Waratahs 2013

[Bardon]

As an Irish 'Tahs supporter I don't care where the next head coach/director of rugby comes from as long as they are competent and a strong enough personality to stamp out the player power and bend the board to their will. Getting things right on the field would be a good start but they need to be fixed off the field for the long term future of the 'Tahs.

As for the players piping up about who they would like as coach, their speaking up about not wanting a heavy workload in preseason training should indicate how good their judgment is on coaching matters. If they want to be involved in coaching then they can try their hand at it when they retire. Until then stick to being players as there's plenty for them to improve on in that area.

 

[#1 Tah]

Would Poidevin's endorsement have a touch of the myrtle green about it? It wouldnt hurt the wicks to have the Tahs coach just up the road steering would be Tahs down to Coogee.

Doesn't matter - Tahs and the Wicks both need all the help they can get.

 

[wamberal]

Doesn't matter - Tahs and the Wicks both need all the help they can get.

Help from the Wicks is the last thing the Tahs need, however.

 

[Bruce Ross]

For some years now whenever there’s been speculation about a possible coaching vacancy in Australian rugby, whether at national level or with the franchises, Michael Cheika’s name has been front and centre. In recent days the Western Force begged him to come and now it appears the decks are being cleared for him to take over at the Waratahs and be given unprecedented power.

Emerging from the shadows to drive the campaign, Simon Poidevin has declared:

"Michael Cheika is the game changer that this organisation needs to sort out their culture, their leadership and their direction.

"He's got an excellent track record, both with results and ability to manage players.

"The culture he built at Leinster, from an organisation that was in the backwaters to what it is now, it is a great case study to what can be done.“


The Cheika mythology is very widely subscribed to, so perhaps it might be worthwhile looking at the actual record to see whether he truly is the Messiah.

Was Leinster really “in the backwaters” when he took over as coach in 2005? In the previous season the club reached the Quarter Finals of the Heineken Cup and were 3rd in the Celtic League. Cheika coached Leinster for five seasons. His Heineken Cup record reads: Semi Finals; Quarter Finals; 3rd in their pool; Winners; and Semi Finals. Not bad, but in the two seasons since he left: Winners and Winners. In fact 5 of the last 7 Heineken Cups have been won by either Munster or Leinster, perhaps reflective of the fact that the Irish clubs compete in the relatively soft Celtic League in contrast to the much more keenly contested leagues that the English and French clubs play in.

And what of Leinster in the Celtic League? 3rd before Cheika started then 2nd; 3rd; 1st; 3rd and 1st. And after he left 2nd and 1st. Not too much evidence of a great transformation.

He left Leinster to join Stade Français. In the two seasons before he took over Stade had finished 4th and 8th in the French Top 14. With Cheika in charge they finished 11th and 7th.
.

 

[I like to watch]

Interesting stats Bruce, as you say the stats don't measure up to the hype.
Who do you think might be the best option to coach the tahs?

 

[en_force_er]

Bruce, I think if you can take anything from Chieka's results it's that he gets results he gets are appropriate to his quality of players. Leinster and Stade's results under him are pretty consistant with what was to be expected.

The Tahs on papers should be top 3 in the Oz Conference, with Chieka's reliability perhaps they will be. Also, with the myth that follows him perhaps blokes will listen to what he says at an organisational level.

 

[Braveheart81]

The Tahs on papers should be top 3 in the Oz Conference, with Chieka's reliability perhaps they will be. Also, with the myth that follows him perhaps blokes will listen to what he says at an organisational level.

We were top three in the Oz Conference this year and it was a disaster.

On paper we should be a top 6 side in the whole comp.

 

[Bruce Ross]

Interesting stats Bruce, as you say the stats don't measure up to the hype.
Who do you think might be the best option to coach the tahs?

Todd Louden. The best development coach in Australian rugby. Outstanding record as an assistant coach in Super Rugby and as a Head Coach in the Sydney Premiership.
.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

^^^^^^^^^
We've already had this discussion Bruce.

From the archives:
Positions Vacant Thread September 14 2010

Todd Louden

Very funny.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...ssary-experience/story-e6frg7mf-1225925058278

FORMER NSW Waratahs assistant coach Todd Louden has expressed interest in the vacancy on the Wallabies coaching staff.

