Rebels 2014

[Sir Arthur Higgins]

I think Jones will be a world class 6, and then there's Cottrell coming on at the Force. 8 is looking like a problem.

I agree
higginbotham is subpar 8 man and based on what i've seen lopeti lacks the size, hands and running power to play 8.

i jest. i think we look pretty good at 8.

 

[Brumbieman]

Badger, there's about 100 reasons Beale why Beale will start at 10. Here's a couple for you to ponder.
1: Cheka is building a side that is effectively a S15 version of Randwick.
2: Cheka wants an Ella for a 10. A fly half that will take the ball to the line plus a flat line attack & pass.Randwick style. He ain't Mella, but he plays that way.
3: Beale is and has always been a 10. He only got chucked into the FB role to give him time to mature when he was struggling as a kid when first at the Tahs.
4; Folou is the best attacking FB in Australia and Cheika won't waste him on the wing like deans did. Besides he's got good finishers in Crawford, Bethan and Turner there already.
5: Did I mention Randwick? Running Rugby? Or the galloping greens?
6: Beale also is much stronger support runner in attack than Foley. Something you do a lot more of when you're constantly putting blokes through gaps.
7: Experience.KB (Kurtley Beale) has been on the scene now for a while and the big match experience will be pivotal in MC's plans. You gotta have it to win the tight ones.
8: game management. Beale has it in spades, Bernard not so much.
9: kicking game. There's a bit more tactical nous in KB (Kurtley Beale)'s kicking game than BF's. It's the Joey Johns in him that can prove quite handy in tight defensive games.
10: he's Wallaby and for all the reasons it takes to become one and everything you learn when you are one.

Did I mention Randwick yet?

As for BF and his management knowing about Beale. Maybe the did or may be they didn't. He certainly wasn't under the spotlight as much when BF was negotiating and there was still a good chance KB (Kurtley Beale) would remain a Rebel. I'm not saying he would move, but he might be pissed and if the Tahs needed coin for KB (Kurtley Beale) they might just say "hey Bernie, remember those Melbourne blokes you were talking too? Here's some coin, go and have another chat",

Or Bernard might say "I wanna start. If you can't let me start can I go somewhere that'll let me?".


Brumbieman. Izzy on the wing? Would you waste Mogg there? I rest my case.

Foley shits all over Beale as a professional flyhalf.

Beale carved up as a schoolboy, but he's a flyhalf in the way most schoolboy 10's are: he was the best player in the backline, so the coach put him at 10.

He doesn't have the game management, or distribution skills to be a professional 10. His method of distributing is the pass and loop around, AFTER he's run 15m sideways trying to find a hole and given up. He crabs as badly as Giteau did, and doesn't have a long pass fit to kiss the boots of Foley's long pass.

His skill set is best suited to 15, where he should play. This is not Randwick in the 1980's, its professional Super/International rugby in 2014. The game has changed son. Besides, where would Foley play if Beale was at 10?

Foley at 10 managing the game and setting up Horne/AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) in the midfield, with Folau and Beale and Betham chiming in at opportune moments to accelerate onto one of Foley's long passes.

I wouldn't play Mogg on the wing, because he's going to be the best fullback we've had since Latham. He's got a monster boot and a kicking game that belongs at 15. Folau has all the attributes of an exceptional winger, and an average to decent kicking game.

Folau, beale and Betham/Crawford is a fucken deadly back three.

 

[Brumby Runner]

I agree
higginbotham is subpar 8 man and based on what i've seen lopeti lacks the size, hands and running power to play 8.

i jest. i think we look pretty good at 8.

LOL. After Higgers I think 8 could be a problem for a while. Next best is probably Mowen, but I'd keep him at 6 preferably. But this is a discussion for another thread. For the Rebels, I think Jones at 6, Colby at 7 and Higgers at 8 is looking extremely good.

 

[fatprop]

Foley shits all over Beale as a professional flyhalf.

Beale carved up as a schoolboy, but he's a flyhalf in the way most schoolboy 10's are: he was the best player in the backline, so the coach put him at 10.

