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Reds 2017

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USARugger

John Thornett (49)
Rebuilding isn't an excuse for making basic mistakes like our players regularly do, under pressure or not.

It's a good argument if we were failing because of losing structure on 4th/5th phase, or set moves not coming off, etc - but we're regularly dropping the ball dead on 2nd/3rd phase, seem to have little structure beyond 1st most of the time, but somehow are managing 1st phase strike moves that break the line.

That screams coaching issues to me, or our players just aren't good enough to handle anything other than the set piece moves that they seem to be very drilled on.

It's not an excuse for the poor tackling form we've seen either. Defensive structural issues, sure (and we've got plenty of those) - but players tackling with hands and attacking the head of the defender shouldn't have anything to do with what phase of building towards the finals a team is in. It's a basic skill set that nearly every Super Rugby player should already have down long before they're in the squad.

It's either the coaching or our players just aren't up to it because they either A) never will be or B) are being debuted with far too little experience in any type of competition that actually prepares them for Super.

For me the losses aren't important, it's why we're losing and everything that's happening between that whistles that concerns me.

Pro 12 has some of the most mediocre professional teams on the planet running around in it, I would never want to use that as a measuring stick for our ability.
 

liquor box

Peter Sullivan (51)
Rebuilding isn't an excuse for making basic mistakes like our players regularly do, under pressure or not.

It's a good argument if we were failing because of losing structure on 4th/5th phase, or set moves not coming off, etc - but we're regularly dropping the ball dead on 2nd/3rd phase, seem to have little structure beyond 1st most of the time, but somehow are managing 1st phase strike moves that break the line.

That screams coaching issues to me, or our players just aren't good enough to handle anything other than the set piece moves that they seem to be very drilled on.

It's not an excuse for the poor tackling form we've seen either. Defensive structural issues, sure (and we've got plenty of those) - but players tackling with hands and attacking the head of the defender shouldn't have anything to do with what phase of building towards the finals a team is in. It's a basic skill set that nearly every Super Rugby player should already have down long before they're in the squad.

It's either the coaching or our players just aren't up to it because they either A) never will be or B) are being debuted with far too little experience in any type of competition that actually prepares them for Super.

For me the losses aren't important, it's why we're losing and everything that's happening between that whistles that concerns me.

Pro 12 has some of the most mediocre professional teams on the planet running around in it, I would never want to use that as a measuring stick for our ability.

Experience before debut is the issue, but wont be fixed, we will lose all of our kids overseas.

-In my ideal world you would play at school and for a club at junior level.

-The year after school you would play club seniors and rep juniors (U20's- State or country rep team, not super rugby team)

-Once you have played a season of club seniors you become eligible for NRC

-After one season of NRC you can become eligible for a contract with a Super Team but only train and play for a second 15 competition (instead of U20's)

-After a season of training with the big boys you can now play for a Super Rugby Team. If you are not required for Super Rugby then you must play Club seniors.

- All non spring tour players are expected to play NRC

This means a debut at 21-22 years of age minimum.

You also need to prove you are best to get selected at the next level along the way, you cant skip levels without developing the skills.

This wont happen unless we can find masses of money once a player makes the top grade as there will not be enough light at the end of the tunnel to stay in Rugby in Australia.
 

Strewthcobber

Simon Poidevin (60)
This wont happen unless we can find masses of money once a player makes the top grade as there will not be enough light at the end of the tunnel to stay in Rugby in Australia.

Also tough to convince 19 year Olds to hang around while they could be getting paid to play league just down the road

Sent from my D5833 using Tapatalk
 

Scrubber2050

Mark Ella (57)
I think Quade would be incredibly difficult to coach. The bloke has excellent rugby knowledge but for years he has been unable to translate onto the playing field on any sort of consistent basis.

Why ? - Fucked if I know but it is unacceptable to a professional sports club/franchise. Am sure there are excuses, some valid, some not.

One would imagine that QC (Quade Cooper) would be one of the highest paid players at the Reds and he is not playing anywhere near to his pay scale.

