The Tahs 2009
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Lee Grant
John Eales (66)
I was attempting a scientific study of the Waratahs for 2009 and I am struck by the number of vacancies that have to be filled since there are 5 players going offshore, 1 retirement and probably 2 going to other franchises.
8 is a lot of spaces to fill and I wouldn?t be surprised if the Waratahs have to use their full quota of 5 rookies. This means that two experienced squad players will be replaced, in effect, by the 2 extra rookies compared to 2008.
This would put the Tahs at risk should there be a 2007 type injury toll and are forced to use too many inexperienced players but I think it will become inevitable for all Oz S14 franchise to have to deal with this offshore situation from now on.
There may be experienced blow-ins who are signed up before the 2009 S14 to avoid that but, on the other hand, some of the players we assume can be re-signed will get better offers.
So who will be the 5 x 2009 rookies if we have to use that many?
? Ratu Nasiganiyavi - signed for 2 years already
? Dan Palmer ? signed for 3 years already
? Adam Byrnes (Queensland?s poach not confirmed yet) or Chris Thompson ? both have had 1 year with Junior Waratahs and Byrnes has played in Europe.
? Lachlan Mitchell - replaces Harris ? has had 1 year with Junior Waratahs
? Ben Coridas or Patrick McCutcheon ? both have had 1 pro year with Junior Waratahs.
As for standard contracts: first you have to consider which of the 2008 rookies are worth promoting.
? Sepoku Kepu has been re-signed for 2009 (only)
? Alfi Mafi has been poached by the Brumbies
? Dave Dennis was injured during the ARC and I haven?t seen him since. I will assume that he won?t be promoted and that Coridas/McCutcheon can cover anything he was going to do.
Next you have to consider which players are definitely leaving or have retired:
? Ben Jacobs ? contract taken by Robbie Horne who had only an Academy contract at the start of 2008, but probably played too many S14 games to qualify as a rookie for 2009.
? Dan Vickerman - assume replaced by Campbell/Treloar blow-in.
? Al Kanaar - a spare contract for an experienced blow-in in some spot.
? Sam Harris ? L. Mitchell to cover his occasional reserve spot.
? Rocky Elsom ? Mowen to move to 6 but someone like Scott Fardy (apparently available for the Tahs now) or similar to take the contract spot.
? David Lyons ? Tim Davidson to get another 1 year deal, as per 2007, until someone else shows up.
Next you have to look at players with standard contracts whose contracts expire:
? Jeremy Tilse - contract spot to Kepu.
? Matt Cararro ? should be renewed.
? Ben Mowen - should be renewed to play 6.
? Daniel Halangahu ? should be renewed
? Will Caldwell ? reportedly re-signing for one more year.
? Adam Freier ? re-signed for two years.
? Al Manning - Roster spot to 4th rookie. 3rd string hooker can come from Academy.
? Josh Valentine ? will probably go back to the Reds, or to the Force, depending if he can get an ARU top up. Otherwise will probably go offshore if he can get a gig. Spot on roster goes to 5th rookie.
This will leave the Tahs with a squad of:
Props: S. Kepu, Benn R, A. Baxter, M. Dunning, D Palmer (R).
Hookers: TPN, A. Freier
2nd row: W. Caldwell, D. Mumm, Byrnes/Thompson (R), Campbell/Treloar (B)
Backrow: P.Waugh, Beau R, B. Mowen, S. Fardy (B,S), W. Palu, T. Davidson (S), Coridas/McCutcheon (R).
Scrummie: L. Burgess, B. Sheehan,
Flyhalves K. Beale, D. Halangahu
Midfield: T. Tahu, T. Carter, R. Horne, L.Mitchell (R).
Wing: R. Nasiganiyavi (R), L. Tuqiri, L. Turner, M. Cararro
Fullbacks: SNK, B. Batger
33rd man: A. Nother (B) A blow-in for any position.
Note 1 - R = Rookie / S = Or somebody similar / B = Blow-in from overseas or players returning from other S14 teams.
Note 2 - There are only two contracted scrummies in this list but Jeremy Sua should be given a professional Academy spot to be 3rd string. Ditto for hooker Damien Fitzpatrick who has had 1 year in the amateur Academy already. Lock Siviteni Mafi should be promoted to the Professional Academy also.
Note 3 ? Don?t give unfavourable comments on the players mentioned UNLESS an alternative is suggested. I don?t think some of them are great shakes either, but I was struggling.
