South Africa tour (and squad)

[chief]

Wallabies are losing because there are too many Queenslanders in the team. thats my conclusion.

Great logic, let's promote you!

Tom Carter is he availiable? Let's replace him with Fainga'a!

Berrick Barnes, hell great idea, he'll do better than Quade would.

Burgess for Genia! We need quick service, and the element of surprise would be promoting this guy to the starting side. Messy.

I would say the Wallabies are losing because they cannot outclass the AB's, and because Quade isn't there. But don't worry Berrick's better than Quade.

In short, you're an idiot.

 

[Scotty]

Chief - the biggest fish of the day.

 

[cyclopath]

Thanks, Chief. I was leading after Scorz reeled me in this morning, but you have released me back to the wild to bite again.

 

[Moses]

Burgess for Genia! We need quick service, and the element of surprise would be promoting this guy to the starting side. Messy.

Having a halfback who makes it to more than every second breakdown would be a bonus. Absolutely Burgess would have done a better job than Genia did last night.

In short, you're an idiot.

Hook, Line, and Sinker.

 

[Scotty]

We really should be questioning why on earth Deans left Genia out there. I could see he was stuffed at around 55minutes, why couldn't Deans and the other coaches? If ever a game called for some backline subs it was that one. We had all the ball in the world and couldn't make a break for the life of us. Why wasn't Burgess tried so he could suck some defenders in. Why wasn't Shepherd thrown into the mix.

Deans is hopeless with his bench. I don't remember this being an issue when he was Saders coach. In fact he seemed to win a few games vs the Reds with astute use of his bench.

 

[TOCC]

he seemd to use the bench very well last week, dont know why he didnt do it this week

 

[Gnostic]

he seemd to use the bench very well last week, dont know why he didnt do it this week

???

What game were you watching?

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

It appears that the Wallaby coaching panel have been reading G&GR about Giteau's lack of form

http://www.foxsports.com.au/story/0,8659,27525009-5016959,00.html

 

[Gnostic]

Matt Giteau's Wallabies spot under scrutiny after Bledisloe Cup loss

By Darren Walton
August 08, 2010

Matt Giteau's starting position with the Wallabies is in question as Robbie Deans toys with the idea of deploying an all-Queensland Reds midfield trio against South Africa.

Giteau, a backline mainstay since 2004, won the John Eales Medal last year before being one of Australia's outstanding performers on the grand slam tour of the British Isles.

But a victim of his own versatility and class, the Brumbies fly-half has again come under fire during Australia's up-and-down start to the 2010 Test season, in which they have already surrendered the Bledisloe Cup.



And with first-choice five-eighth Quade Cooper returning from suspension and Anthony Fainga'a emerging as a viable inside-centre option, Deans admits Giteau is no longer deemed an automatic starter for the Wallabies.

"Clearly we've got choice now, which is great and the group understands that now,'' Deans said on Sunday.

"They're all helping each other, all working hard now to ensure that we have a squad that regardless of who is called on, we'll be good to go. That's what the game's about.''

Giteau's teammates were full of admiration for the 84-Test veteran for fronting up two days after the death of his grandfather to direct the Australia attack in Saturday night's 20-10 loss to New Zealand in Christchurch.

"It was a big effort from him,'' Adam Ashley-Cooper said. "It was certainly a true test of character and he showed a lot of courage.''

And while not concerned with his form, for Deans the issue is deciding what style of play he wants to implement in Australia's next Tri Nations Test in three weeks against South Africa in Pretoria.

Certain to recall Cooper, Deans is still favouring using Giteau outside him, especially because Cooper's long passing to the wide-running Giteau was so effective in the Wallabies' comprehensive 30-13 defeat of the Springboks two weeks ago in Brisbane.

But Deans is also considering persisting with the more direct Fainga'a after his "fantastic'' starting debut opposing destructive All Blacks centre Ma'a Nonu.

Fainga'a, Cooper and halfback Will Genia formed one of the most potent 12-10-9 combinations in the Super 14 this season with the Reds and Deans must decide whether they can be equally dangerous at international level.

