The dying - perhaps death - of Rugby in Australia.

[What2040]

Free to air would be interested in this product? This is the same Free to Air that had purchased the rights to a number of games at last year's RWC, Rugby's showcase event, but then refused to show the games live on one of their two channels because it clashed with their other regular programs? This was the RWC being played in New Zealand, so kick off times were very 'viewer-friendly' for the Australian audience. Yet the majority of the games they decided to show were delayed and in fact screened late at night.


The kiwi/aussie audience cannot relate to the teams from South Africa, but they can definitely relate to the teams in Japan?
Out of interest, the Reds struggled to fill Suncorp stadium for their knockout game against the Sharks earlier this year, what size crowd do you reckon they'd draw for a game against a Japanese club team?

Mate, just need to market that game amongst the Japanese Souvenir Shops and Jap Honeymooners on the Gold Coast - it will be sold out

 

[Schadenfreude]

If sports were followed only on the basis of success, England would have given up on Football circa 1970.

Winning isn't what entertains, it's the competition.

 

[Interestedoz]

I was wondering how long it would take for a thread like this to surface (I've been lurking here for a while) The OP is certainly not the first to be talking about the demise of rugby in Australia. I agree to a point. I'm sure rugby itself will survive. But perhaps it is more accurate to talk about the demise of the Australian rugby team as a GENUINE world champion contender. This is where I have found it difficult as a supporter. Even in the 80's one felt the Wallabies were always in a least with a chance of victory against the AB's. Those days have gone.

One point I agree with is that to lose 10 successive Bledisloe cups requires quite a lot to be wrong. More than just the current team and coach.

There is plenty of "it's ok to be 2nd" type rhetoric around which I guess goes to what I am talking about above - the fact the Wallabies are no longer contenders - and maybe it is ok to be second. But that is very difficult to take for many followers of a once highly competitive champion Wallaby team.

 

[liquor box]

The last Lions tour was a raging success. But it did not have any apparent long-term impact.

I think it was a success for tourism and for Rugby fans, but does the casual observer actually know that it is coming up, and do they know what the Lions are?

I think the Lion tour is awesome, but I am already a fan of the sport. I doubt it will do anything to improve the game or make it more popular in the long term. It is just a better quality version of a P.I team, we need to play countries so we can get some hatred and tribalism happening.

 

[liquor box]

I was wondering how long it would take for a thread like this to surface (I've been lurking here for a while) The OP is certainly not the first to be talking about the demise of rugby in Australia. I agree to a point. I'm sure rugby itself will survive. But perhaps it is more accurate to talk about the demise of the Australian rugby team as a GENUINE world champion contender. This is where I have found it difficult as a supporter. Even in the 80's one felt the Wallabies were always in a least with a chance of victory against the AB's. Those days have gone.

One point I agree with is that to lose 10 successive Bledisloe cups requires quite a lot to be wrong. More than just the current team and coach.

There is plenty of "it's ok to be 2nd" type rhetoric around which I guess goes to what I am talking about above - the fact the Wallabies are no longer contenders - and maybe it is ok to be second. But that is very difficult to take for many followers of a once highly competitive champion Wallaby team.

Losing 10 in a row to the All Blacks should be considered the same as Georgia losing to Australia 10 times in a row, there is a massive difference in class between the two teams and 90% of the time the better team will win.

 

[Braveheart81]

When people talk about losing 10 series in a row, it needs to be considered that from 2002-2005 it was only a two game series, 2007 was a 2 game series and 2008-2010 were 4 game series.

It is much harder to win the thing back when it is a two or four game series.

 

[Train Without a Station]

LB, pretty sure it is nothing like that.

 

[Train Without a Station]

When people talk about losing 10 series in a row, it needs to be considered that from 2002-2005 it was only a two game series, 2007 was a 2 game series and 2008-2010 were 4 game series.

It is much harder to win the thing back when it is a two or four game series.

How many of these did we draw?

 

[Scotty]

If the plan meant that the salaries for our top rugby players dropped by half overnight, do you not think that we'd lose half the stars that make the game marketable?

Do you have knowledge of some statistics or study that I don't or did you just make up 'dropped by half overnight' to be contrary?

 

[Dam0]

How many of these did we draw?

2004, 2007 and 2011.

Against that, you have to remember that 1999, 2000, and 2002 were also drawn, so if we are going down that track the great Wallaby reign of 1998-2002 doesn't look so impressive either.

