Super Rugby 2022

[Drew]

You mean when the Brumbies went with in a bee dick in beating the Crusaders away..

Fair play I forgot that one.

 

[Dan54]

Fair play I forgot that one.

Yep, I still reckon the gap isn't really there with Reds and Brumbies looking quite capable of knocking over any of Kiwi teams. I still think what made it hard was playing to much of similar style teams early in season and taking time to readapt to different style of rugby. That,s why I reackon it better to avoid the same style of comp next year, I still see Reds, Brumbies and Western Force beating a few kiwi teams, with the best of them being in top 3 so with every chance.

 

[Adam84]

Let’s not kid ourselves, NZ teams have had greater retention and recruitment then Australian teams since the 2021 season, that’s on the back of larger funding grants and player depth in New Zealand. Imagine signing the likes of RTS (Roger Tuivasa-Sheck) to an Australian team!

There won’t be a fair competition while there is such a disparity in resources on offer to the respective teams. Introduce equal funding distribution and a salary cap system amongst the teams on both sides of the Tasman and we might see an equal competition.

Until that happens you’re going to have resistance from fans in Australia because no one is interested in watching their team continually lose. It kills fan support as it did during Super Rugby

 

[waiopehu oldboy]

^ pretty sure that even allowing for exchange rates Aus salary cap is significantly higher than NZ's.

 

[Dan54]

I not sure even what payments for any teams are, but buggered if I know how there is unequal funding etc, and certainly don't know what different salary caps there are? Who has put different salary caps on different countries, and if it was true that Sanzaar (or whoever running comp)has done it, I would consider it pretty unfair myself.
How much is RTS (Roger Tuivasa-Sheck) getting paid?I don't think he getting big money. I thought he came to rugby because he wanted to play for All Blacks, but I only read the odd article on him.
Not sure what other unfair sharing of resources there is. Maybe player depth, but that is something RA could make quite a difference too when they are in the mood to run a NRC type comp to build depth.
But regardless I still don't believe Aussie teams are as bad as the pessimists in here think. Tahs and Rebels if they like last year would struggle, but bugger me they were pretty poor in just the Aus comp, and not in anywhere near the same class as Reds and Brumbies. But one would hope they improve, and Force (who are probably now my Aus team) is a team I really looking forward to seeing.

 

[zer0]

This is the current setup in NZ:

Player agreements sit outside Super Rugby and All Blacks salaries which are paid by NZ Rugby, with the five clubs operating under a salary cap. In order to secure a big name player, a club can source third party funding which must be declared to NZR, as the Blues did, for example, when signing Beauden Barrett and, more recently, Warriors captain Roger Tuivasa-Sheck.

These agreements are uncapped, and can boost some players’ annual salaries by as much as $250,000, Stuff understands. Super Rugby retainers range from $75,000 to $195,000, with regular All Blacks earning over and above that on a tiered scale. Tuivasa-Sheck is understood to be on around $400,000 next year, Stuff reported in February, plus third party deals which the Blues were tight-lipped on.

Stuff

www.stuff.co.nz

For Australia:

It is understood the ARU has agreed to raise the cap from $4 million to $4.8m following concerns about the ability of Super Rugby teams to retain players. But the ARU's annual grant to the five Super Rugby franchises - the Brumbies, Western Force, Melbourne Rebels, Queensland Reds and New South Wales Waratahs - will remain the same at about $4m. The teams will have to come up with the additional $800,000 themselves.

...

The cap will replace the contracting protocols that have governed player salaries in Australia since the game went professional in 1995. Under the protocols, teams tended not to pay any player more than $110,000 plus benefits and match payments, but they can now pay players whatever they like under the confines of the cap.

Australian Rugby Union set to increase salary cap from $4 million to $4.8 million for next season

ARU set to raise salary cap

www.foxsports.com.au

The exchange rate from kiwi pesos to dingo dollars isn't that great atm so translating the NZ values to AUD:

	NZD	AUD
MIN	75k	72k
MAX	195k	187k
MEDIAN	112k	108k
RTS (Roger Tuivasa-Sheck)	400k	384k

EDIT: As for RTS (Roger Tuivasa-Sheck), seem he earns less that half of what he did in League.

Tuivasa-Sheck, who earns $A1.1 million a year, is joined by Bulldogs playmaker Kieran Foran and the Cowboys' Tongan test star Jason Taumolo (both $1 million) as the three New Zealanders in the seven-figure annual salary bracket.