He doesn't have the game management, or distribution skills to be a professional 10. His method of distributing is the pass and loop around, AFTER he's run 15m sideways trying to find a hole and given up. He crabs as badly as Giteau did, and doesn't have a long pass fit to kiss the boots of Foley's long pass.

Link had him @ 10 near straight from school and 30 minutes from winning a S14 final, you don't do that with no game management.

He is a throw back to an earlier ball playing era when at 10. The 10 caught, passed and looped. His ability to get second touches and keep in play as a threat were his skillset, not 20m money balls.

I would still have him as second player-maker from 15 because of his counter attack threat, but he does have the skills.

 

[Tex]

It's a sharp backrow.

Jones seems to have his best games off the bench, hitting tired defenders in the midfield. Maybe keep Saffy as the starting blindside, if he re-signs? I don't think we've got a more damaging runner of the ball than Jones, tbh. Last week he seemed to have three guys hanging off his jersey each time he hit it up. Loves the physical stuff and has one of the best motors in the squad. Big things ahead for him.


What are people’s thoughts about the Foley debacle now that the dust has settled? Someone here hinted at ARU involvement to keep him at the Tahs, and now it’s transpired that KB (Kurtley Beale) and possibly Benji Marshall are possible signings for 2014. That’s a wealth of talent (and a bulging payroll) to be accommodated. I’ll be very dirty if Foley is relegated to the bench after Cheika’s histrionics to keep him up there. Would be a waste of young talent.

 

[KevinO]

Would love to know how much the Tahs receive in ARU top ups. Surely this needs to be looked at as it defeats the point of having a salary cap to try even the playing field.

 

[Zander]

Link had him @ 10 near straight from school and 30 minutes from winning a S14 final, you don't do that with no game management.

Everyone seems to forget this. The Waratahs were going to win until he went off (along with Vickerman).

His career would've taken a whole new path if he didn't get injured. Most likely Wallabies that year, instead he came back to 2009 disinterested and unfit and the whole year was a write off until Robbie (not enough credit here) played him at fullback on the EOYT against Gloucester, he carved and made his Wallabies debut off the bench at wing - the rest is history. Such a shame.

 

[fatprop]

Everyone seems to forget this. The Waratahs were going to win until he went off (along with Vickerman).

His career would've taken a whole new path if he didn't get injured. Most likely Wallabies that year, instead he came back to 2009 disinterested and unfit and the whole year was a write off until Robbie (not enough credit here) played him at fullback on the EOYT against Gloucester, he carved and made his Wallabies debut off the bench at wing - the rest is history. Such a shame.

Yep, Cooper made that tour because Beale was wounded

Instead, Beale got his first pro injury and didn't handle himself right, got fat, lost form, got dropped.

Robbie (despite being the world's worst coach ever) got him fit, on track and he became a world class 15.

 

[Zander]

It was Hickey that made him a great 15, he gets the credit there but Deans first proposed the outside back experiment.

 

[Tex]

Fellas, take this Tahs talk back to your own thread!

 

[en_force_er]

There was also some speculation on Monday night linking Marshall with the Melbourne Rebels. Tauber stressed that Marshall did not have a deal confirmed with any rugby union outfit.

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-league/...ests-tigers-20130715-2q06g.html#ixzz2ZAI2eZed

Back onto Rebels chat now.

Benji is slightly linked to the Rebels (but more with the Blues/Tahs). Interesting.

Would you take him? He's 28 and a classy bloke who's a professional through and through, plus he'd probably do well to link with the PI community which is so big in Vic rugby.

However, he'd be a risky signing for such a large price.

 

[RebelYell]

Robbie (despite being the world's worst coach ever) got him fit, on track and he became a world class 15.

Seriously, the world's worst coach ever? Never has a more ridiculous statement been made...

Would like to think that the Rebels seriously considered/did gauge his interest once they decided not to re-sign Hilly...