Louden, who was the Waratahs attack and backs coach under Ewen McKenzie in 2008, has since been coaching Japanese club Ricoh.
Out of contract at the end of the year, Louden has advised the ARU he is interested in replacing Wallabies skills coach Richard Graham, who has been appointed head coach of the Western Force.
Louden, who was also assistant coach of the Bulls when the South African team won the Super rugby title in 2007, certainly has the necessary experience and knowledge to act as the Wallabies skills coach.
..Snip ...

Shute Shield 2011 Thread December 17 2010

Inspired choice. Louden polarizes supporters. I think he will achieve success with the students but that success will be attributed to anyone apart from Louden.

I don't think he "polarizes supporters", HJ, but he always seems to have plenty of enemies working in the background

And this time around and with this club the success or failure will be attributed to him, as it should be.
..snip…

Maybe polarises is a bit strong but he certainly has his detractors as evidenced when His name has been put forward in various threads as a potential WBs, 'Tahs, reds, force etc replacement coach

The anti-Louden mob will always find ways to justify their bias and will attribute any success this year to anything as long as it is not Todd.

Yes, I understood exactly where you were coming from, HJ. Interestingly, he is very much a favoured son at Uni where I have never heard anyone bag him. He is remembered for his pivotal role, with Martin Harland, in setting up the EDS program

The same cannot be said at Randwick where he not only played but was also a very successful first grade coach, although some of the legendary figures at that club regard him very highly.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

The only problem I have with Todd Louden is that he sounds like a cross between Todd Rundgren and Loudon Wainwright III - do we get a dead skunk in the middle of the road or Todd Rundgren's Johnson?
http://www.amazon.com/Todd-Rundgrens-Johnson-Rundgren/dp/B004RIACAE

 

[AngrySeahorse]

Chieka or Louden sounds good to me.

I saw the scroll come up on Fox Sports saying Gaffney might be the Tahs coach. First thoughts - there will be some Tahs fans on G&GR who are not going to be happy with this development.

Provides some interesting news anyhow.

 

[I like to watch]

Pleeeaaaase be kidding!
It would be typical if they only 1/2 did the cleanout.

 

[waratahjesus]

Big turnaround from a couple of months ago when Gaffney was seen as the "scapegoat" that would be fired.

Whatever happens, Bowen should be next to go, the guy has flown under the radar a but but his coaching has certainly not resulted in anything on field that I can tell.

 

[I like to watch]

WJ, they all have to go. If the new guy wants to re appoint any of them that's fine.But it's got to be a clean slate for the new guy whoever that is.

 

[Braveheart81]

Tah Man is really the only member of the non-playing staff whose job should be safe.

Even the unpaid intern should probably go as we didn't get great value for money out of that appointment.

 

[waratahjesus]

WJ, they all have to go. If the new guy wants to re appoint any of them that's fine.But it's got to be a clean slate for the new guy whoever that is.

With foley originally signed for 3 years, contracts may say something different. I understand your point and agree, but reality is probably waiting for them to quit rather than be fired.

 

[Dave Beat]

Todd Louden. The best development coach in Australian rugby. Outstanding record as an assistant coach in Super Rugby and as a Head Coach in the Sydney Premiership.
.

Bruce - I disagree with that!! However, I think it is due to the board & administration - Uni's sucess comes from excellent administration, player management, and also some other benifits that are often pointed out, but lets just concentrate on what is done well.
Todd Louden, John Manenti, & Tim Lane could all clutch at that tittle.
I put the weekends victory down to coaching and executing the coaches game plan - they are both quality teams.
I think the Waratahs need to look at the board, and admin - its history would scare most coaches.

 

[Hawko]

With foley originally signed for 3 years, contracts may say something different. I understand your point and agree, but reality is probably waiting for them to quit rather than be fired.

There is a magic little note in an Australian article I saw on another thread that says that all staff at the Tahs are on a 20 week termination clause. If this is true then termination costs will not be the major driver when deciding what to do with people.

 

[Lee Grant]

That is very interesting Hawko.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

There is a magic little note in an Australian article I saw on another thread that says that all staff at the Tahs are on a 20 week termination clause. If this is true then termination costs will not be the major driver when deciding what to do with people.

Lee's right - very interesting.
The problem is have you worked out when 20 weeks is up?
I have......28.11.2012 - too late for 2013?