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Storm in a teacup, or more serious?

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barbarian

Phil Kearns (64)
Staff member
I've been on plenty of committees over the years and put in plenty of hours without monetary compensation, but I never thought that this entitled me to loan club money to people from club funds. I'm surprised that anyone thinks that this is ok.

QH that quote is the worst part of the article for mine - "I was chairman for four years, I've put thousands of hours into it for no compensation."

It's just a lazy way to garner sympathy for yourself - 'hey I fucked up, but I'm a volunteer! I'm doing this out of the goodness of my own heart.'

That may be so, but it doesn't excuse these sorts of shenanigans.
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Dismal Pillock

Michael Lynagh (62)
Potential selection for the All-time Crim 1st XV

Sound the clarion call, ** EMERGENCY SELECTORS CONVENING**

shed.gif
 

Hugh Jarse

Rocky Elsom (76)
Which one are the selectors looking at or is it all 3?

Was Warboys and/or NFJ in charge during the "ground hire" salary cap alleged issue of several years back? Strong rumors were circulating at that time that the franchise involved wore a blue jumper.
 

Quick Hands

David Wilson (68)
As a side issue, the NSWRU are constantly saying that they don't have enough money to run grass roots programmes, but yet they had $56,000 of government money "just sitting in the bank". It beggars belief that they couldn't find anywhere to spend this money - you know, something like hiring an aboriginal DO to run a grass roots programme. I wonder if they have any other money "just sitting in the bank" which could be spent promoting the game.
 

ChargerWA

Mark Loane (55)
I do have some sympathy for NFJ. Admittedly he made a poor error of judgement which he is too bright of a bloke to not have realised what he was doing wrong. But he did it with good intentions to help a bloke out and in the long run its cost him financially and will now hurt his reputation. I'd not like to see him dragged over the coals for too long.
 

Quick Hands

David Wilson (68)
^^^To the extent that I understand that he wanted to help out a mate that had fallen on hard time, absolutely. But he doesn't have the right to use other people's money to do so. I'm sure that we all know someone who could do with an interest free $56,000 loan - nothing in writing.

One wonders if the money would have been repaid had the payment not been picked up by the finance/audit staff.
 
N

NTT

Guest
So, NSW are up in arms about the ARU's "mismanagement of funding" only to be proven to be hypocrites. Defrauding the government to pay a mates mortgage is pretty serious stuff. Stealing money from disadvantaged kids is deplorable.

Again i call for the disbandment of the NSWRU and the immediate closure of the Waratahs. Won't happen though, the species is protected.
 
N

NTT

Guest
Just trying to balance out all the calls for the Force to be closed down, mostly originating from Sydney. Also, tongue was firmly planted in cheek there.
 

Quick Hands

David Wilson (68)
So, NSW are up in arms about the ARU's "mismanagement of funding" only to be proven to be hypocrites. Defrauding the government to pay a mates mortgage is pretty serious stuff. Stealing money from disadvantaged kids is deplorable.

Again i call for the disbandment of the NSWRU and the immediate closure of the Waratahs. Won't happen though, the species is protected.

And while we're at it we could ask Michael Baird to ban the game of rugby in NSW. That would surely complete the idyllic picture that you've painted.
 

Hugh Jarse

Rocky Elsom (76)
Undocumented loans to mates? So Old School. Been happening for years with precedent set by NSW JRU and Australian JRU.

