would cope with suffering under a coach like PdV for four years, a coach who it was confirmed at the time of his appointment, was not picked for rugby reasons.

I have a feeling the Boks record agains the Wobs might be slightly different in the next 4 year period. Time will tell.

I'm sorry but was PDV not your coach when you won the Lions tour? Was he not your coach when you won the Tri-nations in 2009? PDV may be a fool but how exactly have you suffered. Typical saffer dribble. You take the view that the Boks should constantly be dominating world rugby. You Bok fans truely believe that PDV is the reason the Boks weren't crushing the rest of world rugby. A good/Bad coach can make a big difference to a team but at the end of the day the playing talent at hand will dictate where they fall in the IRB rankings. The Boks had the worlds best team in 2009 no doubt about it, but that was 2009. The Wallabies have had the better record over the boks in recent years because of the talent we've had on the park (guys like Cooper, Genia, Pocock, Horwill, O'Connor, Beale, Ioane, etc). Give credit where credit is due.

As for the next 4 years well I wouldn't get ahead of yourself. You're in a rebuilding phase now. You guys are hyped about playing at home this weekend and who wouldn't be; you're playing a virtual second string Wallabies side missing most of the stars that so often have the Boks' beating. Its a similar looking side to that which the Boks picked to tour aus last year and we all remember how that turned out. Seriously anything less than a comprehensive victory for the boks this weekend will be an embarrassment.

So far under Meyer its Wallabies -1 Boks -0

 

[randalf8]

I expect there will be a multitude of people on this site complaining that Deans should be sacked if we lose on Saturday night.

The fact that the Wallabies have never won at Loftus will be quickly forgotten.

I think it will be a close game. South Africa have to start as favourites though.

Deans is in a position where, to the fans at least, he needs to demonstrate that this "progress" we've been making over the last 5 years isn't actually just in his head. He *hasn't* defeated the ABs often enough, he *has* oversean embarrassing losses to Samoa and Scotland, so he's kinda running out of "well we've never won there!" type excuses.

I wouldn't read much into a loss in South Africa at altitude, but this guy is running out of opportunities to show us he can coach a team to tough victories consistently.

 

[ChargerWA]

I have a feeling this is not going to be pretty. I expect the Boks to win purely on enthusiasm.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

Grumbles is reporting that Timani has lost 5 kilos due to not being able to eat for two days. Anyone know what that's all about? Sounds like Douglas will be starting

Can anyone confirm if the '95 Darkness's nemesis Suzie the Waitress is now in Pretoria?

 

[BDA]

I expect there will be a multitude of people on this site complaining that Deans should be sacked if we lose on Saturday night.

The fact that the Wallabies have never won at Loftus will be quickly forgotten.

I think it will be a close game. South Africa have to start as favourites though.

I'm quite the opposite. If the Wallabies win this game, I'm back on the Deans bandwagon. As long as they're competitive ill be happy

 

[Scotty]

I expect there will be a multitude of people on this site complaining that Deans should be sacked if we lose on Saturday night.

The fact that the Wallabies have never won at Loftus will be quickly forgotten.

I think it will be a close game. South Africa have to start as favourites though.

We will if he says something like 'we never really had a chance playing here and south Africa are clearly a long way ahead of us at the moment'.

 

[Brisbok]

I don't really want to get in a slanging match with you, but unfortunately I cannot bring myself to ignore your post.

I'm sorry but was PDV not your coach when you won the Lions tour? Was he not your coach when you won the Tri-nations in 2009? PDV may be a fool but how exactly have you suffered.

Yes we did have PdV as coach in 2009. Yes, we did have a successful year. Are you forgetting that PdV inherited a World Cup winning team with the majority of those players still in their prime playing age? This team, with the exception of one or two players was the exact same team that Jake White had developed in the previous 4 year cycle.

It is well documented that the law interpretations in 2009 favoured the style of rugby the Boks were playing at this time. It is also well documented that from 2009 onwards, the Bok team was basically coached and selected by the senior players in the team. How many successful coaches can you name that are/were recently retired players? How many successful coaches can you name that are in their 30's? Yes, they were successful for a short period of time - the 2009 Southern Hemisphere season. But should a coach be considered successful if he had 1 good season in a 4 year period?

Bear in mind that South Africa's Super Rugby teams were very successful over the same period of time. They were not suffering from a lack of quality players or quality depth.

You take the view that the Boks should constantly be dominating world rugby.

When did I say that? I simply said I expect the Boks record vs the Wobs to be "slightly better" in the next 4 year period. It couldn't possibly be worse than 6 straight defeats in a row.

A good/Bad coach can make a big difference to a team but at the end of the day the playing talent at hand will dictate where they fall in the IRB rankings. SNIP.

The Wallabies have had the better record over the boks in recent years because of the talent we've had on the park (guys like Cooper, Genia, Pocock, Horwill, O'Connor, Beale, Ioane, etc).

Are you saying the Boks had a lack of quality players over this period? Bismarck, Matfield, B Botha, Burger, J Smith, F du Preez, Habana, F Steyn, Jaque Fourie. One successful year out of 4 with these players at your disposal is a pretty good return.

