Wallaby Watch 2014
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Ruggo
Mark Ella (57)
Short Memory hey.
2008 fantastic
2009 fantastic
2010 injured
2011 fantastic
2012 injured
2013 Good Lions series but poor RC and EOYT. First real form slump the man has had in his career.
T
Train Without a Station
Guest
His form seems to be improving as his fitness increases. Funny that.
BDA
Jim Lenehan (48)
Yeh it seemed like a few of our serious players looked out of sorts after the lions tour. no doubt a mentally draining season
T
TOCC
Guest
One game?
He has had a number of good games this year, this isn't the first...
It is what it is
John Solomon (38)
There is one consistent theme to comments about Horwill - everybody seems to want to see him do well.
It's rare for anyone to ever criticise him for a lack of effort or passion.
I think it comes down to differentiating between his effort and the resulting outcome.
For mine he has played better in the past but maybe an 80-90% Horwill is still good enough to play for the Wallabies until somebody comes along clearly more deserving.
I'm old school, I like to see champions given an extra chance until a challenger figuratively knocks them out.
It's rare for anyone to ever criticise him for a lack of effort or passion.
I think it comes down to differentiating between his effort and the resulting outcome.
For mine he has played better in the past but maybe an 80-90% Horwill is still good enough to play for the Wallabies until somebody comes along clearly more deserving.
I'm old school, I like to see champions given an extra chance until a challenger figuratively knocks them out.
Tomikin
David Codey (61)
I agree he was also playing a woeful rebels team not the All Blacks.
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BDA
Jim Lenehan (48)
I'm a big BIG fan of Skelton and think he could become one of our best test forwards in the coming years, but it is pretty clear he is still developing. Whether he is ready to face the All Blacks this year i not so sure. Luckily their are blokes that are a lot more qualified than me that will make that call in august. I'm on the fence with that one. I think the safe decision would be to choose Carter. But then again I wonder whether playing it safe is ever going to beat the all blacks. Tactically you have to chance your arm against them.
Even as a massive Skelton fan its hard to deny that his set piece work just doesn't measure up to Horwill, nor does his work rate.
Even as a massive Skelton fan its hard to deny that his set piece work just doesn't measure up to Horwill, nor does his work rate.
qwerty51
Stirling Mortlock (74)
What do you mean not ready? Did he not prove against the French that he is going to make a bigger impact in terms of effectiveness than either Horwill or Carter could make? No one is saying he could match it 80 minutes with the All Blacks because he doesn't need to. He will most likely be coming off the bench and providing 30 minutes of effectiveness. If Carter starts and then there's 30 minutes or so left for one lock you can't tell me Horwill would be preferable to Skelton. 5m out from the line when you need a try, would you rather Skelton carrying it up against tired forwards, Skelton or Horwill? Who's going to attract defenders late in a game freeing up a Beale or Folau? Who's going to smash McCaw in a ruck when he's about to cause a critical turnover? Sure there's the set-piece argument but we're not going to beat NZ with a safe set-piece and I trust Link to work around his weakness in that area.
BDA
Jim Lenehan (48)
Agree with a lot of that qwerty, and I'm not saying that Skelton isn't ready. He may be. I like to think he is. I'd like to see him play against the blacks because not only does he make an impact but he sells tickets, he gets people excited, he gives us and the players hope that this year is going to be different than the last decade. Leaving all of that aside, he is unquestionably still quite rough around the edges. The All Blacks are masters of taking advantage of weaknesses and Skelton has a few in his game at this stage in his career.
I have faith in Link. If he includes him in the side then ill be happy with the decision. If he's left out, well id guess that link didn't think he was there yet, and im fine with that.
I have faith in Link. If he includes him in the side then ill be happy with the decision. If he's left out, well id guess that link didn't think he was there yet, and im fine with that.
T
Train Without a Station
Guest
I thought Skelton was good on debut but due to all the overhyping and overrating I've changed my mind.
He will get eaten alive against the AB's.
In fact he won't. But we will because his work rate is nowhere near what it needs to be and they will feast on those rucks that he is lumbering too when he should be running too.
Nobody doubted his impacted. Everybody doubted his ability to consistently have that impact frequently in test rugby. Nothing has disproven that.
He will get eaten alive against the AB's.
In fact he won't. But we will because his work rate is nowhere near what it needs to be and they will feast on those rucks that he is lumbering too when he should be running too.
Nobody doubted his impacted. Everybody doubted his ability to consistently have that impact frequently in test rugby. Nothing has disproven that.
qwerty51
Stirling Mortlock (74)
If has a 30-20 minute stint his workrate will be fine.
Has he been a weakness at the Tahs? Yes I know Test rugby and all that crap but the Tahs have plenty of other impact players in TPN, Kepu, Palu etc. and have they suffered because of it? Right now they have the best defence in the competition so would be had to claim their pack is getting run off their feet. I haven't even seen teams try to run at Skelton because he makes his tackles and they stick.
Has he been a weakness at the Tahs? Yes I know Test rugby and all that crap but the Tahs have plenty of other impact players in TPN, Kepu, Palu etc. and have they suffered because of it? Right now they have the best defence in the competition so would be had to claim their pack is getting run off their feet. I haven't even seen teams try to run at Skelton because he makes his tackles and they stick.
T
Train Without a Station
Guest
Qwerty, 5 minutes to go, somebody makes a half break and we're relying on a lock to push himself and run the extra 10 metres to clean out the jackal and secure clean ball, I'd rather it be Horwill.
Not saying that's any reason to favouring, just it works both ways.
Scotty
David Codey (61)
I am going with Qwerty on this one. I'd have Skelton - we won't beat the ABs playing safe, we will beat them by being physically dominant in the contact area.
Horwill or Carter to start, Skelton the impact lock off the bench.
Horwill I'd suggest is also Simmons back up.
Horwill or Carter to start, Skelton the impact lock off the bench.
Horwill I'd suggest is also Simmons back up.
T
Train Without a Station
Guest
No point having this discussion. You clearly ignored every good involvement he had in the test series and the second half of the super season to form your views.
T
Train Without a Station
Guest
We won't beat them with x-factor or any other BS term people use to describe players who bring something outside the core role of their position without fulfilling those core roles first.
We won't beat them by doing that because it leaves other weaknesses, and they certainly wouldn't do that.
Arguable their best lock the past decade has been brad thorn. He hardly did any of skelton's positives. He was too busy doing is core role well.
Before you liken their clean out ability, it's a moot point when it's not done at the same frequency.
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