This disgrace seems to refuse to die. The 2015 Annual Report from NSW JRU (http://www.nswjuniors.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/2015-Annual-report-NSWJRU.pdf) includes this statement on page 5 in the Commercial Manager's Report:

The NSWJRU Committee have continued to show the loan to Australian Junior Rugby in the balance sheet, even though it has been fully provided for, as we wish to continue to seek to recover this loan.
The history of this loan is that during the 2012 financial year NSWJRU lent Australian Junior Rugby Union Inc (AJRU) $25,000 to promote a national tournament for Under 15's and Under 17's. This loan was reduced by $3,680 being the fees paid by NSWJRU to enter the 2012 AJRU tournament. Despite numerous requests via email and telephone neither the 2012 President of AJRU, 2012 Treasurer of AJRU or the 2012 President of NSWJRU has been able to provide any correspondence in relation to the terms and conditions of this loan. As at 31 October 2012 AJRU had Net Liabilities of $37,232. Its assets were Cash at Bank of $2,568 and Debtors of $2,840. In the opinion of the 2013 NSWJRU Committee there is little likely hood that NSWJRU will be able to recover this loan. Therefore as at 31 October 2013 the NSWJRU Committee made a provision for the full amount of the loan. The NSWJRU Committee's view of the loan to Australian Junior Rugby Union remains unchanged and so it continues to be fully provided for.

NSW lose a State Premier over a $3000 bottle of Grange that he forgot about, meanwhile this $25000 festering scab remains unresolved.

Should it be this hard to resolve?


Governance seems to have been in short supply back in 2012. Who were the honourable folk at AJRU and NSW JRU that were in charge at that time?

Not Government money that time, but money raised from Chook raffles, BBQ, and player levys.
 
N

NTT

Guest
And while we're at it we could ask Michael Baird to ban the game of rugby in NSW. That would surely complete the idyllic picture that you've painted.


Yep, burn it down, burn it down i say! It would get rid of most of the infighting plagueing rugby at the moment.

After hearing bout closing down the Force for 6 months i thought you guys might like to see how it feels to be on the other end. Plus, it was only sarcasm ....
 

Dalai Ninja

Ward Prentice (10)
If the article is correct it seems to say that Williams didn't pay the money back - which is why they were let down. Farr-Jones paid the money back.

And I'd add, that even the board can't authorise the use of government money for a private purpose. In fact, as you say, I'd be surprised if they could legally loan any NSWRU funds to anyone.

For Farr-Jones to say:
"Bruce was confident he could . organise the loan to be refinanced and the debt to be repaid. Plus, Jim gave him assurances. Effectively I was comfortable with that and I was comfortable on the basis that I would guarantee the loan. There is no written guarantee but it was always my word. I was chairman for four years, I've put thousands of hours into it for no compensation.
"Technically, you probably should have sought consent of the board but I made that decision [not to] given the circumstances."

is just mind-boggling. No documentation, no nothing, just a wink and a nod. He thinks it's all ok - just a technicality in not asking. Much like one of Marto's "technical infringements".

I've been on plenty of committees over the years and put in plenty of hours without monetary compensation, but I never thought that this entitled me to loan club money to people from club funds. I'm surprised that anyone thinks that this is ok.

The loan was documented. Farr-Jones's guarantee wasn't.
 

Strewthcobber

Simon Poidevin (60)
Confirming some details and introducing some new ones.....

The Learn Earn Legend program, along with $100,000 in government funds, were transferred from the NSWRU to Ellavation shortly after NSW officials discovered former chairman Nick Farr-Jones and executive director Bruce Worboys had authorised a $56,000 loan to program co-ordinator Jim Williams so he could make a mortgage repayment on his family home in Sydney's south.

The loan was made in August last year and was never re-paid by Williams. Farr-Jones, who gave a verbal guarantee of the loan, repaid it on Williams' behalf more than six months later, with the help of an unnamed individual. Worboys resigned over the matter and Williams' contract was not renewed

An Indigenous education foundation run by renowned Australian rugby brothers Glen, Mark and Gary Ella is standing by former Wallaby Jim Williams in the wake of revelations he was the recipient of a secret loan from the NSW Rugby Union last year.

Williams, a former Wallaby and assistant Wallabies coach, has since been employed by Ellavation to run the same program.

http://www.watoday.com.au/rugby-uni...legend-funding-situation-20161107-gsjyw6.html
 

Rebels3

Jim Lenehan (48)
All I can say is this is another example of the old boys club in rugby at it again. There is too much self interest at all levels.
 