Stuff

www.stuff.co.nz

 

[kiap]

^ pretty sure that even allowing for exchange rates Aus salary cap is significantly higher than NZ's.

Possibly in the past. Not recently.

Force CEO Tony Lewis (ex Makos) went through the comparative financials in an interview some time earlier this year. Oz Rugby is still broke.

"But whadabout Twiggy?" OK, he might have some spare change but AUS soup salaries are still under a low cap.

Only way this changes is by a reboot of Aus rugby. It might start to happen, but it hasn't yet.

 

[Derpus]

This is the current setup in NZ:

Stuff

www.stuff.co.nz

For Australia:

Australian Rugby Union set to increase salary cap from $4 million to $4.8 million for next season

ARU set to raise salary cap

www.foxsports.com.au

The exchange rate from kiwi pesos to dingo dollars isn't that great atm so translating the NZ values to AUD:

	NZD	AUD
MIN	75k	72k
MAX	195k	187k
MEDIAN	112k	108k
RTS (Roger Tuivasa-Sheck)	400k	384k

EDIT: As for RTS (Roger Tuivasa-Sheck), seem he earns less that half of what he did in League.

Stuff

www.stuff.co.nz

I reckon RTS (Roger Tuivasa-Sheck) is gunna slaughter. He was great in league - only held back from being considered one of the best by a lack of participation in in SoO imo. And the All Blacks currently have Bridge in their outside backs.

Lure of the ABs is huge huh. Imagine taking a more than a 50% pay cut just for a shot at it. Meanwhile current Wallabies leave for a 20% pay bump.

 

[Adam84]

Possibly in the past. Not recently.

Force CEO Tony Lewis (ex Makos) went through the comparative financials in an interview some time earlier this year. Oz Rugby is still broke.

"But whadabout Twiggy?" OK, he might have some spare change but AUS soup salaries are still under a low cap.

Only way this changes is by a reboot of Aus rugby. It might start to happen, but it hasn't yet.

Yep and during that interview, or one of those he said he envies the resources available to New Zealand teams compared to Australians, not just salary cap but size of the funding grants and payments for coaches and team staff, Australian teams don’t get that . Ex Makos CEO would have a pretty good grasp on the facts and disparity.

Australian salary cap has actually declined 10% for 2022, conversely no decrease in New Zealand.

 

[PhilClinton]

Australian salary cap has actually declined 10% for 2022, conversely no decrease in New Zealand.

That is rather disheartening. Especially with the uncertainty over eligibility for overseas players etc.

Less cash onshore is never a good thing.

 

[Dan54]

Yep and during that interview, or one of those he said he envies the resources available to New Zealand teams compared to Australians, not just salary cap but size of the funding grants and payments for coaches and team staff, Australian teams don’t get that . Ex Makos CEO would have a pretty good grasp on the facts and disparity.

Australian salary cap has actually declined 10% for 2022, conversely no decrease in New Zealand.

I was under impression with Stan's deal made RA reasonably in the black again.
But really as a comp all teams operate under whatever salary cap they want? So not really a salary cap is there?I assuming they get a split of what the comp earns, I not sure how it works. Makes you wonder how much Fiji is paying their players, from what I remember MP (Moana Pasifika) were same as NZ's. I maybe wrong.

And I guess any test players get a fair bit more through there contracts with RA and NZR etc.

 

[Adam84]

I was under impression with Stan's deal made RA reasonably in the black again.
But really as a comp all teams operate under whatever salary cap they want? So not really a salary cap is there?I assuming they get a split of what the comp earns, I not sure how it works. Makes you wonder how much Fiji is paying their players, from what I remember MP (Moana Pasifika) were same as NZ's. I maybe wrong.

And I guess any test players get a fair bit more through there contracts with RA and NZR etc.

Domestic broadcast rights are only one part of the overall revenue. International broadcast rights are non-exsistent for Super Rugby, and sponsorship revenue declined as well.

Domestic unions set the salary cap and funding distributions for their respective teams, not SANZAAR. And it’s done to a level of economic feasibility for the union, not one for equality across the competition. Which goes back to my comments many months ago that Super Rugby should have been established under a independent body which controlled everything from funding distributions to salary cap.

 

[PhilClinton]

And I guess any test players get a fair bit more through there contracts with RA and NZR etc.

The RA top up carrot is really the only way the top tier Aussie players can bridge the gap financially between their base Super salary and what overseas offers.

