School sporting scholarships/recruitment

[Muglair]

How about, as previously suggested, each school puts up the ad in the paper saying to apply to the GPS/CAS /ISA etc board and let the board dole them out as they see fit. Bad luck if your kid gets drafted into St Gregs when you were hoping for Auggies or View.

Even for an illiterate Philistine like myself this is a shade too far away from the concept of a rounded education. Although I do note that the Periodic Table test appears to be a very effective filter on the sample group.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

@muglair, I have nothing against the Philistinians such as yourself, but the Periodic Table Test is only suitable for those boys scientifically inclined.

You need some test for the more oratory and artistic such as to get them to describe the root causes of the current Israel - Philistine Conflict and assess if long term peace in the Middle East is achievable.

 

[lincoln]

Not really the periodic table is associated with chemistry.

Friend on his time in China (across 26 cities) - reckoned he had eaten everything on the periodic table.

 

[Quick Hands]

QH,

Whilst I agree with the majority of your posts, I believe that with a little thinking outside of the square your concerns could be overcome.

How about this one - if GPS/CAS/ISA current competitions can be played on football grounds on Saturdays, if these games were now played mid-week; why couldn't the same grounds be used for expanded junior club rugby, where practical and needed.

Just an simple idea that could be expanded on; I'm sure there are other possibilities.

Also, would it not be possible for a certain percentage of current personnel (CAS/CAS/ISA) to be drawn across to club rugby to organise and assist to run the expanded comps.

In theory, the grounds could be used, but most are privately owned, so I guess there would be payments involved there.

In terms of personnel, I'm involved with a junior rugby club and getting parents to volunteer isn't easy. It's generally the same small group setting the ground up, working the bbq, coaching, managing so more people would be great. The problem I see in moving personnel from the school systems to club rugby is that most of the adults are school teachers who participate as a condition of their employment, once it's not a school team they'll spend their free time with their own family.

Sorry to be negative, I just think it's better to leave the schools to their own devices and for the ARU to put every spare dollar into junior club rugby.

 

[Quick Hands]

On one hand Stan is right, lets get past the crap and on to solutions.

On the other hand he is a little disingenuous; there have been a couple of solutions put forward.

On the 3rd hand (not normally considered a realistic alternative but since Stan only has one nut) how would a solution to this issue fit with the rest of the rugby world.

The alternatives put to date as far as I can see are:

1) zero assistance (with all of the existing unresolved enforcement issues) perpetuating the dishonest position of all GPS schools
2) open slather with sufficient transparency to allow governance to maintain a reasonable balance
3) complex formulae along the line of ensuring that the number of Year 7 scholarships times the number of corner flags divided by the number of tries scored by the Wallabies etc etc ..

Clearly I favour 2 and note previous suggestions that such an approach may involve open competition amongst all independent schools for the elite grades (eg Scots, New, Auggies, Knox etc) which then fits opening a discussion regarding how this fits into broader development pathways.

Any change is going to take a lot of effort, consultation and even hard work. Across all school communities. It is long overdue. It may as well start here.

My position has always been that a points system, based on when boys started should be implemented. As it effectively limits teams to mostly boys who have started in Years 7 and 8, it makes the parachuting of multiple boys in after those years not worth the effort as only a small number of them can fit into the team, but still leaves room for the genuine late starters.

 

[Quick Hands]

To provide an example of the difficulties involved in mixing school and clubs, I provide the following:

Until about 10 years ago, St Augustine's didn't play in a school competition, they played in the local club competition and were affiliated with the Warringah JRU. It had the added bonus for Warringah in that Manly club players who went to St Augustines had to play for the school and therefore for Warringah reps. Some elements of Warringah JRU didn't like losing their own players to the school, so they got together and threw St. Augustine's out. It was only at that point that St. Augustine's moved to the ISA.

EDIT: All of their cricket and soccer teams still play in the local club competition not in the ISA.

 

[Brian Westlake]

Not really the periodic table is associated with chemistry.

Yep, you're 110% right. I should never have let sport get in the way of my education... Garnish the Master of Rugby's performance bonus please Ken.

 

[Spieber]

In theory, the grounds could be used, but most are privately owned, so I guess there would be payments involved there.

I would think the insurance issues alone would block the concept but happy to be corrected by the legal minds on this thread.