Scrubber2050

Mark Ella (57)
I do have some sympathy for NFJ. Admittedly he made a poor error of judgement which he is too bright of a bloke to not have realised what he was doing wrong. But he did it with good intentions to help a bloke out and in the long run its cost him financially and will now hurt his reputation. I'd not like to see him dragged over the coals for too long.


The bloke is a solicitor.

It's absolutely no different to a solicitor taking money from his trust account unless it is for the benefit or use by his client,

It doesn't matter if the solicitor gave the money to the Salvos, or gambled it at the Casino all with the intention of paying the money back

This is a black letter law issue.

It doesn't matter the personalities involved.
 
N

NTT

Guest
Im glad Pulver is refusing to give money to the NSWRU slush fund. How many years and decades of infighting, divisions and dodgy dealings does Australian rugby have to put up with before it is stamped out? It took almost 100 years for the NSW cartel to realise rugby was played in other states and throw 10 cents to each state. Throw in all the doom and gloom journos and we can all see clear as day that for all that NSW has contributed to rugby, it is still rugby in Australias biggest problem child. When the clubs are trying to go it alone at the expense of the governing body, it shows how factional, protectionist and divided NSW really is. Qld couldn't distance themselves fast enough from the Papworth dribble. WA has always had to put up with NSW trying to hinder the Forces progress. The extra $15 million thrown at the Rebels to get started proves this. When is rugby in Australia going to unite for the common good? We have one of the best internationally played games behind soccer. Yet we can't seem to promote our game beyond the private school, landrover driving, chardonnay sippy old money brigade. We just finished 2nd in the world cup. What has this years main stories been about? The demise of rugby in Australia due to a couple old boys having a sook. Not about how we came from nowhere to be in the final, not about the unique opportunities provided by rugby, not about the young kid from the unfashionable background making it big, not about how powerful a rugby nation we actually are, not about the upcoming boom in 7s rugby, not about the volunteer overcoming adversity for the love of their club. Its been about the alleged shambles the rebuilding Wallabies are, the ever present rumour of a franchise being destroyed, the old boys brigade having a sook, the corrupt dealings of NSW rugby, the concerted effort to destabilize the NRC, the need for NSW clubs to be more important than the national effort to grow the game.
It makes me sick yo continuously read the stories of how rugby is doomed. It makes me sick to read about the stories of heavy criticism by a few out of touch journos. It makes me sick to read about the demise of one of our franchises. It makes me sick to read about mishandling of government funding by NSWRU. It makes me sick that for all the progress Australian rugby is finally making towards having a truly national presence is being white anted by vested interests.

What makes me really sick is that the thing that gets lost in all the bullshit is what a truly wonderful sport we have and how lucky we are we get to participate in it.

What makes me the most sick though is it is all coming from the one state. The one state that has always considered itself the "keeper of the game". The one state that has always held back rugby from gaining the national prominence it deserves. The one state that is once again threatening to tear apart the the best game in the world. The one state whos sense of entitlement has always keep the sport to an exclusive few.

NSW Rugby, get your shit together. For once do whats best for Australian rugby not whats best for the exclusive club of once were importants. Rugby will never get the respect and standing it deserves until you do.
 

Braveheart81

Will Genia (78)
Staff member
The bloke is a solicitor.

It's absolutely no different to a solicitor taking money from his trust account unless it is for the benefit or use by his client,

It doesn't matter if the solicitor gave the money to the Salvos, or gambled it at the Casino all with the intention of paying the money back

This is a black letter law issue.

It doesn't matter the personalities involved.

It is substantially different. There is specific legislation which govern the operation of a trust account and controlled monies which has no relevance to the bank accounts of a corporation.

Morally it is quite similar but legally it isn't at all.
 
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