Its a similar looking side to that which the Boks picked to tour aus last year and we all remember how that turned out.

Clearly you have no interest in following SA Rugby or you have amnesia.

2012 (players in bold who were on the Aus tour last year):

15 Zane Kirchner, 14 Bryan Habana, 13 Jean de Villiers (captain), 12 Francois Steyn/Jaco Taute, 11 Francois Hougaard, 10 Johan Goosen, 9 Ruan Pienaar, 8 Duane Vermeulen, 7 Willem Alberts, 6 Francois Louw, 5 Andries Bekker, 4 Eben Etzebeth, 3 Jannie du Plessis, 2 Adriaan Strauss, 1 Beast Mtawarira

Substitutes: 16 Tiaan Liebenberg, 17 Coenie Oosthuizen, 18 Flip van der Merwe, 19 Marcell Coetzee, 20 Elton Jantjies, 21 Jaco Taute/Juan de Jongh, 22 Patrick Lambie

2011 (22 man squad vs Wobs):
15. Gio Aplon, 14. Bjorn Basson, 13. Juan De Jongh, 12. Wynand Olivier, 11. Lwazi Mvovo, 10. Morne Steyn, 9. Ruan Pienaar, 8. Ashley Johnson, 7. Danie Rossouw, 6. Deon Stegmann, 5. Alistair Hargreaves, 4. Flip van der Merwe, 3. Werner Kruger, 2. John Smit (c), 1. Dean Greyling. Reserves: 16. Chiliboy Ralepelle, 17. CJ van der Linde, 18. Ryan Kankowski, 19. Jean Deysel, 20. Charl McLeod, 21. Adrian Jacobs, 22. Pat Lambie.

One player in the starting 15 and 2 on the bench (possibly 3 if de Jongh is included). Yep, similar looking side.

Edit - Flip vd Merwe as well. So 3 on the bench.

 

[Moses]

What has Taute done?

http://greenandgoldrugby.podbean.com/mf/web/d78yza/HeresJaco.mp3

 

[BDA]

Clearly you have no interest in following SA Rugby or you have amnesia.

2012 (players in bold who were on the Aus tour last year):

15 Zane Kirchner, 14 Bryan Habana, 13 Jean de Villiers (captain), 12 Francois Steyn/Jaco Taute, 11 Francois Hougaard, 10 Johan Goosen, 9 Ruan Pienaar, 8 Duane Vermeulen, 7 Willem Alberts, 6 Francois Louw, 5 Andries Bekker, 4 Eben Etzebeth, 3 Jannie du Plessis, 2 Adriaan Strauss, 1 Beast Mtawarira

Substitutes: 16 Tiaan Liebenberg, 17 Coenie Oosthuizen, 18 Flip van der Merwe, 19 Marcell Coetzee, 20 Elton Jantjies, 21 Jaco Taute/Juan de Jongh, 22 Patrick Lambie

2011 (22 man squad vs Wobs):
15. Gio Aplon, 14. Bjorn Basson, 13. Juan De Jongh, 12. Wynand Olivier, 11. Lwazi Mvovo, 10. Morne Steyn, 9. Ruan Pienaar, 8. Ashley Johnson, 7. Danie Rossouw, 6. Deon Stegmann, 5. Alistair Hargreaves, 4. Flip van der Merwe, 3. Werner Kruger, 2. John Smit (c), 1. Dean Greyling. Reserves: 16. Chiliboy Ralepelle, 17. CJ van der Linde, 18. Ryan Kankowski, 19. Jean Deysel, 20. Charl McLeod, 21. Adrian Jacobs, 22. Pat Lambie.

One player in the starting 15 and 2 on the bench (possibly 3 if de Jongh is included). Yep, similar looking side.

Edit - Flip vd Merwe as well. So 3 on the bench.

Mate I think you miss interpreted my comment. Im suggesting the Wallabies side this weekend has a similar look to the Bok side that toured last year, in that it is grossly understrength.

I have neither amnesia, nor a lack of interest in SA Rugby..SA rugby interests me greatly.

 

[Richo]

Tough Bok side. I expect it to be close but a loss for Australia.

But win or lose, if the Wallabies don't execute, employ sound tactics, and show structure on both side of the ball, then Deans should be pack his bags at the end of TRC.

 

[Brisbok]

Mate I think you miss interpreted my comment. Im suggesting the Wallabies side this weekend has a similar look to the Bok side that toured last year, in that it is grossly understrength.

I can see now that I did misinterpret that particular comment, apologies. I had my blinkers on after your previous paragraph of dribble (i.e. only playing talent dictates IRB rankings with no impact from coaching) and thought you were continuing along the same line.

 

[What2040]

Wallabies by 6 - frig it and have to remain steadfast and positive
KB (Kurtley Beale) to have a blinder, Berrick only to kick long.

 

[Scotty]

I can see now that I did misinterpret that particular comment, apologies. I had my blinkers on after your previous paragraph of dribble (i.e. only playing talent dictates IRB rankings with no impact from coaching) and thought you were continuing along the same line.

That is up there with one of the worst apologies ever!