 

[Brian Westlake]

@muglair, I have nothing against the Philistinians such as yourself, but the Periodic Table Test is only suitable for those boys scientifically inclined.

You need some test for the more oratory and artistic such as to get them to describe the root causes of the current Israel - Philistine Conflict and assess if long term peace in the Middle East is achievable.

Reverse parking a box trailer?

 

[whatever]

In theory, the grounds could be used, but most are privately owned, so I guess there would be payments involved there.

In terms of personnel, I'm involved with a junior rugby club and getting parents to volunteer isn't easy. It's generally the same small group setting the ground up, working the bbq, coaching, managing so more people would be great. The problem I see in moving personnel from the school systems to club rugby is that most of the adults are school teachers who participate as a condition of their employment, once it's not a school team they'll spend their free time with their own family.

Sorry to be negative, I just think it's better to leave the schools to their own devices and for the ARU to put every spare dollar into junior club rugby.

I believe that what you sow you get and I believe in the case of rugby, it could be looking at its demise as tier 1 level sport in this country.

With the arms race (scholarships) in private schools and the failure of the selective sport high schools, we are now seeing the end results (lack of strong junior/school competitions and reduced numbers at the coal face).

Could be wrong (hope I am), let's see what the results are like at the end of the spring european tour and into the future.

 

[Hugie]

@muglair, I have nothing against the Philistinians such as yourself, but the Periodic Table Test is only suitable for those boys scientifically inclined.

You need some test for the more oratory and artistic such as to get them to describe the root causes of the current Israel - Philistine Conflict and assess if long term peace in the Middle East is achievable.

Hugh, all rugby followers and players need a good understanding of the Heisenberg rugby principle (physics).
Without this understanding how on earth can you enjoy rugby, scientifically inclined or not?

 

[It is what it is]

Reverse parking a box trailer?

Or, where does your lap go when you stand up?

 

[Brian Westlake]

Hugh, all rugby followers and players need a good understanding of the Heisenberg rugby principle (physics).
Without this understanding how on earth can you enjoy rugby, scientifically inclined or not?

Hugie,

Was that your Meth Lab that went up in flames?

All the best
Brian

 

[Hugie]

No. If it was I'd be in hospital with 3rd degree burns.

 

[Gristlechewer]

It has gone very quiet in the media regarding scots world domination. Saving it all up until the kids are back to school?

 

[Hugh Jarse]

^^ eye of the hurricane?

 

[Quick Hands]

It has gone very quiet in the media regarding scots world domination. Saving it all up until the kids are back to school?

We wait with baited breath for Dr Lambert's "external review". Joeys have already committed in writing to their parents that they won't be playing Scots in 1sts and 2nds basketball.

To me the most telling little fact that crept out almost unoticed, was Dr Lambert's statement that 19% of boys at TSC were on bursaries (this does not include academic or music scholarships). That's a lot paying either nothing or half fees (about 1 boy in 5). Depending on the figures one chooses to use, this equates to somewhere between $6,000,000 to $9,000,000 per year subsidised by someone (full fee paying parents?), showing that world domination certainly doesn't come cheaply.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

I wouldn't expect to hear much.
Lambert wont be releasing to the public the resultant report and I cant see the other schools putting much store in it anyway.
The next milestone is the conference of heads in a couple of weeks, i think.
Of course rumours should heat up when school goes back but we are above rumours now!

 

[fsrugby]

I have heard a rumour - only a rumour - that Lambert is not entirely happy with the interim findings of his 'independent' expert. As the story goes, they are providing more information, to hopefully change this.

As an aside possibly this Forum does need a moderator! - Again it has been suggested (another rumour!) that people who work for 'Schools' are active on this forum, to push negative Scholarship postings well down the list (ie not on the latest page). They are concerned that the 'media' have obtained 'ammunition/information' from this forum. If true, is this a compliment?

Conspiracy theories were bound to start!

 

[Freddo Frog]

To me the most telling little fact that crept out almost unoticed, was Dr Lambert's statement that 19% of boys at TSC were on bursaries (this does not include academic or music scholarships). That's a lot paying either nothing or half fees (about 1 boy in 5). Depending on the figures one chooses to use, this equates to somewhere between $6,000,000 to $9,000,000 per year subsidised by someone (full fee paying parents?), showing that world domination certainly doesn't come cheaply.

The bursaries at most schools, including Scots, start at 5% remission of fees, not 50%.