Where to for Super Rugby?

[waiopehu oldboy]

^ gave your boys a towelling in the 'gong back in March I seem to recall.......

 

[Rebels3]

^ gave your boys a towelling in the 'gong back in March I seem to recall...

Who hasn’t toweled up the Tahs this year. Haha

 

[waiopehu oldboy]

^ fair call that

 

[KOB1987]

^ fair call that

Yeah I was about to say that was an atrocious performance by the Waratahs, not necessarily a reflection on the powerhouse that is the Chiefs.

 

[zer0]

NZR's current proposed competition structures, as per: https://www.tvnz.co.nz/one-news/spo...rofessional-competition-replace-super-in-2021

2021 DRAFT COMPETITION STRUCTURE

Matches will begin end of Feb/start of March with June 19 slated for the final. Three options:

A. 8 Teams

Play all teams home and away;​

15-week regular season;​

Semifinals + Final​

TOTAL GAMES: 59

B. 10 Teams

Play 4 teams twice, 5 teams once​

14-week regular season​

Semifinals + Final​

TOTAL GAMES: 68

C. 10 Teams

Play 5 teams twice, 4 teams once​

15-week regular season​

Semifinals + Final​

TOTAL GAMES: 73

There's also some other comments on NZ franchise licensing which, IIRC, was the original intent of the review. Also:

New Zealand Rugby has expressed an interest in creating a ‘cross-border’ competition in 2022 in which the top four teams from their new tournament would face teams from other club competitions, potentially in a knock-out format.

This could open the door to Japan’s Top League, or potentially the USA’s MLR, with insiders hinting at a more ambitious global approach.

 

[waiopehu oldboy]

Seems to me that B. is the 5 x Aus + 5 x NZ option, C. is 4 x Aus + 5 x NZ + PI option & A. is the, um, other one. I doubt C. can be got ready in time so for mine it's either B. or C-PI.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

^ Cross Border competition would also open the door to Champions League concept proposed by many of the go it alone enthusiasts for Australia.

That is promising NZRU also stating this intent and would at least be area of alignment with Rugby Australia and most rugby fans on here - assuming Australia decides to go down it own path establishing its own competition.

BTW Love this comment on the roar...This ‘All Black Development League’ is not for us.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

NZR's current proposed competition structures, as per: https://www.tvnz.co.nz/one-news/spo...rofessional-competition-replace-super-in-2021

2021 DRAFT COMPETITION STRUCTURE

Matches will begin end of Feb/start of March with June 19 slated for the final. Three options:

A. 8 Teams

Play all teams home and away;​

15-week regular season;​

Semifinals + Final​

TOTAL GAMES: 59

B. 10 Teams

Play 4 teams twice, 5 teams once​

14-week regular season​

Semifinals + Final​

TOTAL GAMES: 68

C. 10 Teams

Play 5 teams twice, 4 teams once​

15-week regular season​

Semifinals + Final​

TOTAL GAMES: 73

There's also some other comments on NZ franchise licensing which, IIRC, was the original intent of the review. Also:

Why not just go with home and away for 18 rounds? What is three bloody weeks?

 

[waiopehu oldboy]

^ in theory there'll be a July International Window in 2021 so I guess they're working around that. After 2021, though, depending on whether WR (World Rugby) get their shit together there may or may not be a July Window & if not then 18 weeks (or longer if necessary) becomes an option.

 

[Adam84]

fuck new Zealand and their selfish ass attitude, they're looking out for themselves and whilst I don't disagree with their comments about the depth of the Australian sides, they have definitely taken a selfish approach to this whole situation by attempting to dictate the terms rather then have an engaging forum and invite all the relevant stakeholders like Rugby AU and pacific island representatives.

 

[Rebels3]

Why not just go with home and away for 18 rounds? What is three bloody weeks?

It’s strange. It’s counterproductive financially after clubs have openly said they need more than 7 home games to draw a profit.

I’m adamant we should keep what’s special about SRNZ and also think it’s important for Aus to keep current comp, then have a cup competition between all the Aus, NZ and Japanese teams after that’s done. It’s all very strange and appears to me people making some of these decisions have no idea about the wider sporting world and what works

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

It’s strange. It’s counterproductive financially after clubs have openly said they need more than 7 home games to draw a profit.

I’m adamant we should keep what’s special about SRNZ and also think it’s important for Aus to keep current comp, then have a cup competition between all the Aus, NZ and Japanese teams after that’s done. It’s all very strange and appears to me people making some of these decisions have no idea about the wider sporting world and what works

It's all about the ABs with the NZRU.

