Quade telling it how it is
- Thread starter Brumby Jack
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J
Jiggles
Guest
granted, but thats not the point.
The point is that if a coach can get what seems to be an average team on paper functioning with a concise and obvious game plan to succes, why can't a coach who is supposed to be superior do the same with a superior team?
Test match rugby is a pressure environment, no one disputes that. But I would rather see an attempt at a structured game plan which suits our players rather than 'play what is in front of you' (essential 'hope and pray one of the young freaks pulls it out of the bag') or the half assed version of the 2009 Boks which we are playing now.
Scotty
David Codey (61)
Which is why players need clear game plans and better support structures in test rugby. If you think that they have been getting that under Deans then you are the one in fantasy land.
Just look at the various styles of play we have had in attack already this year for proof of that Deans has lost it!
Scotty
David Codey (61)
Thomson hasn't had consistent time at test rugby. Poor example.
Inside Shoulder
Nathan Sharpe (72)
"like" is not sufficient endorsement.
We need a tight structure and plan.
Maybe "playing what's in front of you" is the last 3%.
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bullocks - the ABs don't beat us at the moment by using a "high-risk approach to maximise their talents" they do it because the work harder for eachother doing the simple things right. Even when they aren't playing perfectly they have units like Dagg in the last match staying alive and in support (working hard) They have units working back to support the ball carrier. They have units working hard to get that effective cleanout that keeps the ball flowing.
How about putting in and doing the 1%'ers
How about catching and passing and being unselfish - not stupid floaty cut out passes against drift defences.
How about working hard to create support lines
How about working hard to create options for the ball carrier
How about putting your body on the line in defence
How about better technique and height at the cleanout across the whole team
How about quicker realignment at phase play
Hugh Jarse
Rocky Elsom (76)
Where would we be without Quade Cooper, Sir Richie GOAT, and Robbie Deans?
Three bloody New Zealanders who are the subject of about 40% of all traffic on this site, especially on the threads that go for more than 3 or 4 pages.
Throw in the "duty thug" from Safferland, and you have another 10% of traffic accounted for.
Add another 30% for Reds vs Tahs sledging and banter, a lot of which also includes reference to Mr Cooper.
Three bloody New Zealanders who are the subject of about 40% of all traffic on this site, especially on the threads that go for more than 3 or 4 pages.
Throw in the "duty thug" from Safferland, and you have another 10% of traffic accounted for.
Add another 30% for Reds vs Tahs sledging and banter, a lot of which also includes reference to Mr Cooper.
ACT Crusader
Jim Lenehan (48)
In my view the gameplan from Deans is quite clear and not that different to what I saw in the ABs in 2003 and from the Crusaders 2005-07.
Side to side with a very flat attack line but with quick ball being created by both forwards and backs hitting rucks. Get mismatches in the midfield to allow straight runners - Umaga, Laulala, McCabe for example - to take advantage. Getting multiple players behind the ball when the opposition kicks to form a counter attack - Howlett/Mils/Rok/Spencer; Hamilton/Ralph/McDonald/Carter; ????
It's a very expansive (and high risk/reward) game that requires a committed forward pack to work their butts off for 80. Deans didn't always have that in 02-03 for the ABs but for most of his Saders years he did so it came off. It's not perfect but I would have thought "expansiveness" is not the issue here, because I would have thought this game plan would be right up with Coopers strengths.
On the comments my take is and I don't know Cooper but hey its an interweb forum
these comments are just a vent rather than so called constructive criticism. I don't have an issue either way, but the timing is somewhat interesting given he's been ruled out so probably feels embolden to vent.
Side to side with a very flat attack line but with quick ball being created by both forwards and backs hitting rucks. Get mismatches in the midfield to allow straight runners - Umaga, Laulala, McCabe for example - to take advantage. Getting multiple players behind the ball when the opposition kicks to form a counter attack - Howlett/Mils/Rok/Spencer; Hamilton/Ralph/McDonald/Carter; ????
It's a very expansive (and high risk/reward) game that requires a committed forward pack to work their butts off for 80. Deans didn't always have that in 02-03 for the ABs but for most of his Saders years he did so it came off. It's not perfect but I would have thought "expansiveness" is not the issue here, because I would have thought this game plan would be right up with Coopers strengths.
On the comments my take is and I don't know Cooper but hey its an interweb forum
these comments are just a vent rather than so called constructive criticism. I don't have an issue either way, but the timing is somewhat interesting given he's been ruled out so probably feels embolden to vent.
