Quade telling it how it is

[Hugh Jarse]

Come on BJ. "weighed into"?

A journo seeking a headline has badgered him into responding by asking a series of leading questions.

Sir Richie GOAT responded with class, style and tact.

"Now his arch nemesis Sir Ruchie has been dragged into the debate"

 

[Ruggo]

This is just an utter mess. Above all other things, rugby to me is fun and this has taken the fun out of rugby.

The situation needs a calming down period before calm heads can work it out. Quade do yourself a favor and smash the smart phone.

 

[Mr Doug]

I'm no KB (Kurtley Beale) fan,certainly at 10, but this is his chance and ill be more than happy to admit I was wrong: cometh the hour cometh the man.





Ditto for me too, IS

 

[No4918]

This is just an utter mess. Above all other things, rugby to me is fun and this has taken the fun out of rugby.

The situation needs a calming down period before calm heads can work it out. Quade do yourself a favor and smash the smart phone.

I agree. If he wants to stay, just sign the contract, rule himself out of the spring tour and spend the next 6 months getting his head straight. Send him into a 3rd world country for a month and see if he doesn't come back grounded.

If he is doing this on advice i do feel for him and hope he figures out whats going on and fires those around him. If it's his call then i don't know how he can stay and face his team mates at the Wallabies and Reds. His position with both organisations is becoming harder to justify.

Edit: the speculation that the ARU can not fire Deans now before the Lions as it would credibility to hos comments is BS.

 

[fatprop]

A bit of digression.

Is it wrong to suggest the problem "children" of Aus rugby at the moment are the guys signed from school, without further higher education or actually never having to do a 9 to 5 job?

 

[Mr Doug]

I agree. If he wants to stay, just sign the contract, rule himself out of the spring tour and spend the next 6 months getting his head straight. Send him into a 3rd world country for a month and see if he doesn't come back grounded.

If he is doing this on advice i do feel for him and hope he figures out whats going on and fires those around him. If it's his call then i don't know how he can stay and face his team mates at the Wallabies and Reds. His position with both organisations is becoming harder to justify.

Edit: the speculation that the ARU can not fire Deans now before the Lions as it would credibility to hos comments is BS.

No4918, there's no need to send him to a third-world country, just send him to the US for 6 months as Matthew Newton's "Principal Carer", that should 'make him or break him', either way, he'll be a changed person!!

 

[Sully]

A bit of digression.

Is it wrong to suggest the problem "children" of Aus rugby at the moment are the guys signed from school, without further higher education or actually never having to do a 9 to 5 job?

Has pocock ever had a job? Maybe he's the exception that proves the rule.

 

[p.Tah]

I admire your balls for putting forward the argument that a non drinking, non smoking, clean living, Aboriginal and Muslim, hero and outspoken advocate of Indigenous people is not marginalised in contemporary Australia.

What Nasser gives these guys is choices and opportunities and therefore a sense of importance and value. Please compare that to the
condescending and mocking JON missive that virtually said 'accept the offer or f. off'. A message aimed not only at QC (Quade Cooper), but also to others in the team who might be thinking of adding to the argument.

Ha. Touché, I shouldn't have include Mundine in that example, but it still stands for Quade and SBW.

Khoder provides them with opportunities, but surely there are less destructive ways to go about providing these opportunities? Putting your client up on National TV to make a fool of themselves in my view is not a worthwhile opportunity.
Perhaps Khoder sees it as a means to an end, but I'm certain when Quade is older and more mature he'll look back on the recent episodes with regret.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

Has pocock ever had a job? Maybe he's the exception that proves the rule.

If that is the game, add Hooper and Jones into the mix. Both straight from school to S15 level.

Maybe this phenomena is just a showpony backs thing. Piggies seem to manage well enough to comply with Fatprops doctrine.

 

[Scarfman]

Hugh are you insane? Richie has given him a huge serve, barely concealed.

This so so hard for me. Quade vs the fucking Robbie and Richie Show. I think by giving them ammunition this makes me even more frustrated with QC (Quade Cooper).

 

[Inside Shoulder]

A bit of digression.

