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Waratahs 2012

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Hawko

Tony Shaw (54)
Disappointing to see that people are concentrating on best 15's for the Tahs, I would have thought that this year's injury experiences would have concentrated people's thoughts on squads rather than best 15. IMO no one except for outside backs whose tackle load is lower should play more than 250 minutes in any four week period. The part fatigue plays in injury causation is under-recognised.

Foley had said the squad needed another prop, backrower and outside back. Elsom is the backrower, hopefully Dunning can recover from his injury and be the back-up prop and we need another classy outside back.

I think the squad is looking like Robinson, Kepu, Dunning, Ryan, Tilse, TPN, Fitzpatrick, Ulugia, Timani, Vickerman, Douglas, Mumm, Alcock, McCutcheon, Elsom, Palu, Dennis, Pretorius, McKibbin, Barnes, Halangahu, Carter, Horne, AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper), Turner, Mitchell, Pakalani, BKH, Kingston, ANO. The rookie contracts I hope will be Sio, Peterson, Jenkins, Foley and either Woodhouse or Lopeti Timani. So where are the weaknesses?
  1. If Ulugia can back up LHP then perhaps Tilse is not really needed. His form has been poor in Shute, particularly at scrum time, though he seems to grow an extra leg when he plays for the Tahs.
  2. Fitzpatrick needs to spend time in the gym before next year so he can scrummage better and show more grunt around the park.
  3. Timani is not back till March and by then will have played 12 months of continuous rugby. He will be mentally and possibly physically fatigued and will need a lighter workload up till June.
  4. Mumm will have to move between lock and backrow with only five backrowers on the list.
  5. Alcock is going well in Shute but I remain totally unconvinced about McCutcheon. We are weak at 7 and I hope Jenkins gets a rookie contract to bolster this area (he only had two games for the Force and so is still elligible.)
  6. Pretorius needs to improve his tackling if he is to be a success. I think the Tah culture will help here, the internal pressure to perform will hopefully change his now-awful tackle stats.
  7. I think Gaffney could be the making of the Carter/Horne duo. Carter with some skills development would be awesome.
  8. I'd like to see Mitchell get first shot at 15, with AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) on the wing playing like he did against the Darkness. Schmoo was flaky there early on in his career but now seems to have matured and could be the star we need to replace Kurtley. He is more in the Rogers mould with great running penetration and a good long boot though occasionally wayward.
  9. This year will be make or break for BKH. He has to step up or disappear.

Overall, despite the weaknesses, the squad is very strong. At last we've got a decent draw, good backs coach and 2012 might be our year. Still, our squads were very strong in 2005 and 2008 and we ran into two great Crusaders teams those years. Who knows what the other teams will be like but you'd think the Crusaders, Blues with Nonu, Reds, Stormers and Sharks will be very tough. But optimism is definitely not unrealistic!
 

waratahjesus

Greg Davis (50)
just picking the best 15 Hawko due to the inability to do so most of this year.

i know squad rotation will come up again, but the fact is witht he tahs we chop and change our backline (be it injury or selection) and we need to settle and give one combination a serious amount of time to gel and form next year.
 

SuperGrover

Darby Loudon (17)
Alcock has looked really good for Eastwood, abrasive at the ruck and difficult to tackle in the open - he is a decent S15 unit and will do until a we find an upgrade

Good to see Elsom come home, a clear upgrade on Mowen

I think many of us can already see one... Jenkins
 

fatprop

George Gregan (70)
Staff member
Disappointing to see that people are concentrating on best 15's for the Tahs, I would have thought that this year's injury experiences would have concentrated people's thoughts on squads rather than best 15. IMO no one except for outside backs whose tackle load is lower should play more than 250 minutes in any four week period. The part fatigue plays in injury causation is under-recognised.

Foley had said the squad needed another prop, backrower and outside back. Elsom is the backrower, hopefully Dunning can recover from his injury and be the back-up prop and we need another classy outside back.

I think the squad is looking like Robinson, Kepu, Dunning, Ryan, Tilse, TPN, Fitzpatrick, Ulugia, Timani, Vickerman, Douglas, Mumm, Alcock, McCutcheon, Elsom, Palu, Dennis, Pretorius, McKibbin, Barnes, Halangahu, Carter, Horne, AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper), Turner, Mitchell, Pakalani, BKH, Kingston, ANO. The rookie contracts I hope will be Sio, Peterson, Jenkins, Foley and either Woodhouse or Lopeti Timani. So where are the weaknesses?
  1. If Ulugia can back up LHP then perhaps Tilse is not really needed. His form has been poor in Shute, particularly at scrum time, though he seems to grow an extra leg when he plays for the Tahs.
  2. Fitzpatrick needs to spend time in the gym before next year so he can scrummage better and show more grunt around the park.


