#1 Tah
Chilla Wilson (44)
Lets not mention Samoa here...... Please......
Tri-Nations Game 2 All Blacks V Springboks - 2011
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Lets not mention Samoa here...... Please......
MajorlyRagerly
Trevor Allan (34)
There's no way this is going to be the rout alot of you are predicting - NZ vs Safa games rarely are.
NZ were disjointed & disconnected against Fiji & the Aus backline was in motion - although the Aussie forwards were in good form, it was the backline which caused the blowout. Our backs look 5% as lethal as yours this year.
I will be PISSED if we don't win but that's only due to the weakness of the Boks.
Can't see anything stopping Aussies winning the 3N & RWC this year. Seriously.
NZ were disjointed & disconnected against Fiji & the Aus backline was in motion - although the Aussie forwards were in good form, it was the backline which caused the blowout. Our backs look 5% as lethal as yours this year.
I will be PISSED if we don't win but that's only due to the weakness of the Boks.
Can't see anything stopping Aussies winning the 3N & RWC this year. Seriously.
Blue
Andrew Slack (58)
Which others?
mark_s
Chilla Wilson (44)
Steyne? Pinnear?
Steyn, playing too deep
FDP -injury is catching up with him
Botha - he is struggling to play without being a penalty magnet
Blue
Andrew Slack (58)
Steyn - Yep. His days are numbered. Had a poor season other than goal kicking. He is on this tour to prove himself and it is not going well with Lambie breathing down his neck and noises in the Bok camp that James will get the two home tests. Butch James will start in the RWC. Take that as a given.
FDP - My news is that he came back from injury too early which was evident from his play for the Bulls. I will reserve judgment on him until we see the home leg. From what I have been told he is in peak condition. Enough class to come back strong.
Botha. Nuff said bit there's loads of man love for him amongst the coaches. Bekker would have pushed him hard and I reckon would have taken over the starting position. He will play, bit I foresee him being replaced early by Rossouw. Botha played through a back injury for most of the Super season. He actually wore a back brace.
Time will tell how our oldies hold up. That's not our real problem. Coaching and tactics are where we will come unstuck. I have little or no faith in the coaching team.
Gnostic
Mark Ella (57)
I don't rate Butch at all. The Bok may well find themselves in trouble with the likes of Wales and Samoa if they start him at 10. As I said earlier I don't think they have the players now for their territorial and kick chase game which they perfected in 2009 and James is definitely not a creative 10 to get them over the line otherwise. Add in the fact that he was a cheap shot merchant and penalty magnet (has this changed?) and he could be a real liability at the RWC. Lambie is by far a better option, but IMO they have to get a better 9 and Pienaar.
T
TheNextBigThing
Guest
Just calling him a cheap shot merchant is a disservice to his defense. granted a lot of his tackles are of the "Look ma, No hands!" variety but he is a bruising and effective defender.
James's biggest problem is that he's too keen to take on the line himself. It seems like a massive waste though to put a ball-runner between the Bok forwards and their lethal centre pairing.
PdV can choose two uncreative but serviceable 10s Steyn (who merely feeds the man outside him way behind the advantage line) or James (never feeds the guy outside him, always makes the advantage line). Then again he could pick a young creative, urgent and threatening talent who combines the best facets of both players and a strong offensive awareness. Thankfully I don't think he'll make the correct decision.
James's biggest problem is that he's too keen to take on the line himself. It seems like a massive waste though to put a ball-runner between the Bok forwards and their lethal centre pairing.
PdV can choose two uncreative but serviceable 10s Steyn (who merely feeds the man outside him way behind the advantage line) or James (never feeds the guy outside him, always makes the advantage line). Then again he could pick a young creative, urgent and threatening talent who combines the best facets of both players and a strong offensive awareness. Thankfully I don't think he'll make the correct decision.
Blue
Andrew Slack (58)
Question: Did you guys watch Butch play for Bath over the last three years? I saw quite a few of the Bath games and was pleasantly surprised. But the test will come in the home leg of the 3N and we'll see then. HE certainly has some deficiencies in his game but the reports are that his kicking game improved out of sight. I fear the selectors will be overly cautious with Lambie. I'd start him in a heartbeat.