I couldn't care less about the excuse/s, I just am one of those poor floggers out there who wants to receive positive results (even if we lose)
 

formerflanker

Ken Catchpole (46)
In all seriousness, if you tasked me with fixing the coaching problems with Aus rugby one of the many things I would ban would be coaches running water.

If you aren't competent to get the job done in the other 166 hours per week you shouldn't be there.

Stiles used to live on the field at Force and Reds as an assistant, now Gilmore. Grey same at Tahs.

Every specialist coach needs to be seen earning their salary, hence the multiple messages relayed to the head coach and players during a game.
Captaincy is in danger of becoming a dying art.
To be able to see what is happening across all aspects of a game whilst maintaining your own role is difficult hence coaches and the sending of messages during drinks breaks, injury stoppages, and behind-the-tryline moments.
It would take a brave coach to fully trust a captain to take total control of a team from kick off to half time and then again in the second half.
That however would generate more use of the captain's intellect. A greater vision would be called for and rugby has people capable of that.
Stronger on-field analysis by captains is what I'm calling for, and coaches have to let go of their control.
Selecting the right captain (on field leader, strategist, motivator, and game analyst) would be the most important step a coach can take.
 

RedsHappy

Tony Shaw (54)
Actually Link referred to him as the best implementer of a game plan he's worked with.

I guess it depends on the coach in the end.

Quite so. I also think Link was making some sold progress with QC (Quade Cooper) as Wallaby 10 - his game vs the ABs in Dunedin late 2013, even though we lost, was perhaps (a) his best overall Wallaby performance ever and (b) one of the best Wallaby 10 performances vs the ABs in (say) the last 5-7 years.
 

Scrubber2050

Mark Ella (57)
Suppose we can talk about how good QC (Quade Cooper) actually was and why he's not as good anymore.

The real issue that the Reds need to address is when QC (Quade Cooper) goes or is flicked (by the Reds) who plays 10??

Most would seem to agree that McIntyre cannot fill the void
 

Happy to Chat

Nev Cottrell (35)
Suppose we can talk about how good QC (Quade Cooper) actually was and why he's not as good anymore.

The real issue that the Reds need to address is when QC (Quade Cooper) goes or is flicked (by the Reds) who plays 10??

Most would seem to agree that McIntyre cannot fill the void
And 12 min on the park doesn't make Stewart the idea candidate either.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

The torpedo

Peter Fenwicke (45)
Quite so. I also think Link was making some sold progress with QC (Quade Cooper) as Wallaby 10 - his game vs the ABs in Dunedin late 2013, even though we lost, was perhaps (a) his best overall Wallaby performance ever and (b) one of the best Wallaby 10 performances vs the ABs in (say) the last 5-7 years.

He had started to get hot from the 2nd game v the Argies (when we put 54 points on them).

He was also really good on the Spring Tour that year.

Had he not done his shoulder v the Rebels @ Lang Park in 2014, I reckon he may have continued his hot streak that year and beyond. Who knows what would've happened? Link may not have quit, no Giteau rule, 2017 may be going better than it is currently etc etc etc.

A man can dream
 

upthereds#!

Peter Johnson (47)
And 12 min on the park doesn't make Stewart the idea candidate either.


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Well Quade still has a couple years left so that will help stewart. Another u20 option coming through is Isaac Lucas. So In a couple years when Quade goes, those guys will be where Mcintyre is now (but hopefully better?)
 

RugbyReg

Rocky Elsom (76)
Staff member
just a bit of an injury update from Jimmy Tucker.

ONE face missing from the Reds all season has been former Wallaby Chris Feauai-Sautia.​
After a lengthy rehabilitation from a knee reconstruction following his injury in Japan during the off-season, the powerhouse was ready to roll.​
He did but for only around 30 minutes in the May 6 clash against Norths.​
Feauai-Sautia scored a try and made several linebreaks in an eye-popping return at outside centre before he went off with a hamstring twinge.​
Coach Elia Tuqiri hopes to get the big weapon back for the May 27 clash against Easts at Bottomley Park.​
Reds prop Markus Vanzati may also be back to bolster the Magpies who were a chastened lot after big losses to Wests (63-36) and Norths (57-20).​
 
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