I personally think that a 3 match series is preferable to just 2. I'm not so worried about a 4 game series - partly because 4 tests is traditional.

 

[It is what it is]

If rugby wants to become more popular in Australia it needs to accept that it's in the entertainment business.
Fox and Channel 9 are entertainment providers and the entertainment provided at test level, while barely passable for the loyalist, is pretty ordinary for the average sports follower.
Ratings = Revenue for these guys, it's as simple as that. There are no hidden agenda's, it's all about financial return.
International tests are the showcase of rugby.
I think the Wallabies have scored 6 tries in their last 6 tests.
With all the regular add-ons like anthems, lead-ins, haka's etc, each test takes around 2 hours of time out of people's lives who have plenty of other entertainment options available to them.
12 hours of viewing to see 6 tries from our National Team just doesn't cut it.
And as for the rules of the game.....blah.

 

[Schadenfreude]

Nein and RL agreed to make the game easier, so there would be more tries scored, so there would be more ad breaks.

I can't stomach watching it anymore.

I should probably just suck it up and get foxtel.

Failing that, I should just go and watch local and schools rugby...

 

[ACT Crusader]

Nice to know that there are some optimists around. I used to be an optimist once, back when the Bledisloe drew over 100,000 and the Shute Shield final drew over 15,000.

I was pretty sure that many of the PI families migrating to Australia would bolster our playing ranks, but now I see that most of them actually prefer league, or at least their kids do.

Hugh, there is absolutely no guarantee that the kids of Kiwi and Saffer migrants will opt to play rugby. My next door neighbour is a Kiwi, mad keen rugby follower, his 14 year old nephew is playing league in Sydney, much to his chagrin. I wonder how many times over this conversion is happening?

TOCC, I know that rugby is now not being played seriously in many traditional high schools. How many "non-traditional schools" are taking it up? As a serious sport, by the way, not just for fun. Women playing rugby is a good thing, but it will not save the game at the elite level.

Can you provide some data about the massive increases in junior levels? By the way, bear in mind that Gordon club in Sydney apparently has the largest junior enrolments in Australia. Their first grade team ran nowhere this year, and they get a few hundred to their home games. So junior numbers do not necessarily translate into anything.

Drop the gate prices an you might get the 100,000 crowds back....

In a market sense rugby is being squeezed between the other two codes, but there is IMO both negatives and positives that come from that. Rugby will always have a core following but it can be the code that provides a real point of difference with the national team the key focus. Essentially it becomes 1 national team vs individual clubs. That is a huge weight in their favor IMO. Focus on that because without FTA coverage of Super rugby, provincialism will not compete, but the Wallabies tests are still on the anti-siphon list so will have that FTA coverage to leverage off.

I've been in OZ most of my life and have seen peaks and troughs in support/interest but I still think its strong despite the relative boosts that AFL and NRL have made recently.

 

[Groucho]

I'm sorry but I have very little time for pessimistic people, to even suggest that rugby union is dying is a complete and utter joke.

Super Rugby ratings the past 24 months have been significantly greater then they have ever been in the past. The Wallabies semi against the AB's rated significantly higher then the 2003 RWC equivalent.

At junior levels Victoria, Queensland and WA have all experienced massive increase this year.

Sevens rugby is growing, especially in the number of girls playing.. Rugby Union is reaching into non-traditional schools not only in QLD but in NSW as well.

75'000 people in Sydney just turned out to watch the Wallabies play a team we rarely ever beat, a further 50'000 will do it in a few weeks in Brisbane as well.. Hardly sounds like the grim reaper is knocking on the door

Exactly. What a cacophony of self-indulgent drivel we have here.

 

[exISA]

I agree there is room to greatly improve the development process.. However in the context of this article, does that mean rugby union is dying?. No it doesn't

Whether juniors all progress to the elite level is regardless, the fact remains that they are the future generations of fans, sponsors and corporate support as well..

(I will preface the following paragraph with the statement I LOVE football (Soccer) , I follow it as religiously as I do Rugby) By your logic in you last sentence, Soccer should be super popular - its one of the most (if not THE most ) played Junior sport in Australia and has been for decades? APpart from grand finals and the every 4 year supporter - where there hell are these droves of juniors supporting the game? Soccer in Australia is a joke both on the administration side and on the spectator side. Again I love the game - this isnt a bash soccer statement, its fact.