8 is a lot of spaces to fill and I wouldn?t be surprised if the Waratahs have to use their full quota of 5 rookies. This means that two experienced squad players will be replaced, in effect, by the 2 extra rookies compared to 2008.
This would put the Tahs at risk should there be a 2007 type injury toll and are forced to use too many inexperienced players but I think it will become inevitable for all Oz S14 franchise to have to deal with this offshore situation from now on.
There may be experienced blow-ins who are signed up before the 2009 S14 to avoid that but, on the other hand, some of the players we assume can be re-signed will get better offers.
So who will be the 5 x 2009 rookies if we have to use that many?
? Ratu Nasiganiyavi - signed for 2 years already
? Dan Palmer ? signed for 3 years already
? Adam Byrnes (Queensland?s poach not confirmed yet) or Chris Thompson ? both have had 1 year with Junior Waratahs and Byrnes has played in Europe.
? Lachlan Mitchell - replaces Harris ? has had 1 year with Junior Waratahs
? Ben Coridas or Patrick McCutcheon ? both have had 1 pro year with Junior Waratahs.
As for standard contracts: first you have to consider which of the 2008 rookies are worth promoting.
? Sepoku Kepu has been re-signed for 2009 (only)
? Alfi Mafi has been poached by the Brumbies
? Dave Dennis was injured during the ARC and I haven?t seen him since. I will assume that he won?t be promoted and that Coridas/McCutcheon can cover anything he was going to do.
Next you have to consider which players are definitely leaving or have retired:
? Ben Jacobs ? contract taken by Robbie Horne who had only an Academy contract at the start of 2008, but probably played too many S14 games to qualify as a rookie for 2009.
? Dan Vickerman - assume replaced by Campbell/Treloar blow-in.
? Al Kanaar - a spare contract for an experienced blow-in in some spot.
? Sam Harris ? L. Mitchell to cover his occasional reserve spot.
? Rocky Elsom ? Mowen to move to 6 but someone like Scott Fardy (apparently available for the Tahs now) or similar to take the contract spot.
? David Lyons ? Tim Davidson to get another 1 year deal, as per 2007, until someone else shows up.
Next you have to look at players with standard contracts whose contracts expire:
? Jeremy Tilse - contract spot to Kepu.
? Matt Cararro ? should be renewed.
? Ben Mowen - should be renewed to play 6.
? Daniel Halangahu ? should be renewed
? Will Caldwell ? reportedly re-signing for one more year.
? Adam Freier ? re-signed for two years.
? Al Manning - Roster spot to 4th rookie. 3rd string hooker can come from Academy.
? Josh Valentine ? will probably go back to the Reds, or to the Force, depending if he can get an ARU top up. Otherwise will probably go offshore if he can get a gig. Spot on roster goes to 5th rookie.
This will leave the Tahs with a squad of:
Props: S. Kepu, Benn R, A. Baxter, M. Dunning, D Palmer (R).
Hookers: TPN, A. Freier
2nd row: W. Caldwell, D. Mumm, Byrnes/Thompson (R), Campbell/Treloar (B)
Backrow: P.Waugh, Beau R, B. Mowen, S. Fardy (B,S), W. Palu, T. Davidson (S), Coridas/McCutcheon (R).
Scrummie: L. Burgess, B. Sheehan,
Flyhalves K. Beale, D. Halangahu
Midfield: T. Tahu, T. Carter, R. Horne, L.Mitchell (R).
Wing: R. Nasiganiyavi (R), L. Tuqiri, L. Turner, M. Cararro
Fullbacks: SNK, B. Batger
33rd man: A. Nother (B) A blow-in for any position.
Note 1 - R = Rookie / S = Or somebody similar / B = Blow-in from overseas or players returning from other S14 teams.
Note 2 - There are only two contracted scrummies in this list but Jeremy Sua should be given a professional Academy spot to be 3rd string. Ditto for hooker Damien Fitzpatrick who has had 1 year in the amateur Academy already. Lock Siviteni Mafi should be promoted to the Professional Academy also.
Note 3 ? Don?t give unfavourable comments on the players mentioned UNLESS an alternative is suggested. I don?t think some of them are great shakes either, but I was struggling.
We lack height, David Dennis blew a knee (I think) and is in the "Mumm" mold and may be worthwhile as a lock/6 and with no Elsom and Vicks we need lineout options.
