Shute Shield 2018
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The Honey Badger
Jim Lenehan (48)
How many players at SUFC actually attend Sydney Uni?
Think you might be surprised at the answer.
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Unless someone here actually works in SUFC, anything would be a guess. You seem to imply you know, so why not say? Or are you guessing? I would think it's somewhere under 60%. But is it relevant these days anyway? How many players at Randwick grew up or live there? Or any club? It obviously moved on from being a club where students who happened to be there played some rugby there some time ago, and I'm not sure why it should be tied to that formula nowadays. This is in no way endorsing the overuse of scholarships or anything else they have done over the years, but it seems an odd standard to apply these days, if indeed that is what you are doing.
The Honey Badger
Jim Lenehan (48)
Don't understand your proposition.
Surely any organisation assisting someone to undertake study has little to do with the uni. They should be grateful for any supported students sent their way.
And most Unis (if not all) run elite athlete programs to assist athletes in whatever sport with their studies.
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southsider
Arch Winning (36)
My understanding is that these types of scholarships are partly if not Wholey funded by the universities, not the clubs.
All unis have EAP programs, but their existence doesn’t really relate to the discussion.
wamberal
Phil Kearns (64)
At the end of the day, we are talking about the on-going issue of self-interest versus a cooperative attitude.
We will all hang together, unless we can decide genuinely to work together.
We need to accept a degree of "socialism", to the extent that the rich will agree to sacrifice some of their wealth (whether it is actual money, or all the other factors that influence the success of a rugby club) to help those who are lower down the totem pole.
To die, or to thrive? That is our choice.
We will all hang together, unless we can decide genuinely to work together.
We need to accept a degree of "socialism", to the extent that the rich will agree to sacrifice some of their wealth (whether it is actual money, or all the other factors that influence the success of a rugby club) to help those who are lower down the totem pole.
To die, or to thrive? That is our choice.
The Honey Badger
Jim Lenehan (48)
I think the term scholarship is used loosely to describe a few different arrangements.
I know Gordon offer a Colts Scholarship to UTS, which is probably along the lines you suggest. As I believe it to be a full academic scholarship and the student had no HECS debt. (and I assume the Uni is the funder as UTS is a major sponsor of Gordon Rugby)
But there are a plethora of other arrangements. With accommodation or various other cash payments to support the student. This is more along the lines of what I was suggesting as means to make it more attractive for talented players to head west.
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S
sidelineview
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And the question can be asked: should the governing bodies be proactive in spreading the available talent around more evenly by helping Clubs to provide incentives for players as mentioned above by HB.
In a perfect world a degree of ''socialism'' would and should work but realistically if left to the Clubs will it change?
In a perfect world a degree of ''socialism'' would and should work but realistically if left to the Clubs will it change?
wamberal
Phil Kearns (64)
Chicken and egg, mate. As Paul Keating so famously said, and I paraphrase, if you want to know which horse will win, back self-interest.
The only thing that will unite the various parties is the threat of the gallows. And even then, I suspect that the stronger clubs would keep on pursuing their own selfish interests until the bitter end.
People can gabble on about the grass roots until the cows come home. The simple fact remains, the rich cows will graze in green pastures, and the poor ones can go to buggery. The grass roots exist, of course, but they are not evenly distributed, and they do thrive, again, only in certain areas. What else do people expect? Magic fertiliser from above?
The only thing that will unite the various parties is the threat of the gallows. And even then, I suspect that the stronger clubs would keep on pursuing their own selfish interests until the bitter end.
People can gabble on about the grass roots until the cows come home. The simple fact remains, the rich cows will graze in green pastures, and the poor ones can go to buggery. The grass roots exist, of course, but they are not evenly distributed, and they do thrive, again, only in certain areas. What else do people expect? Magic fertiliser from above?
S
sidelineview
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Agreed.
Therefore its up to the governing bodies to regulate it; or to at least try to come up with solutions to assist certain Clubs. Too big an ask perhaps.
The only regulation I know of is the player points system which only manages to keep a lid on the stronger Clubs.
Therefore its up to the governing bodies to regulate it; or to at least try to come up with solutions to assist certain Clubs. Too big an ask perhaps.
The only regulation I know of is the player points system which only manages to keep a lid on the stronger Clubs.
Who actually has any governance over SS? Do NSWRU have any say, or is it just SRU? Seems to be one of the big issues, to me.
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David Codey (61)
How would the NSWRU having a formal say in the SS help anything?
Seems to me that the big issues are all about player development, that's already part of the NSWRU's brief,and they are failing.
Seems to me that the big issues are all about player development, that's already part of the NSWRU's brief,and they are failing.
I didn't say it would, so I'm not sure what you're on about. Someone asked about "authorities" doing something about SS player distribution and I asked who actually has any governance in that regard. Nothing more.
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David Codey (61)
Relax, you wrote it was a big issue. I assumed incorrectly that you were referring to governance, not player distribution.
Unfortunately, in regard to distribution, I can't see a solution from within (self interest, and gaming any proposed rule changes), and I can't think of any body external to the SRU that has demonstrated any expertise that might suggest they might be able to solve the issue
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David Codey (61)
Couple of things,
Firstly the issue is really how to help the Riff to be competitive. As a comp, the SS is strong. Last years Premiers were 11/18 in the regular season, so that's hardly dominant.
Secondly, the comp is still largely amateur, if it's determined that a local Rats players has to transfer to the Riff for the good of the comp, he's more likely to find an alternative to the SS. So SRU directed transfers won't work.
As you rightly point out, the solution requires the goodwill of all the clubs, so it is a bit like herding cats.
And when I said expertise, I should have said credibility.
wamberal
Phil Kearns (64)
You bet it is a strong competition, just ask any Eastwood supporter. We have been beaten by just about everybody in the last couple of years.
I agree that "direction" alone will not work, there would have to be some kind of incentive.
I am old enough to (just) remember the days of the genuinely district clubs, when players were supposed to reside in the actual district. That was easy to rort, and so it was rorted.
Money is about the only thing that would do the trick.
I agree that "direction" alone will not work, there would have to be some kind of incentive.
I am old enough to (just) remember the days of the genuinely district clubs, when players were supposed to reside in the actual district. That was easy to rort, and so it was rorted.
Money is about the only thing that would do the trick.
Green grass
Chris McKivat (8)
What are Eastwood going to spend their windfall on? I assume most of it will be put into a trust account, but surely they will set up a base somewhere with an office/gym/club function rooms/training space?
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