The game of rugby is percieved to be dying because of the lack of success of our national side since the 2003 world cup loss in the final (I still believe how ever that England side despite its boring nature of play was one of the best sides to win the world cup - so clinical in all its game) .

 

[Schadenfreude]

I wonder if NZ rugby was dying up until they won the last world cup.....

 

[p.Tah]

Don't worry Balmain will save us

A KERRY Packer-style revolution of rugby union is being planned, with Balmain Rugby Club in discussions with Channel Ten and Fox Sports about staging a new million-dollar competition.
Balmain president Warren Livingstone, who has previously brought internationals Sabastien Chabal, Drew Mitchell and Matt Giteau to play for the suburban rugby club, is behind the idea.
The founder of Aussie supporter group The Fanatics wants to establish a competition that bridges the gap between Super Rugby and the Shute Shield.
The eight-team competition would start after the Super Rugby season ended and include double-headers at Leichhardt Oval on Friday nights.
Teams would be made up of Super Rugby players not selected for the Wallabies, emerging young players, rugby league converts and international marquees.
Prizemoney of $1 million would be offered on a "winner-take-all" seven-week competition, which would be made up of Sydney clubs including Balmain.
Just as cricket changed when the World Series Cricket was started in 1977 - recently documented in Channel 9's Howzat: Kerry Packer's War - Livingstone said a similar revolution was needed in rugby.
"This isn't supposed to be anti-establishment, but something new is needed," Livingstone said.
"The reality is something new needs to come along, because the Shute Shield's days are numbered."
Livingstone, who has helped guide Balmain from suburban fifth division in 2005 to promotion to first division next year, said the unnamed competition would look at rule changes to make it more attacking.
"It's got to be based on attacking rugby if it's on prime time," he said. "With the rugby league double-headers on Channel 9, we want to offer something to other networks to show."
Former Wallaby Ryan Cross, who now plays with Balmain, said a competition to bridge the gap between Super Rugby and Shute Shield was needed.
"South Africa and New Zealand have the Curry Cup and ITM Cup, but we haven't got anything," Cross said.

http://inner-west-courier.whereilive.com.au/news/story/1m-rah-rah-revolution/

 

[Bon]

I wonder if NZ rugby was dying up until they won the last world cup...

Don't think so. Apart from not having a second win in the WC tournament the All Blacks still had a pretty impressive record and commanded the lions share of the media reports.
Interestingly the news this morning reported that soccer had more junior players than rugby in New Zealand

 

[Braveheart81]

Do you have knowledge of some statistics or study that I don't or did you just make up 'dropped by half overnight' to be contrary?

I took a stab in the dark.

I've done some more research and the SANZAR TV deal is heavily weighted towards test rugby (or at least the deal was when it was the Tri Nations. It is about 2/3 - 1/3). I have no idea whether disbanding Super Rugby would have an impact on revenue from Supersport South Africa for the Rugby Championship as they provide a big contribution.

I just don't get why FTA television would suddenly have a massive interest in rugby if there were more provincial games between us and NZ. That is where the revenue would drop off would occur. As it stands, Foxtel sells a lot of subscriptions because of the rugby they have available. For FTA it is not a big drawcard because the games rate worse than re-runs of Two and a Half Men.

I also don't think more viable primetime content is necessary for FTA. If you look at the NRL, Channel 9 pay a fortune to show one game live on Friday night, one game delayed on Friday night and a slightly delayed game on Sunday. Super Rugby could already provide that if there was a FTA demand for it.

I think the best path for the ARU to take with Foxtel would be to try and get Channel 10 to simulcast one game a week on Saturday night. They could show it live and being only one game, it wouldn't detract from Foxtel's product that sells pay TV subscriptions.

 

[BDA]

I think national sporting performance is cyclical, and in term the interest generated is also cyclical. Last year it felt like rugby was going through a resurgence because there was more casual interest resulting from the Reds' success and the WC. This year our teams have performed poorly, and in such a competitive sporting landscape, interest has waned. I wouldn't let that get you down Wamberal. We’ll have good years again. Next year will hopefully be one (with the Lions tour) and again in 2015.

I guess if you're pining for the days of Aus rugby being a powerhouse, i agree that seems unlikely as long as the sport is isolated to GPS Schools.

Better yet, if you want to resurrect Australia as a rugby powerhouse, simply kill AFL. Our national sporting performances, including our Olympic results, are badly affected by the ridiculous number of people playing AFL (a game which does not particularly interest me).