Springboks v Wallabies, Newlands, September 28 2013

[Brumbieman]

More so than Betham. I don't expect he's going to be seeing much ball though.

 

[No4918]

Deans - favoured Tahs players and had little success.
McKenzie - favouring Brumbies players and having no success.

National coaches - ignore Reds at your own peril.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

This is about the Men in Gold.

Our Wallabies, not the ACT Wallabies, or the Sydney Wallabies (what about the Qantas Wallabies?) .

Can we not set aside artificial political and organisational boundaries and petty point scoring related to those constructs?

 

[Zander]

Interesting comment, it appears Ewen favours the Reds players if anything.

Albert Anae, James Slipper @ loosehead, Jake Schatz, Chris Feauai-Sautia

 

[emuarse]

The only way we should be playing this game is like this:

White and To'omua starting, with instructions to dpo their utmost to pin the Boks in their 22.

Mowen captain, and Horwill told to go out and do his best impersonation of James Horwill circa 2008 and be as aggressive as he possibly can. Douglas in the other 2nd row jersey being told he's playing for his Wallaby career, and he and Horwill are in a competition for who can do the most damage. Let Mowen captain the squad and keep a cool head and not piss off the ref.

The ball doesn't go past Lealiifano unless we've made a break and are going forward at a rate of knots. This game should be treated as the 2nd charge of Beersheba, with similarly high stakes.

I don't care how ugly this game is, we have Nic White and Matt To'omua, with Folau, Tomane and AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) all available, and all are excellent under the high ball.

White
To'omua
Tomane
Lealiifano
Kuridrani
AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper)
Folau

.gives us excellent security under the high ball, while White and To'omua can do their best to maintain field position and keep us out of Steyn's range. The rest of the side should be doing nothing but tackling like their careers depend on it, and smashing the breakdown with even more ferocity.

What's that stuff you're smoking - it really is great for hallucinations

 

[Richo]

I don't think Link plays favourites at all. Cooper and Genia are proof positive of that.

I do think he's made some selection errors, most notably in the tight five. Who knows if the scrum (or the pack in general) would have done any better if he'd made different choices, but it couldn't have done much worse. But Link has also made some good, strong decisions too. Benching Genia, playing Fardy, moving Folau to 15.

In general, I think there is more coherence to his choices than we had under Deans, but he's been similarly hamstrung by injury.

 

[Scrubber2050]

Does anyone know when team is to be announced

 

[KOB1987]

Looks like we will see both Cooper and To'omua on the park at the same time at some point.....it's the only one of the three 10-12 combinations mentioned here that hasn't been tried by Link yet....

"AT a time when Australian rugby is struggling to lay its hands on any weapon capable of hurting its rivals, Wallabies coach Ewen McKenzie believes one is starting to take shape.
It's the 10-12 combination in which McKenzie, as much through necessity as anything else, has taken the back-to-the-future approach of using two highly skilled ballplayers. At the moment it's the pairing of Quade Cooper and Christian Lealiifano, but in McKenzie's mind it could be Cooper and Matt To'omua or even the Brumbies mix of To'omua and Lealiifano.
It was the Mark Ella-Michael Lynagh 10-12 axis created by Alan Jones that was at the heart of Australia's solitary Grand Slam win, in 1984, and McKenzie, speaking from Cape Town where his side meets the Springboks on Saturday, believes that harnessing two creative playmakers at five-eighth and inside centre might reignite the attack."
- See more at: http://www.theaustralian.com.au/spo...y-e6frg7o6-1226726473119#sthash.xNQGABQL.dpuf

 

[Hugh Jarse]

Yep, in the Podcast Link talked about trying to run the #12 position as 2nd Five Eighth role in the pure sense of the word.

Takes me back to the old days, when teams had a half back, two five eighths (1st 5/8 and 2nd 5/8), three three quarters ( two Wing three quarters and one Centre Three Quarter) and a Full Back.

The backline was like the pride of the imperial measurement system, with its 1/2's, 5/8s and 3/4's.

I think it was the Poms who introduced the concept of halfback, flyhalf, Inside Centre, Outside centre, two wings and a full back.

Hell there was even a day when we played Left Flanker (Left Wing Forward) and Right Flanker (Right Wing Forward), none of this openside/blindside nonsense. Our Lock was at the back of the scrum, and the kiwis called our second rowers, Locks, and rather inventively called the 8th member of the forward pack "No 8" not "Lock".

 

[ChargerWA]

Lealiifano is needed to kick goals. We would need to be scoring lots of tries to take him off the park.

How about?

9. White
10. Cooper
11. Cummins/Tomane
12. Lealiifano
13. To'omua
14. AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper)
15. Folau

More joking, but it would solve some problems this week.

 

[Scrubber2050]

Lealiifano is needed to kick goals. We would need to be scoring lots of tries to take him off the park.