R
randalf8
Guest
And this, perhaps, is the problem.
Coming into Australia assuming that he has the same stock of players that he had in those NZ teams.
In my view the gameplan from Deans is quite clear and not that different to what I saw in the ABs in 2003 and from the Crusaders 2005-07.
Side to side with a very flat attack line but with quick ball being created by both forwards and backs hitting rucks. Get mismatches in the midfield to allow straight runners - Umaga, Laulala, McCabe for example - to take advantage. Getting multiple players behind the ball when the opposition kicks to form a counter attack - Howlett/Mils/Rok/Spencer; Hamilton/Ralph/McDonald/Carter; ????
It's a very expansive (and high risk/reward) game that requires a committed forward pack to work their butts off for 80. Deans didn't always have that in 02-03 for the ABs but for most of his Saders years he did so it came off. It's not perfect but I would have thought "expansiveness" is not the issue here, because I would have thought this game plan would be right up with Coopers strengths.
On the comments my take is and I don't know Cooper but hey its an interweb forum
and it works generally against all bar the best side in the world, because they can limit mis-mataches and have a more effective pack over any 80 minutes
ACT Crusader
Jim Lenehan (48)
Like I said its not too different, but not the same. I'm not sure if he assumed anything like that, what he probably thought though is that there were concerns with forward play under Knuckles and he needed to do something about it....
R
randalf8
Guest
Is that what "play whats in front of you" means?
I honestly don't know (still).
I honestly don't know (still).
It ain't hard, it is about opening your eyes and looking for and realising opportunities when they occur (mismatches / counting defenders / counter rucking etc) and leveraging those opportunities when they are seen with simple, effectively executed play
R
randalf8
Guest
well they stuck to that for about half an hour.
fortunately that expression seems to have fallen out of favour.
fortunately that expression seems to have fallen out of favour.
TSR
Andrew Slack (58)
From the transcripts I read, he never criticised Deans at all - he made the point that he backed himself and planned to continue to do so, and if that meant he was surplus to requirements, so be it. Might not be the smartest thing to say publicly, but at least he is honest.
His form may well be part of the problem at present but I 100% agree with the attitude that we need to play a lot more positively.
His form may well be part of the problem at present but I 100% agree with the attitude that we need to play a lot more positively.
I think the sign of a really great coach is the ability to sum up the strengths and weaknesses of the players at your disposal and come up with a winning game plan based on them. I hesitate to raise a League example, but I am also a St George fan, and the thing that impressed me so much about Wayne Bennett when he coached us is that he turned up day one, had a look around, summed up that they had the makings of a good defensive unit, with a long kicking 5/8, but probably lacked any of the attacking stars he had had at Brisbane and built the plan from there. St George were never going to win games 30 to nil, but they did win a lot by 10 to 4 etc. What has always worried me about Deans is that he doesn't seem to adapt his plan for the players he has available to use.
R
randalf8
Guest
It's the core of his failure, really. He's neither tailored a plan to what we've got, or successfully moulded what we have into what we need.
thierry dusautoir
Alan Cameron (40)
I dont think he is makign excuses he says that he makes mistakes because he would rather die trying then live wondering.
To the haters (waratah fans) i would say he probably knows what he is talking about. You know marshalling a team to a super rugby championship & a Tri-Nations.......Quade hasnt been in the same form as last year but that is understandable with the injuries.
But the thing that has always got me about deans is that he had a spine of such dominant super rugby team come in to last years international season in spectacular form. Yet he some how could not harness this. If anything is an indictment of his coaching, that was. The fact he could get results or build a game plan on halves pairing that was at the time arguably the form 9 & 10 in world rugby
To the haters (waratah fans) i would say he probably knows what he is talking about. You know marshalling a team to a super rugby championship & a Tri-Nations.......Quade hasnt been in the same form as last year but that is understandable with the injuries.
But the thing that has always got me about deans is that he had a spine of such dominant super rugby team come in to last years international season in spectacular form. Yet he some how could not harness this. If anything is an indictment of his coaching, that was. The fact he could get results or build a game plan on halves pairing that was at the time arguably the form 9 & 10 in world rugby
J
Jiggles
Guest
Problem is that you're going to have 15 guys thinking or seeing different opportunities at the any given time. they're never going to all line up and gell.
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