Ashley-Cooper, who partnered Fainga'a in the centres on Saturday night, has no doubt the two could prove a deadly duo given further time together.

"For a new combination up against the best in the world, I thought we did really well and worked well together,'' Ashley-Cooper said.

"So it's pretty exciting to see how that combination can grow over the next couple of years.

"He's got huge potential and I'm pretty sure Deansy was pretty happy with how he went.

"I was particularly happy with how he went and so was the backline. It was really good to have two ball-carriers in that midfield to get us over that advantage line.''

Highlighted a couple of pertinent points here and have to question whether Rugby journo's in Oz are just becoming paid propaganda mouth peices.

1) This was the Grandslam tour highlighted by very poor performances 3/4 test matches scraped a win against understrength England with no back play worth speaking about. Same again at Ireland except it was a draw and they lost to Scotland just in case anybody swallowed the drivel about it being a Grandslam tour (they failed abysmally Mr Walton).
2) Many keep talking about Giteau's class and versatility. Yes he played in a few different spots by has NEVER played well away from 12 against any top level opposition in a test match. His form has been poor for a long time, true class like Carter finds form inside a season. We haven't seen Giteau play well in Gold for at two maybe longer. The fact that he was awarded the John Eales medal IMO devalued that award and made it a farce.
3) I wasn't aware that the victory against the Bok in Brisbane two tries all, with one try coming from creative Wallabies play was considered a comprehensive victory.

 

[RedsHappy]

Highlighted a couple of pertinent points here and have to question whether Rugby journo's in Oz are just becoming paid propaganda mouth peices.

Gnostic, well spotted! I have had cause to highlight just this point on many occasions when quoting from the docile Oz mainstream rugby press. Otherwise astute posters here often fail to grasp what an active PR machine the ARU runs and how it shrewdly exploits the lazy lack of rigour in the mainstream, feeding in as it does the latest either Deans-defending line, 'our hero player X', or dark, anonymous stuff in the negative (e.g., when they leaked that Mitchell and Giteau might be dropped post England 2).

Also, the mainstream often calls in for reinforcements from the gaggle of ex-players (many very ex- and living on romanticised memories) that are paid to write in the media. You will have noticed recently that the mild suggestion that Giteau might be temporarily dropped brought upon us howls of resentful disbelief that the great icon, the talisman of the Wallabies, the ever-generous contributor, the Tests veteran, the player of huge class, could be absented from the Wallaby fold. It was for many near heresy. But what a bunch of superficial rubbish it all is, for all the precise reasons re Giteau you note above (any many of us have also noted from various different angles.). It's also dangerous btw, as these sustained outbursts have undoubtedly influenced RD to be more cautious with Giteau's handling within the team than one has sensed at times he otherwise might.

Uncle Greg at the heaven is a personal favourite of mine for his close and ever-predictable attachment to the ARU's current thought management strategies. Uncle Greg is rather like the school critic whom is secretly the best buddy of the headmaster. Last week post Melbourne we had lots of hand-wringing from the uncle re debacles and poor application and errors and so forth, this week, after the 3N and BC have gone, 9 straight losses to ABs, he's using terms like 'gallant Wallabies' and 'lots of sliver lining' from this loss (did you notice how v similar this was to RD's words today at Sydney airport?).

Then I found it highly amusing that poor Scarf had to endure a massive posting war over legal interpretations, partly on the spurious grounds from the initiating poster that 'the media had become awfully confused' over these matters! To which my reply would be: if only! If only we had a
mainstream rugby media capable of being rigorous, analytical, skilled in assessing recorded video in adequate depth, and fact-based, the Oz rugby media scene would be transformed overnight! (....and don't get me started on Bret Harris....)

 

[RedsHappy]

Re Giteau: A MAINSTREAM MEDIA BREAKTHROUGH HAS OCCURRED TODAY!! DOUBTS ARE PERMITTED RE 'THE UNSHIFTABLE ICON'!: MONTHS AFTER GAGR POSTERS HAVE CLAIMED 'THE GREAT ONE MUST BE MOVED', A KEY COMMENTATOR HAS FINALLY CAUGHT ON:

Wayne Smith, The Australian, August 8:

When looking for reasons why the Wallabies made so little impact on attack, here is the place to start.

