Round 11 Reds V Lions Sat Apr 28 3:05PM Suncorp Stadium

[jimmydubs]

The Reds mystery selections continue! Lucas has done nothing to justify his selection over the other halves who have played this year.
Stewart hasn't looked ready for super rugby in any game this year
George Smith was terrible last week.

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I’m guessing Lucas lifts bigger weights in the gym than the other 9s ergo thorn selection criteria met.

Stewart isn’t Quade, so he meets a different thorn selection criteria.

And Smith, yeah I’m not sure, I have eternal faith in George Smith so I’d pick him but shouldn’t based on last week. What thorn selection criteria does he meet? Maybe he blew thorn off enough rucks way back when to earn it.

 

[SouthernX]

There comes a time in every coach's career when he realises the players aren't responding to him. One of the clearest signs of this is when that coach starts picking rookies from nowhere.

First Petaia and now Hoopert. Two potentially talented players but no way do they deserve Reds jerseys yet. Meanwhile Fa'agase, Ready, Tuttle and Paia'aua continue to be rotated in and out. Its all very odd.

Can someone tell me about Petaia? What's his game? What's he bring to the table? I didn't see much of his schoolboy career and have only seen his bench cameos. Last week he obviously stepped a few players but I didn't see much to suggest he should leapfrog Perese.

Brad Thorn won a NRC title last year on the back of a youth movement. Perhaps his lineups are to do with continuing the youth movement, If the veterans can't fire up this team then roll the dice on the young puppies... perhaps it's all about 2019 and beyond?

 

[SouthernX]

I would have thought that by bringing Stewart in to start they might have brought Tuttle back as well since the pair have the experience together from the NRC. I've been disappointed in Lucas, I did hope that he would provide some valuable experience but he just looks off the pace. Duncan P must have recovered from whatever caused him to be limping around the stadium last weekend. Still don't understand what Ready has done wrong - Mafi hasn't seemed to bring much when he has come on and Ready is very good over the ball and scrummaging. As Reg indicated, some very odd selections. I hope the young winger goes well, he showed some good running last week, but then so has Perese on a number of occasions and Perese is a very good defender - not sure how Pataia will go with that. At least they didn't bring Nabuli in.

Nabuli should just pack his bags and go to France right now. I'd hate for him to come back into the reds lineup with nothing on the line and giving him a spot in the Reds 23 where you can use the rest of the season to evaluate your lineup with a player who's going to be here for next season.

 

[dru]

Brad Thorn won a NRC title last year on the back of a youth movement. Perhaps his lineups are to do with continuing the youth movement, If the veterans can't fire up this team then roll the dice on the young puppies. perhaps it's all about 2019 and beyond?

We've been hearing that since about 2014.

 

[SouthernX]

We've been hearing that since about 2014.

hearing what? youth movement? I'm talking about the 1 year coaching experience of Brad Thorn who's actually had success as a coach (albeit at lower levels) who's put his trust in the younger generations.

I never ever saw Richard Graham/Nick Stiles hand the reigns over to the next generation like Thorn has. His blooding all these younger players and we probably see the fruits of it 2 or 3 years down the track and Thorn may not even be around to see it all.

 

[RugbyReg]

hearing what? youth movement? I'm talking about the 1 year coaching experience of Brad Thorn who's actually had success as a coach (albeit at lower levels) who's put his trust in the younger generations.

I never ever saw Richard Graham/Nick Stiles hand the reigns over to the next generation like Thorn has. His blooding all these younger players and we probably see the fruits of it 2 or 3 years down the track and Thorn may not even be around to see it all.

In 2014 Graham brought in JJ Tualagi (20), Jonah Placid (19). Samu Kerevi (20), Scott Gale (19), Chris Kuridrani (22), Sam Johnson (21) in his first year while he still had a core from that 2011 team (even 2013 made the finals).

The next year he brought in Duncan Paia'aua, Campbell Magnay, Tom Banks, Michael Gunn, Adam Korzcyk, Andrew Ready, Lolo Fakoasilea, Jake McIntrye, Sam Greene

Stiles and McGahan brought in Lukhan Tui, James Tuttle, Taniela Tupou - with Graham deserving of much of that credit.

Stiles himself brought on Rodda, Perese, Vanzati, Alex Mafi, Sorovi, Stewart, Timu, Ngamanu and Reece Hewat.


They've all brought in the fresh blood.

 

[SouthernX]

In 2014 Graham brought in JJ Tualagi (20), Jonah Placid (19). Samu Kerevi (20), Scott Gale (19), Chris Kuridrani (22), Sam Johnson (21) in his first year while he still had a core from that 2011 team (even 2013 made the finals).

The next year he brought in Duncan Paia'aua, Campbell Magnay, Tom Banks, Michael Gunn, Adam Korzcyk, Andrew Ready, Lolo Fakoasilea, Jake McIntrye, Sam Greene

Stiles and McGahan brought in Lukhan Tui, James Tuttle, Taniela Tupou - with Graham deserving of much of that credit.

Stiles himself brought on Rodda, Perese, Vanzati, Alex Mafi, Sorovi, Stewart, Timu, Ngamanu and Reece Hewat.


They've all brought in the fresh blood.

Good researching there Reg. I do stand corrected.

Just feels like Brad Thorn is going with the younger lineups when you tell veterans like Cooper, Frisby and Karmichael Hunt they are not wanted and going in different direction.