Has a phenomenal provincial record, and while his selections and defensive tactics ultimately lost him the confidence of the nation when it came to the Wallabies, he did very well in some aspects... Took some players, i.e. Pat McCabe and Berrick Barnes, to a level few others would have, and his record would have been a hell of a lot more impressive if he was not continually coaching against an All Blacks side that will be remembered in history as one of the best ever international sides...

 

[fatprop]

Seriously, the world's worst coach ever? Never has a more ridiculous statement been made.

Would like to think that the Rebels seriously considered/did gauge his interest once they decided not to re-sign Hilly.

Has a phenomenal provincial record, and while his selections and defensive tactics ultimately lost him the confidence of the nation when it came to the Wallabies, he did very well in some aspects. Took some players, i.e. Pat McCabe and Berrick Barnes, to a level few others would have, and his record would have been a hell of a lot more impressive if he was not continually coaching against an All Blacks side that will be remembered in history as one of the best ever international sides.

 

[RebelYell]

Following the departure of so many players on Friday, I started thinking about how we are looking for next year. Below is the side I have come up with, and I think it looks pretty strong - crucially, it leaves 5 spots on the 35-man roster (not sure how the Super B competition affects squad sizes) for backline strengthening (we will definitely need cover at lock as well as scrumhalf and five-eighth).

I have left Jarrod Saffy out as impression on here seems to be that he is leaving.

Lahiff, Leafa, Weeks
Pyle, Neville
Jones, Fainga'a, Higginbotham (C)
Burgess, Hegarty
Sidey, Inman
Mitchell, Woodward, English

Alo-Emile, Smith, Horie, Reid, Timani, Stirzaker, Kingston, Roberts

RES: Aholeiei, Ah-Nau, Sexton, Thomson, Dyer, Situati, Rokobaro.

 

[RoffsChoice]

pjfairbairn That looks like a solid team. Could probably have an even win-loss if it all goes their way.

I would expect Stirzaker to get as many starts, if not more than Burgess. Horie may also start more often too.

 

[Bowside]

The rebels badly need a flyhalf.

Even if hegarty comes good they still need someone to push him for the starting spot and provide injury cover.

 

[KevinO]

Would like to see more of English in the centers after watching him at 13 last Friday, think a 12/13 combo of English Inman would have a lot of back lines worried.

Think Stirzker will keep Burgo out of the starting line up, for a guy who had just come back from playing finals in France he seemed very slow against the Lions.

Can't see Leafa starting next season, will be Horie or Sexton.

Hegarty needs a good kicking coach.

 

[Braveheart81]

Burgess has looked poor in his outings for the Rebels so far.

Hopefully an off-season training with the side gets him back to where he was previously.

I really can't see him figuring for the Wallabies this year. Phipps and White are clearly ahead at him based on what we've seen so far.

It will be interesting to see what happens next season.

 

[Dumbledore]

I'd like to see:

Lahiff, Horie, Weeks
Pyle, Neville
Jones, Fainga'a, Higginbotham (C)
Stirzaker, Hegarty
Inman, English
Kingston, Woodward, Situati

PAE, Smith, Leafa/Sexton, Reid, Timani, Burgess, Mitchell, Roberts

Depth at flyhalf looks very shaky. Need someone at 12 too.

 

[Dumbledore]

It's a sharp backrow.

Jones seems to have his best games off the bench, hitting tired defenders in the midfield. Maybe keep Saffy as the starting blindside, if he re-signs? I don't think we've got a more damaging runner of the ball than Jones, tbh. Last week he seemed to have three guys hanging off his jersey each time he hit it up. Loves the physical stuff and has one of the best motors in the squad. Big things ahead for him.

Don't think that's quite true. His carrying doesn't seem to be quite as effective when he starts, he makes just as many carries as he has been coming off the bench - but he doesn't get nearly as many metres so it doesn't look as dramatic. He plays very tight for a 6, hits a lot of rucks and makes a lot of tackles - not necessarily the flashy stuff. His carrying does seem to have gone to another level in the last couple of matches, he was big against the Lions and just ridiculous against the Highlanders. A Jones - Colby - Higgers backrow is brilliant. Gives you four lineout jumpers, speed and application at the breakdown, tackling and some proper ball carrying ability.