 

[waiopehu oldboy]

fuck new Zealand and their selfish ass attitude, they're looking out for themselves and whilst I don't disagree with their comments about the depth of the Australian sides, they have definitely taken a selfish approach to this whole situation by attempting to dictate the terms rather then have an engaging forum and invite all the relevant stakeholders like Rugby AU and pacific island representatives.

What have RA done in this regard lately?

 

[Rugbynutter39]

It’s strange. It’s counterproductive financially after clubs have openly said they need more than 7 home games to draw a profit.

I’m adamant we should keep what’s special about SRNZ and also think it’s important for Aus to keep current comp, then have a cup competition between all the Aus, NZ and Japanese teams after that’s done. It’s all very strange and appears to me people making some of these decisions have no idea about the wider sporting world and what works

That is why we would be bonkers to join a competition designed by NZRU as "an All Black Development League" - we either join a competition that is designed by parties with commercial interests in growing the wider game in the region (ie proper run league) or we control our own destiny and do our own thing.

I personally would rather we join Rapid Rugby - then the NZRU "All Black Development League' given has independent organisation brought together involved in its formation and with a CEO not beholden to NZRU or RA.

Champions League and Bledisoe matches with NZRU more makes sense for all concerned.

 

[Adam84]

What have RA done in this regard lately?

what RA haven't done is try and dictate the terms of a competition to New Zealand or excluded them from any planning forums about the competition in which it was expected New Zealand bid to apply for.

Honestly the attitude of NZRU has been nothing short of arrogant, they expect Rugby AU to bid to apply for this new competition yet have done little for engage RA in the design and outcomes of the competition. NZRU have designed this competition in isolation and dictated the terms of applying to RA and expect RA to just suck it up and take whatever offer New Zealand offers. And then NZ have the audacity to act surprised when Australia publicly refutes what NZ has offered.

 

[Rebels3]

That is why we would be bonkers to join a competition designed by NZRU as "an All Black Development League" - we either join an organisation that is designed by parties with commercial interests in growing the wider game in the region (ie proper run league) or we control our own destiny and do our own thing.

I personally would rather we join Rapid Rugby given has independent organisation brought together involved in its formation and with a CEO not beholden to NZRU or RA.

Champions League and Bledisoe matches with NZRU more makes sense for all concerned.

Yep Champions League would mean their clubs can keep to 14 games if they like. That’s 8 SRNZ games and what would be 6 Champs League games + Finals.

 

[waiopehu oldboy]

what RA haven't done is try and dictate the terms of a competition to New Zealand or excluded them from any planning forums about the competition in which it was expected New Zealand bid to apply for.

Honestly the attitude of NZRU has been nothing short of arrogant, they expect Rugby AU to bid to apply for this new competition yet have done little for engage RA in the design and outcomes of the competition. NZRU have designed this competition in isolation and dictated the terms of applying to RA and expect RA to just suck it up and take whatever offer New Zealand offers. And then NZ have the audacity to act surprised when Australia publicly refutes what NZ has offered.

What's stopping RA from laying out their vision for rugby post-Super Rugby? You call NZR arrogant but others might say they're being proactive & recognising the fact that if there's to be professional rugby in Australasia next year & beyond things need to start being put in place pretty soon.

 

[Adam84]

What's stopping RA from laying out their vision for rugby post-Super Rugby? You call NZR arrogant but others might say they're being proactive & recognising the fact that if there's to be professional rugby in Australasia next year & beyond things need to start being put in place pretty soon.

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RA has laid out their vision and tried to engage NZ on the design of the competition, it suits no one for both organisations to be designing a competition in parallel, it should be done in collaboration.

If New Zealand were genuine and not purely focussed on their own self-interests, then any new competition would have been designed in collaboration with all relevant stakeholders having suitable opportunity to provide input. Rather, the terms and conditions have been dictated to those parties they want to join, and they're expected to suck it up.

If as an organisation you act like an arrogant assholes and try and dictate the terms of a relationship purely for you own personal gain at the expense of others, then expect the other party to be offended and look at alternative options.

 

[waiopehu oldboy]

It has stated it has been engaging in plans for two scenarios 1) Trans Tasman Competition and 2) Stand it Alone 8 team competition - it has not just gone public or gone behind nations national bodies as sought to engage stakeholders

Have they now? What does either of those look like? Other than in general terms, of course, which anyone can do. Specifically, in other words.

 

[waiopehu oldboy]

^ how do you know they're consulting appropriate parties? Maybe they're not & that's why NZR are behaving the way they are, to force RA to actually say or do something that provides a starting point for further dialogue/ negotiation.