If memory serves me correct, it used to be offered to 25 players in Australian rugby each year, but they trimmed it down to 20 players a few years ago in order to provide a bigger slice of pie to the ones they deem worthy.

 

[Dan54]

The RA top up carrot is really the only way the top tier Aussie players can bridge the gap financially between their base Super salary and what overseas offers.

If memory serves me correct, it used to be offered to 25 players in Australian rugby each year, but they trimmed it down to 20 players a few years ago in order to provide a bigger slice of pie to the ones they deem worthy.

Yep I know that is case, and players no doubt able to pump up their pay a little more with selling their image. I know Jonah Lomu was probably the reason that was bought in as his image was worth so much. I know Dan Carter with his Jockey underwear set himself up fairly well too. You would think that with Aus having such a much bigger population the players could make a bit of extra coin there.

 

[Derpus]

The RA top up carrot is really the only way the top tier Aussie players can bridge the gap financially between their base Super salary and what overseas offers.

If memory serves me correct, it used to be offered to 25 players in Australian rugby each year, but they trimmed it down to 20 players a few years ago in order to provide a bigger slice of pie to the ones they deem worthy.

geez that's not even enough to fill a 23.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

Let’s not kid ourselves, NZ teams have had greater retention and recruitment then Australian teams since the 2021 season, that’s on the back of larger funding grants and player depth in New Zealand. Imagine signing the likes of RTS (Roger Tuivasa-Sheck) to an Australian team!

There won’t be a fair competition while there is such a disparity in resources on offer to the respective teams. Introduce equal funding distribution and a salary cap system amongst the teams on both sides of the Tasman and we might see an equal competition.

Until that happens you’re going to have resistance from fans in Australia because no one is interested in watching their team continually lose. It kills fan support as it did during Super Rugby

If super rugby could create a competition with uncertainty of outcome I and many others will be interested. But it seems both NZRU and RA can’t align on what is required to achieve that or ignore it as an issue. Meanwhile Rome burns.

I don’t get why people expect this season to be any different without any change. Anyhow I will leave it to others to dream it magically fixes itself and not much between oz and kiwi teams.

I will though like last season give it a go but if goes the way like last TT I will switch off pretty quick.

 

[Derpus]

If super rugby could create a competition with uncertainty of outcome I and many others will be interested. But it seems both NZRU and RA can’t align on what is required to achieve that or ignore it as an issue. Meanwhile Rome burns.

I don’t get why people expect this season to be any different without any change. Anyhow I will leave it to others to dream it magically fixes itself and not much between oz and kiwi teams.

I will though like last season give it a go but if goes the way like last TT I will switch off pretty quick.

I think the Reds underperformed during TT. They should be a better side than at least the Highlanders and Hurricanes. If they play to their potential they will be competitive.

The rest? not so much. Brumbies might snatch a scalp or two but that will be it.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

I reckon RTS (Roger Tuivasa-Sheck) is gunna slaughter. He was great in league - only held back from being considered one of the best by a lack of participation in in SoO imo. And the All Blacks currently have Bridge in their outside backs.

Lure of the ABs is huge huh. Imagine taking a more than a 50% pay cut just for a shot at it. Meanwhile current Wallabies leave for a 20% pay bump.

That is why it is so frustrating as to compete for talent given what nrl pays its top stars we need to grow our game in the region…and yeh that means NZRU and RA working together as oz has been commercial market ‘opportunity’ for growth if can get the product right. The fact RTS (Roger Tuivasa-Sheck) can only get half of what paid playing in super rugby vs what paid in league is frustrating. But credit I suppose is nz rugby does not lose that many players to rugby…but can we expect that to stay the same.

 

[hoggy]

That is why it is so frustrating as to compete for talent given what nrl pays its top stars we need to grow our game in the region…and yeh that means NZRU and RA working together as oz has been commercial market ‘opportunity’ for growth if can get the product right. The fact RTS (Roger Tuivasa-Sheck) can only get half of what paid playing in super rugby vs what paid in league is frustrating. But credit I suppose is nz rugby does not lose that many players to rugby…but can we expect that to stay the same.

But in fairness RTS (Roger Tuivasa-Sheck) would have been in the top bracket of paid NRL players, This is a start up salary, but what is his potential pay packet if he makes the All Blacks.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

But in fairness RTS (Roger Tuivasa-Sheck) would have been in the top bracket of paid NRL players, This is a start up salary, but what is his potential pay packet if he makes the All Blacks.

So he is not getting any AB top up money. Vunivalu got RA top up money and isn’t he on close to 1m