Get rid of Badger, Turner is the reserve 15 unless Badger is showing something in club land.
Get rid of Badger, Turner is the reserve 15 unless Badger is showing something in club land.
F
formeropenside
Guest
Noddy said:
The Force might want him, but I cant see the Reds taking him back.
spectator
Bob Davidson (42)
Force sounds like the best option for Valentine. Reds have Lucas and Genia with maybe Swanepoel (Aus schools 07) in the Academy. There are also a few decent halfbacks in the local comp like McKibbin (Brothers) and Armstrong (Sunnybank) who could fill in when required.
So nah.. we don't want him..
So nah.. we don't want him..
Lee Grant
John Eales (66)
fatprop said:
At 192 cms Dennis is not a lock option in the S14; so he has to be considered as a flanker who is not a lineout option except as a novelty every now and then. He has already had a rookie contract; so which of those backrow players with standard contracts would you drop from my list for him - given that Fardy is 198cms and good in the lineouts?
Batger's contract extends into 2009 so you can't get rid of him just yet.
Noddy said:
The Tahs didn't need him this year or much last year; so he's excess baggage. An injury can change that thinking but the U/20 scrummie Sua is very handy to have in the Academy to step up if needs be and is a cheaper option. As former and spectator indicate: the Force should be interested in him.
AussieDominance
Trevor Allan (34)
It's fair to say Nathan Charles may pip Damien Fitzpatrick at the post - Selection at U20 over Fitzy must say something? Richard Casali is on an amateur contract next season I am pretty sure you know of any others stepping up to amateur status Lee?
Lee Grant
John Eales (66)
AussieDominance said:
Yeah that's fair to say AD.
Charles could get precedence as he was the Oz Schools reserve hooker in 2006 whereas Fitzy was the Oz Schools hooker and skipper last year and is a year younger. He was the shadow hooker for the 2008 U20 squad if the other two got hurt, which is no disgrace.
Charles has played more senior rugby than Fitzpatrick since Fitz didn't get his first starting senior game until the weekend before last. I don't know that Charles got a 1st Grade start in 2007 the year after he left school as Fitz did. It was natural that Hanson (the 2005 schools hooker) and Charles (2006) got chosen ahead of Fitzpatrick (2007) for an U20 team this year. For next year when one is 2 full years out of school, and the other 1 full year we can compare Fitzpatrick and Charles on equal terms.
But Fitz was chosen to be in the NSW Academy this year and the older Charles wasn't - and Hickey, the new Tahs coach and Fitzpatrick's Eastwood coach, has talked in glowing terms (in a recent Tah Talk episode) about Fitz, who has already played for NSW A.
But the important thing is not the name of the professional Academy hooker, but the fact that the Tahs can afford to have their third stringer in the professional Academy and thus a full timer. I would not do to have a 3rd string hooker who was an amateur in this day and age; nor a 3rd string scrummie, for that matter. These fellows are the defacto 34th and 35th members of the Tahs squad but don't get paid as much.
No, I don't know the names of any new NSW Academy guys for next year except for Casali who has been mentioned by you a couple of times, but is unknown to me. I will watch him at Newington tomorrow with a lot of interest.
Noddy - you're a stirrer but I still like you.
ACT Crusader
Jim Lenehan (48)
Why did Hangers fall out of favour?
I've watched a bit of club stuff this season adn I don't think he's that bad.
The Brumbies could do with a backup 10 if he's not on a NSW contract
I've watched a bit of club stuff this season adn I don't think he's that bad.
The Brumbies could do with a backup 10 if he's not on a NSW contract
ACT Crusader
Jim Lenehan (48)
Scarfman said:
Sabbatical.....
Lee Grant
John Eales (66)
ACT Crusader said:
He's probably the best flyhalf in the Sydney comp at the minute; not that he always plays there for Uni. His contract expires this year. It would be foolish for the Tahs not to renew it.
I see that Adam Freier has renewed his contract with the ARU and has elected to stay with the Waratahs. Thats good news. I will edit my study of the 2009 Waratahs accordingly.
ACT Crusader
Jim Lenehan (48)
naza said:
Yeah I've noticed Uni have shuffled him around a bit, still I think he could be plying his trade at S14 level, even as a bench option.
Speaking of club rugby, I was hearing from a couple of guys down here that Rathbone will be playing club rugga this weekend? Anyone confirm
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