There were other reasons, of course, and sadly one of them is Australia's most-capped back. Matt Giteau remains one of the great lateral thinkers in the game. Unfortunately, these days the same also can be said of his running. It is becoming way too lateral, eating into valuable space for his outside men.

Time and again the Wallabies desperately needed him to straighten the attack and at least tease the All Black defence. Instead he drifted sideways. As a consequence, he is becoming increasingly easier to read, especially for a proud defensive unit like the All Blacks who have never conceded him a try in 19 Tests.

Giteau had 60 possessions in the match, double what came his way in Melbourne. Run that volume of possession through Dan Carter's hands and the numbers on the scoreboard change so fast they start to blur. Yet even making allowances for the aforementioned inability of the Wallabies to secure quick ball regularly at the breakdown, Giteau wasn't able to pull the right levers.

All of which raises the question of what Deans will do for the Wallabies' next match, against the Springboks in Pretoria on August 28 when Cooper becomes available. With Anthony Fainga'a providing an imposing physical presence in the midfield once he recovered from his jitters, it would be folly to drop him to accommodate a Giteau move back to 12.

 

[Scotty]

I'd like to think we will see Fa'ainga get another start, afterall Robbie said is all about building for the RWC, but I get the feeling that Mr Giteau will be right back in the team at 12. Looking at some of the highlights for the Reds this year, I also can't wait to see Chambers get some experience with the Wallabies.

 

[naza]

Uncle Greg is rather like the school critic whom is secretly the best buddy of the headmaster. Last week post Melbourne we had lots of hand-wringing from the uncle re debacles and poor application and errors and so forth, this week, after the 3N and BC have gone, 9 straight losses to ABs, he's using terms like 'gallant Wallabies' and 'lots of sliver lining' from this loss (did you notice how v similar this was to RD's words today at Sydney airport?).

Growden can't win. People bag him for being relentlessly negative. And now that he's cheered up somewhat and credited the Wallabies for showing some grit and improvement, you rake him over the coals for your conspiracy theory. Half of his article this morning consist of delusional Wallaby morons with more empty 'we can do it' pledges.

And I hate that you just made me stick up for that useless funt Growden, you bastard !

 

[RedsHappy]

naza: Growden can't win. People bag him for being relentlessly negative.

Just btw, not me. (The Tahs' playing style and the ANZ Stadium are his favourite negatives, over and over again.) I bag him for (a) excessive compliance with the ARU 'party line' in most cases vs the hard(er) analysis needed (b) flopping from 'good Wallabies' one Sunday to 'awful Wallabies' the next, there's just no depth or decent insight in that. It's nothing to do with 'conspiracy theories', lazy journos often comply with the line coming from elite bodies they get 'insider' access from, good insider gossip, best seats on the bus, etc, from. But I hate that, it lacks integrity and what a good journo should do, which is to assess and, where justified, criticise all parties freely.

Half of his article this morning consist of delusional Wallaby morons with more empty 'we can do it' pledges.

Yep. He does that whenever he needs to move back into 'it's really going to get better mode' vs 'Wallabies were disgraceful' mode. There's often just a week between them. There was lots of that last in his articles (just like this weekend's post Christchurch) just after the Wallabies' win vs the Boks in Brisbane 2009: 'Moving forward to build something really special with Deans'. It would be cheaper for the SMH editors to just cut and paste the various modes each week and change the names for new players coming in. They need the cost savings over there at Fairfax.

 

[Linus]

Who cares what they write, focus on the ball not the man.

My observations or 2c worth.

What no one has seemed to think that the lack of creativity in the backline on Saturday might be the fact that it was Gits was the only first receiver. Beale rarely got in there. As pointed out, repeatedly by all and sundry, he has limitations at 10, kicking game is aweful (did anybody else notice the couple of kicks Beale took at first receiver were immeasurably better), doesn't organise the backline well, etc.