 

[The torpedo]

If you're gonna put money on the reds, don't.

Put it on the Sunwolves - Sportsbet are paying $41.00 for them to roll the hurricanes

 

[biggsy]

Last I herd , Ewen McKenzie was working in Christchurch for a Town planner. Thorn knows Christchurch well....think he would know where Links is. Ewen seemed to get a young struggling team together within 10 weeks of his 1st year at coach and then a Super Rugby tile the following year. Ewen might be able to give him some tips...

I know I should be talking about the game this weekend as it’s the Rugby Match thread. But Im concerned I will take over @gel ‘s spot at being the most negative person on the forum.

 

[RedsHappy]

The Reds mystery selections continue! Lucas has done nothing to justify his selection over the other halves who have played this year.
Stewart hasn't looked ready for super rugby in any game this year
George Smith was terrible last week.

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B Thorn to his psych coach: 'Mate I've only just mastered the art of the gruff cover-up but now I'm in a state of raw panic and total uncertainty about what to do, who to pick, and what to tell the team. Otherwise, I just hope it works.'

 

[RedsHappy]

In 2014 Graham brought in JJ Tualagi (20), Jonah Placid (19). Samu Kerevi (20), Scott Gale (19), Chris Kuridrani (22), Sam Johnson (21) in his first year while he still had a core from that 2011 team (even 2013 made the finals).

The next year he brought in Duncan Paia'aua, Campbell Magnay, Tom Banks, Michael Gunn, Adam Korzcyk, Andrew Ready, Lolo Fakoasilea, Jake McIntrye, Sam Greene

Stiles and McGahan brought in Lukhan Tui, James Tuttle, Taniela Tupou - with Graham deserving of much of that credit.

Stiles himself brought on Rodda, Perese, Vanzati, Alex Mafi, Sorovi, Stewart, Timu, Ngamanu and Reece Hewat.


They've all brought in the fresh blood.

An HC can bring in all the rugby youth in the world but if he and his coaching team don't have the skill and patience to properly blood and develop them what will surely happen is that wave after wave of them will just fall away, downtrodden, disheartened, 'under performing' and lost. Then the next crop will be marched to the front only to mowed down, all over again, in just the same way.

 

[RedsHappy]

I am sick of watching guys run around who can't:

pass left to right
execute a tackle
draw and pass to make use of an overlap
kick
chase a kick
form a defensive line

That's all the Australian super rugby players.

They're rubbish. All of them.

I'll just watch the NZ teams play thank you very much - then I can actually enjoy the game I love instead of seeing it fucked over by spoilt individuals who (for years now) haven't done a thing to improve their deficiencies.

Reds to win in an upset.

Indisputably. All these chickens have now come home to roost in Australia whilst simultaneously the NZRU's deep investment in continuously building rugby skills competencies from the grass roots up and extended coaching R&D programs across all layers have taken their team capabilities to an altogether greater plane of rugby attainment.

We shouldn't be a bit surprised really. We knew this was coming. It's just become suddenly more obvious and even more fatal.

 

[jimmydubs]

Last I herd , Ewen McKenzie was working in Christchurch for a Town planner. Thorn knows Christchurch well..think he would know where Links is. Ewen seemed to get a young struggling team together within 10 weeks of his 1st year at coach and then a Super Rugby tile the following year. Ewen might be able to give him some tips.

I know I should be talking about the game this weekend as it’s the Rugby Match thread. But Im concerned I will take over @gel ‘s spot at being the most negative person on the forum.

Since then he's project managed building a recycling cum power plant thingy in ACT, not sure where after that or if that is still his latest gig. Seems like he hasn't looked back. I'm guessing he's getting the best out of the variety of folks working for him still...

Remember Ewen had 5 years of coaching including the tahs before he came to the reds.

 

[Sully]

Hamish is looking a little different these days.

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[Scrubber2050]

Hamish is looking a little different these days.

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Slipper was a 10 as a junior but this is a step too far.

Good to see Stewart get his start. Suppose we will see if he has the goods.

Tough game to find that out.

Good luck lad !

 

[The torpedo]

Lions by 30

 

[The torpedo]

B Thorn to his psych coach: 'Mate I've only just mastered the art of the gruff cover-up but now I'm in a state of raw panic and total uncertainty about what to do, who to pick, and what to tell the team. Otherwise, I just hope it works.'

ngl it makes me think of this:

 

[upthereds#!]

An HC can bring in all the rugby youth in the world but if he and his coaching team don't have the skill and patience to properly blood and develop them what will surely happen is that wave after wave of them will just fall away, downtrodden, disheartened, 'under performing' and lost. Then the next crop will be marched to the front only to mowed down, all over again, in just the same way.

how much of all that fresh talent either a) bailed or b) fizzled.

 

[liquor box]

Brad Thorn won a NRC title last year on the back of a youth movement. Perhaps his lineups are to do with continuing the youth movement, If the veterans can't fire up this team then roll the dice on the young puppies. perhaps it's all about 2019 and beyond?

I think you have to also consider the opposition, NRC is not the greatest place to test how good a player is.

Winning is an achievement but nowhere near an indication that the players are ready for Super Rugby.

What country did was have a team of good players without too many weaknesses. Most of the other teams had one or two "weaker" players that could be exploited.

 

[dru]

I don’t think we need to be ungracious about Thorns NRC achievements. I just wish he’d had a chance to spend more time there learning his trade.