How about?

9. White
10. Cooper
11. Cummins/Tomane
12. Lealiifano
13. To'omua
14. AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper)
15. Folau

More joking, but it would solve some problems this week.

Think Tomane will grab the wing spot and Kuridrani centres

 

[Scotty]

It's the backline, not the whole team.


Got a better one? That doesn' involve throwing Peter "two left feet for hands" Betham or Chris "glass-strings and has half a season of SUPER rugby experience" onto the wing and hoping that the Boks don't decide to just kick it at them and watch them collapse under pressure in front of 65 00 drunk Afrikaaners?

I'd keep Cooper if he was as imposing in defence as To'omua is. Reality is, that he isn't even if he's getting better. Playing Kuridrani at outside centre is far less of a risk than a rookie on the wing as he can only really be targetted by running at him, something Kuridrani would love them to do.

Since when is being imposing in defense the primary selection criteria for a 10?

Apart from Wilkinson I don't think there has been a World Cup winning 10 that fits that description?!

 

[RoffsChoice]

I think the best things about To'omua are:
Great tackler
Imposing defender
Good kicker
Well rounded
Deceptively fast (looks like he's jogging when really he's sprinting)
Long pass
Good eye for gaps and overlaps

but the thing that lets him down is how he personally doesn't break the line, he's very much an interchange player and as a result can't really do much on his own in attack. Cooper and, god help me, JOC (James O'Connor) were good at making things happen on their own in attack and then when the support got there converting it into points.

 

[Richo]

Since when is being imposing in defense the primary selection criteria for a 10?

Apart from Wilkinson I don't think there has been a World Cup winning 10 that fits that description?!

Since it fits with whatever provincial allegiances one might have? A bit like how an x-factor, electric, risk-taking flyhalf is precisely what's needed for some.

Really what you actually need is an ex-7s, line-breaking, reluctant kicker at 10.

 

[gel]

I think To'omua is playing better than Quade Cooper at the moment and deserves to be starting for this match.

If Quade Cooper is not starting, I don't think he offers much in the way of a bench spot because he needs time to settle into a game and that is a luxury the bench don't have.

Also, quite clearly QC (Quade Cooper) is not running well - well below his pre-injury pace - (and has no ability to side step anymore) since his injury. He really needs to work things out.

I didn't think Kuridrani had played too awesomely in what little time he has had to date - but then again no one else has either.

 

[Phil]

Yep, in the Podcast Link talked about trying to run the #12 position as 2nd Five Eighth role in the pure sense of the word.

Takes me back to the old days, when teams had a half back, two five eighths (1st 5/8 and 2nd 5/8), three three quarters ( two Wing three quarters and one Centre Three Quarter) and a Full Back.

The backline was like the pride of the imperial measurement system, with its 1/2's, 5/8s and 3/4's.

I think it was the Poms who introduced the concept of halfback, flyhalf, Inside Centre, Outside centre, two wings and a full back.

Hell there was even a day when we played Left Flanker (Left Wing Forward) and Right Flanker (Right Wing Forward), none of this openside/blindside nonsense. Our Lock was at the back of the scrum, and the kiwis called our second rowers, Locks, and rather inventively called the 8th member of the forward pack "No 8" not "Lock".

HJ,what about when flankers were breakaways?

 

[No4918]

Since it fits with whatever provincial allegiances one might have? A bit like how an x-factor, electric, risk-taking flyhalf is precisely what's needed for some.

Really what you actually need is an ex-7s, line-breaking, reluctant kicker at 10.

I didn't know Godwin played 7's.

 

[boyo]

HJ,what about when flankers were breakaways?

And the 4s and 5s were second rowers, not locks (the lock was the 8).

 

[Scrubber2050]

I think the best things about To'omua are:
Great tackler
Imposing defender
Good kicker
Well rounded
Deceptively fast (looks like he's jogging when really he's sprinting)
Long pass
Good eye for gaps and overlaps

but the thing that lets him down is how he personally doesn't break the line, he's very much an interchange player and as a result can't really do much on his own in attack. Cooper and, god help me, JOC (James O'Connor) were good at making things happen on their own in attack and then when the support got there converting it into points.

WOW - With all of those attributes I'd stick him in the world 15

 

[PaarlBok]

I think the best things about To'omua are:
Great tackler
Imposing defender
Good kicker
Well rounded
Deceptively fast (looks like he's jogging when really he's sprinting)
Long pass
Good eye for gaps and overlaps

but the thing that lets him down is how he personally doesn't break the line, he's very much an interchange player and as a result can't really do much on his own in attack. Cooper and, god help me, JOC (James O'Connor) were good at making things happen on their own in attack and then when the support got there converting it into points.

To'omua know Newlands well, played a few for WP.