  1. Tilse is a good LHP - one bad game doesn't change that fact

    Fitzpatrick doesn't need to get bigger (he is massive), he needs to get better at the tight work
 

waratahjesus

Greg Davis (50)
no point signing another 7, alcock has imporvement and comitment isnt a problem, plus someone is off contract at the end of the year and *spoiler alert* the tahs have already talked to him and there has been a bit of interest both ways.
 
S

StonerJack

Guest
I hope you're talking about Pocock.

The Tahs need as much cock at 7 as possible.

I would be absolutely chuffed if our Tahs managed to sign Pocock but it would be bad news for Australian rugby because the Force need him. He's their only marquee player now that O'Connor has gone and if he was to go they would be up shit creek.
 

Lee Grant

John Eales (66)
As mentioned in the first post in this thread: KB (Kurtley Beale) is going to be missed next year. As others have mentioned, and we all knew, he was the Tahs main source of creativity. Scrummie Sarel P. will create stuff but his are more individual efforts. It is important therefore that the Tahs outside backs be trained to run off him as the Reds guys do off Genia.

Drew Mitchell can be relied upon to go looking for work and finding it but I am not so sure about the others.

On one hand I am enthused about watching new players from last year, Kingston and B. Foley, playing a lot more, but on the other this may mean that there have to be injuries for that to happen, notwithstanding that there are more games.


Alcock is a terrific player when his side has the ball. But like a lot of players who come into pro rugby he can have trouble on defence; not so much tackling, but reading where to be for a shoulder tackle to be made. This is usually the problem of new backs but it can happen to opensides too. It is part of the technical side of their job as much as poaching the ball - or for a hooker, throwing the ball to the lineout, yarda, yarda.

His bad reads in South Africa last season which enabled a couple of easy tries, blotted his copybook, which had been fairly clean before that. When I watch a 7 at any level of rugby I want to see him get as many oohs and aahs on defence as for on attack. After all, the other mob have the ball, on average, half the time.
.
 

Ash

Michael Lynagh (62)
Would be surprised if it was Pocock - his wife is from WA and I thought they were pretty well settled there. What opensides are actually off contract at the end of this (if that is what WJ meant) year?

Gill is off contract next year, and I think Hooper, Fainga'a and (edit:) Saffy are all tied up as well. Hodgson was re-signed by the Force recently, and Beau Robinson was also re-signed by the Reds, as if I recall correctly. Process of elimination hints at Pocock.
 

qwerty51

Stirling Mortlock (74)
Sydney could potentially bring more charity opportunities to the table. Something David is very keen on. I know he's already involved with a few in Sydney through twitter.
 

Ruggo

Mark Ella (57)
George Smith comming home and wanting to settle close to family in Sydney making the Tahs a good fit?
 

Lee Grant

John Eales (66)
IIRR Hooper's Brumbies contract was for 2011 and 2012 although it may have been revised. If not the Manly lad would be a natural for the Tahs.

When I saw Hooper at the Oz Schools tournament in 2008 and Gill in 2009 I thought these two would be contending within a few years with rising star, David Pocock. To this end the sooner Hooper and Gill can be the starting 7s week in week out, the better. Gill's time will come at the Reds but Hooper got the run around a bit at the Brumbies and this year didn't start until Round 8. Moreover his leaving there will leave the field open for the other fine young 7. Colby F to start more regularly also.

Alcock and McCutcheon have 2012 to turn all that on it's head but I wouldn't mind seeing Hooper in light blue colours.

Come home son.
 

Braveheart81

Will Genia (78)
Staff member
As a born and bred Sydney boy, I am sure he must find the idea of playing for the Waratahs totally reprihensible.

P.S. Magenta is the universal colour for sarcasm.
 

Slim 293

Stirling Mortlock (74)
You seem pretty sure about that, but do you have anything other than a strongly worded sentence to back that up?

He was always loyal to the Brumbies and would re-sign without fuss.

I won't be surprised if he comes back in one of Jake Whites mentoring roles when he finishes in Japan.
 
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