Is it wrong to suggest the problem "children" of Aus rugby at the moment are the guys signed from school, without further higher education or actually never having to do a 9 to 5 job?

Maybe - but its also right

 

[Torn Hammy]

Is cooper really the most gifted footballer we have seen in along time? It's hard to argue, is it because he plays 10? Do we give Pocock everything he wants as well cos he is the best we have seen in a while at his position? What if JOC (James O'Connor) wants something? What if they all want something different? What happens to the concept of team? Quade isn't bigger than the game, he isn't the worlds best in his position. He is a very marketable star, especially for Qld and plays a style that provides clips to highlight reals. T say the ARU should be trying to make him happy at all costs is a load of BS, they should conduct negotiations to the same degree as any player inorder to keep everyone happy.

As for the media release, the main problem here is Quade has a manager, he is part of the players union and has representatives available to him to talk to, one of which is on the board at the ARU. He has a guide book on how to handle complaints and has ignored it all. He went public and broke protocol, the ARu wrote to him and then released a statement saying they wouldn't be conducting this in a public forum. What happens, Quade goes on the rugby club. The only dots that need be connected are that the ARu asked Quade to make no further public comments. He did. So the ARU decided to seize it as an opportunity to inform the public that Quade has never brought up the problems he speaks of, and as a result of his repeated outbursts he is rightfully in a shitload of trouble.

To believe that JON and a few others are sitting round like Nazis writing propaganda to intimidate and force compliance is pretty Ridiculus.

An argument based on an unseen letter from the ARU. Well done WJ. And do we close the thread down now. I'm citing Godwin's Law/Rule here.

 

[fatprop]

Has pocock ever had a job? Maybe he's the exception that proves the rule.

There was a piece by an ex AFL coach and now/was prof at Uni (ages ago and I can't find it)

It was about what characteristics to look for in young players. It was focussed on the AFL draft, but it came out with some interesting conclusions.

The challenge is that one of the key characteristics of a great footballer is risk taking, trying that pass, that kick etc etc

Unfortunately the same risk taking characteristics are also precursors for problem gambling, drinking, marital infidelity and drug taking

The report came to the conclusion that despite all the talent in the world, the fuzzy personal characteristics of a a young guy were just as important, if not more important. They went on to recommend looking at balance, attitude and school educational performance as much as physical stats when deciding on draft picks

 

[Torn Hammy]

Ha. Touché, I shouldn't have include Mundine in that example, but it still stands for Quade and SBW.

Khoder provides them with opportunities, but surely there are less destructive ways to go about providing these opportunities? Putting your client up on National TV to make a fool of themselves in my view is not a worthwhile opportunity.
Perhaps Khoder sees it as a means to an end, but I'm certain when Quade is older and more mature he'll look back on the recent episodes with regret.

Can't disagree with this, but the context here is a whole host of poorly educated islander boys who put their body on the line in professional football for very little reward.

We all make fools of ourselves in public when we are young. Most of us learn and get better at articulating our thoughts on the subjects we feel strongly about. I think Nasser has helped Mundine and SBW with this and I have no doubt that he will do the same for QC (Quade Cooper).

 

[Ruggo]

He needs to ditch the congo line of scabs that follow and advise him. I think Quade is very smart but also very impressionable. He is no dummy but doesn't posses the skills to present himself.

When the dust settles he must unconditionally retract and appologise for his comments about refusing to wear the Wallaby jersey.

In the present he needs to surround himself with those closest to him as Hugh said a few pages back. Under the rugby player is a human being and the pressure of this week can not be healthy for any man in such a situation. He has made some big mistakes and that is human. We have all made them.

I don't know what he does outside of rugby and Uni is not for everybody but he needs to be doing something educational. If he isn't academically minded, go and learn a trade.

 

[Scotty]

There was a piece by an ex AFL coach and now/was prof at Uni (ages ago and I can't find it)

It was about what characteristics to look for in young players. It was focussed on the AFL draft, but it came out with some interesting conclusions.