Agree Pienaar was poor. I expected a lot more of him but in all honesty nobody would have performed behind a piss poor pack. Pienaar was at times sublime for Ulster this yeat in the Magners and European games. We need FDP in form. Badly.
ACT Crusader
Jim Lenehan (48)
Pinnear was awesome in a couple of ML games i watched this year. He's a good bench option for the Boks.
The guy that really has gone off the boil is Kockett. I was never a fan of his antics, but he was an effective halfback and had quickness to boot
The guy that really has gone off the boil is Kockett. I was never a fan of his antics, but he was an effective halfback and had quickness to boot
Nusadan
Chilla Wilson (44)
Also Fiji usually play above themselves in the RWC, remember 2007? They almost beat the Saffies in the quarter final then...
Leads me to think with such a tough pool, what price odds for Saffies to miss the quarter finals? Anyone know of any juicy odds out there?
Worth considering putting on a few quid there, might be the best odds we will get for the whole of the RWC!
Blue
Andrew Slack (58)
Towards the end of the season the Setanta comms were talking him up as the best halfback in the comp so I wouldn't write him off after one average game behind a shit pack. In fact, he could well play himself into the starting 15 if FdP doesn't find form.
Kockott was all the goods two years ago and looked a real contender but hist discipline is terrible. The Sharks let him go because of it which was a bit short sighted because he is better than McCleod.
Blue
Andrew Slack (58)
Go to betfair and lay it yourself. If there's not market yet I am sure they will put it up if yo ask them. They are quite good with that sort of thing.
We have to play Aus or Ireland in the last 16 right? Hope it's the Oirish.
mark_s
Chilla Wilson (44)
Actually, I originally thought Fatprop was referring to PdV. When is his contract up anyway?
Sandpit Fan
Nev Cottrell (35)
Blue, you think there might be a bit of value in starting Charl McLeod for Pienaar, with Lambie at 10? As others have said, the Bokke looked a lot sharper on attack with Lambie on the field, and I though Pienaar had a pretty ordinary game - a lot of throwing his arms in the air at ruck time and appealing to the referee, with little success.
I think they will man up against the AB's after this outing, but can't see them getting the win.
I think they will man up against the AB's after this outing, but can't see them getting the win.
Mank
Ted Thorn (20)
I find it strange that people have this view of Butch. I suspect it's because most people like or expect to see a Quade Cooper style flyhalf, full of running and that is your definition of creative? Butch has never had quick feet but his best attribute is very quick hands and very good awareness of spaces on the rugby field. It means that played with some decent outside backs he is able to put the ball into the correct places. I'd suggest that no other flyhalf in SA has come close to his vision for years. His tactical kicking has also been good for a long time, and did come on further in the NH. TheNextBigThing, I think your view of him being a ball runner is completely false.
This image of him being just a cheap shot merchant has stuck with him, unfortunately these things are hard to shake. The interesting thing about it is people will call almost all his tackles as no arms tackles when in fact almost all are legal. This demonstrates the point that bad images are very hard to shake. He of course does have the odd illegal tackle which unfortunately keeps the image even more intact.
Gnostic
Mark Ella (57)
My view of James is from my personal observations. They are dated as he hasn't been a regular in the SH for some time and I don't get Setanta. That said my view was formed when he engaged in outright shoulder charges (without even the excuse of being a reformed Mungo used to doing such things legally) and was also binned for more than one head high shot. I will be interested to see how his kicking game has improved as I always thought it a strength of his (coming from a low base of expectation as prior to QC (Quade Cooper) the Oz has not fielded a good kicking 10 apart from Flatley in the Pro era). Apart from his kicking game I didn't see James as anything exceptional in either his personal game either running or passing, or in his organisation and ability to manage a backline into attacking positions. I will be unpleasently surprised if he proves these points wrong when the Wallabies travel to the Republic.
On the other hand Lambie is brilliant with ball in hand, very good kicking from hand and place and while he needs some work at crucial aspects of 10 play such as controlling and setting up a backline he has shown enough IMO to be getting the attention focussed on him as the most likely to unlock opposition defences.
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