But the balance was all wrong, if you are going to run out Ant F and AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) together, I expect you'll get the same result of alot of one out running. You are actually highlighting Giteau's weaknesses, this combo with Cooper will naturally be better, Cooper wants to play ad lib with runners inside and out. Giteau is a runner first, pass second... But personally I want a second option, either Beale or JOC (James O'Connor) must take up the slack by having Ant F at 12. Often Hynes was the second option for the Reds, not Ant F.

Are there any inside backs out there that you guys like that can catch AND pass? It looks great when you run over the opposition but there are few individuals that can create space for others, I don't think most of our backs could execute a 3 on 2, at pace under pressure. JOC (James O'Connor) couldn't do a 2 on 1 the week before. Currently I would have confidence in Cooper, Giteau (maybe), Beale and Barnes to execute that.

We all know that as a group, the forwards generated little go forward all season (No Palu, TPN, Horwill, take your pick), it changes the dynamic, meaning 12, 13 had to try and crash the ball over the advantage line and we end up with 2,3 forwards in the back line, so when the may have been an opportunity wide there was no one left to exploit it. This has been the key difference for the AB's get go forward(Thorne, Mealamu, etc) with McCaw often playing like a centre/2nd 5/8 after Nonu or Smith have gotten a half break, the back three have finished nearly every opportunity.

 

[louie]

what bugs me about gits is that he has all this shit thrown at about how much of number ten he is and it's all his fault etc. etc. but the thing is that he's not a 1o, he's a 12. Yes he has had shit games when played at ten, but that's not his fault. It's RD, Friend etc. you name him their.
If you played Carter as an outside centre he would be crap, even at 12 he's nothing special, thats why he's played at 10.
It's simple really.

 

[Scotty]

Reflecting on Beale's game, I can see this guy being our No 1 fullback at the RWC next year, provided he proves himself under the high ball and continues to do so in defense. He is without doubt the best supporting fullback of the options we have. I'd still like to see Hynes there as well, mainly due to his counter attack, but Cooper will love Beale as he presents himself as an option most times.

 

[chiraag]

I still think JOC (James O'Connor) is a better option at fullback than Beale since his defense in that position is far more reliable. Case & point Beale's weak tackling effort on Mils for the first try on the weekend. The experiment with JOC (James O'Connor) at 14 has not worked, but he was doing quite well at 15 before AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) was moved back. Shep should move into 14, and we could definitely do with his finishing ability on the ground.

I also think we need to employ the pick & drive a hell of a lot more to produce some go forward and suck in more of the opposition players in close to open up gaps out wide. SA & the blacks seem to use this tactic all the time, but we always seem to have the scrummie passing to a forward a few metres out, and end up making no ground whatsoever as the defensive line comes up by the time the runner receives the ball. I can only think of Robinson trying the pcik & drive a couple of times on Saturday and it had a bit of success.

I think Maafu should be dropped from the 22 altogether, with Slipper to start and Fairbrother on the bench. i have far more faith in Fairborther's ability to hold up a scrum.

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

Reflecting on Beale's game, I can see this guy being our No 1 fullback at the RWC next year, provided he proves himself under the high ball and continues to do so in defense. He is without doubt the best supporting fullback of the options we have. I'd still like to see Hynes there as well, mainly due to his counter attack, but Cooper will love Beale as he presents himself as an option most times.

In spite of lingering skepticism I have about Kurtley, I think there could be something in what you say. What we have learned from the weekend is that we have a couple of young blokes who look like realistic options in their positions. That puts pressure (in a good way) on the more senior guys to lift their games. A positive development, I think, from the wreckage of the Bledisloe so far.

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

I also think we need to employ the pick & drive a hell of a lot more to produce some go forward and suck in more of the opposition players in close to open up gaps out wide. SA & the blacks seem to use this tactic all the time, but we always seem to have the scrummie passing to a forward a few metres out, and end up making no ground whatsoever as the defensive line comes up by the time the runner receives the ball. I can only think of Robinson trying the pcik & drive a couple of times on Saturday and it had a bit of success.

^^^^ This