The challenge is that one of the key characteristics of a great footballer is risk taking, trying that pass, that kick etc etc

Unfortunately the same risk taking characteristics are also precursors for problem gambling, drinking, marital infidelity and drug taking

The report came to the conclusion that despite all the talent in the world, the fuzzy personal characteristics of a a young guy were just as important, if not more important. They went on to recommend looking at balance, attitude and school educational performance as much as physical stats when deciding on draft picks

I wonder how far we are from genetic testing for future sports stars. I know it can be done to determine a range of things, just interesting to see how it goes legally and morally.

 

[FrankLind]

Joe Roff

http://www.daimenhutchison.com/rugby/index.php/topic/37267-quade-cooper-making-friends/page__st__90

I've just spent anight on the piss in the company of Joe Roff and Stu Wilson. (hideous name drop, yet true). Roff simply stated that you never ever say that you dont want to play for your country -never. As a (great) bloke who turned down a huge contract offered by Tim Sheens back in the 90's to wear the Wallaby guernsey, he gave me the feeling that QC (Quade Cooper) had crossed an unforgivable line.

Put that way I certainly agree with him. Those comments would have made an impression on all past Wallabies. You learn to be a pro rugby player on and off the field, or fuck off. In fact even amateur rugby folk know never to publically diss your rugby team..

 

[I like to watch]

I am a frequent critic of the ARU but I don't see that they had much choice here: all the players and even the lesser officials have to know and understand who is driving the bus: hell, there are many threads complaining that no one has been at the wheel from village rugby to u20s. Negotiating theory is all fine but this is not merely a two party process here, there a many and wider considerations.
It is hard to imagine any coach enthusiastically signing QC (Quade Cooper): he would run the risk of being on the end of this sort of criticism. But the organization would be even less likely to be interested for similar reasons. The slightest hint of favoritism to him would be divisive within any team containing players with any sort of profile and could lead to those players employing similar tactics to gt what they wanted. Many bridges have been burned in this soap opera.
Finally, for all the money he brings them, is Khoder Nasser worth the angst. All 3 of Mundine, SBW and now QC (Quade Cooper) have had these sorts of blow ups with clubs/employers. It's crash or crash through stuff. The other 2 had options but I can't see QC (Quade Cooper) getting in the ring or playing league. So has Nasser only got this one shot in the locker - confront and walk if you don't overcome the other party to the negotiation?
I now feel sorry for QC (Quade Cooper).


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I agree with all of this except the one shot in the locker bit.
Wait a week or so after the ARU sack him, I am confident by then another opportunity will "come from nowhere"
This dispute has been staged by Nasser,there is a purpose to it.

 

[Torn Hammy]

On the surface it looks as if they have given him this and that back in July.

Personally I don't think he's the most talented footballer so maybe we'd start from different positions if we were handling the negotiations. I see and deal with negotiations between employers and employees every day and theres a wide range of tactics to be used. Quade brought it into the public arena. He made claims against the organisation. An organisation that has a media presence like the ARU would not sit idly by without a response. Thats not an unusual step in this climate.

Unfortunately I don't think they see him as leading the endeavours. He is part of the sum. And if he thought he was leading the endeavours would he really have taken this course while those he is supposed to be leading are on the other side of the hemisphere preparing to go into battle. I don't doubt they want him, but as part of the team, not calling the shots.

The ARU have given him and his management 3 months to consider their offer. There was no talk of that offer not being made in good faith, so when there is a game changer like the public episode weve just seen, then threatening to pull the offer IMO is not an unreasonable step in a negotiation. I've seen those very tactics used in something I'm dealing with right now.

When Cooper first appeared on the scene I was very unimpressed. There was the brilliance, but I thought he made his outside men very jittery because of his poor options and frequent hospital passes. Over time, however, I became a fan as it became clear he was working hard on his game and this began showing in the decisions he was making on the field. I think he has great vision and an instinct that uses his attacking skills to crack the best defences. This vision and instinct allows him to 'play what is in front of him', but is not so good for the coaches game plans, which is where we are at the moment. So yes, we will address negotiations completely differently.

 

[Mr Doug]

Problem: On a weekend which sees our two main rival football codes bathing in positivity as they prepare for their Grand Finals, we are in "damage mode"!

Solution: Excise the 'cancer', before it spreads.