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NSW AAGPS 2022

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Joker

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Staff member
The formula doesn't change at Hunter's Hill.

Wrong my young apprentice.

Joeys have made major changes, mainly to the speed and ball playing ability of the forwards. Joeys had the equal longest drought of premierships (2008 to 2017) and they needed to do something. The coaches threw out the approaches used up to 2007 and started again. The emphasis is still on speed, BUT they have been using an Argentinian all round attack approach which served them well in 2018, 2019 (Triple Crown) and runners up in 2020.

You don't win 56 1st grade and 61 2nd grade titles without adapting.

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Ace Ventura

Ted Fahey (11)
Ace - "Interesting historical note: Marist No11 Lachlan Roff is the son of Joe Roff (Wallaby winger and Marist Old Boy), and also the grandson of Glenn Roff (Joeys Old Boy)."

Joker - "Joe Roff went to Marist Canberra I believe. My fav Wallaby winger"

?

anyway, can't argue with Joe Roff being up there with the great Aussie wingers, but my No1 has to be Ben Tune, then Campo.
 

Ace Ventura

Ted Fahey (11)
Wrong my young apprentice.

Joeys have made major changes, mainly to the speed and ball playing ability of the forwards. Joeys had the equal longest drought of premierships (2008 to 2017) and they needed to do something. The coaches threw out the approaches used up to 2007 and started again. The emphasis is still on speed, BUT they have been using an Argentinian all round attack approach which served them well in 2018, 2019 (Triple Crown) and runners up in 2020.

You don't win 56 1st grade and 61 2nd grade titles without adapting.

View attachment 13319
Joker - good point but I beg to differ on when the innovation in approach to Joeys rugby came into play. Br Henry was the great innovator and firm believer in speed and skill being key in the forwards. He is famous for his "brave" (as in Yes Minister "brave") and sometimes bizarre selections, often turning lower grade forwards into first-grade backs and vice versa. Br Anthony was known for selecting flankers as frontrowers and coaching the forwards to catch and pass like centres. His great teams of the 1980s, 90s and 2000's were hardly lacking in "speed and ball playing ability of the forwards".
There were lots of reasons for the Great Drought of 2008-2017 but I don't believe a fundamental coaching change in speed and ball-playing was the primary cause.
 

Black & White

Vay Wilson (31)
I am happy to report that at the AGM in 1983 the ATC rugby club changed its bylaws to allow non-students to play. Up until 1982 it was students ONLY but when you have a cohort of 120 per year and only 10 are young men the numbers just died. The Soccer club allowed locals to play but not the rugby club.

By 1982 we had some players playing up to three games on a Saturday. Finally in 1984 we had some players, mainly made up of blokes who had been kicked out, banned from Old Boys or UNE clubs or were released from jail and were looking for a "get square". These players appreciated the "Animal House" vibe we had going and the fact we had 100+ young female teachers attending most games. (the keg shed was infamous for its bacchanalian nature...hope you went there)

My final year was eventful as the 1st grade team did contain Peter Tonkin (classmate of mine at SJC) and about 12 townies. The best game was against Glen Innes when we won the game (Tonkin field goal again) and the fight in Glen. Best bus ride home too, after first stocking up at the Imperial Hotel.
Hello Joker
Reminds me of a few experiences, in my Robb days, 1981-1985a
 

Joker

Moderator
Staff member
There were lots of reasons for the Great Drought of 2008-2017 but I don't believe a fundamental coaching change in speed and ball-playing was the primary cause.
Thanks Ace

One of the catalysts for change was the adoption of pods and increased sizes by Scots College in 2009. They worked on the premise that size was the key and for a five years they were correct as schools had no idea on how to counter them. At times Newington matched them with their Pacific monsters, but Joeys were still using the Brother Anthony model which worked a treat when all sides were pretty much the same size. Scots were able to overcome the natural falling away in fitness for these HUGE lads by utilizing the most desired training facility in Sydney. When a school has equipment that professional rugby league has no access too, then you know that you are in an arms race. So for a few years the adage "might is right" held sway in the GPS.

How did Joeys respond?

The game plan since Brother Henry was to always meet them face to face and for a small time in a game, Joeys held their ground but the "bash it up and hope to offload" was not working as the larger teams were swallowing them up and sapping the Joeys boys energy. Joeys decided on a new game plan in 2018 at the early part of the season. It is no secret that the team held an "intervention" with one of the coaches. The system that Boyd had introduced was not working now as it had done in his era (the coach even played under Boyd). Something had to be done. The coaches listened and started to tinker with Boyd's plan. "How do we slay the monsters?"

FIRST they have a very strong front row, still mobile, but strong enough to win scrums. Use the scrum as a weapon and use it to launch the backs where the match ups is even. A new S&C coach was brought in, Kevin "Blood & Guts" O'Kane who worked wonders developing core strength and powerful legs. If anyone saw the Joeys/GPS front row (much smaller than the CAS) in 2021 decimate the CAS lads at Knox can attest to the skill and STRENGTH.

SECOND. Game play saw the Joeys forwards move beyond running the 10 and 12 channel. In fact at times second rowers passed the ball rather than hit it up. There was not just one linking forward (6) but everyone could now do this. The Joeys 10 was able to have more width and less traffic to deal with, plus a healthy use of dancing feet was employed by the 12 and 13. Joeys 12 in 2018 ran riot most of the season as he was now able to use the space in front of him. Defenses found it hard to set their big men into a defensive pattern when all of a sudden the ball was being shifted quickly away to the 13 channel and there was at times hard running props there hitting it from there. Opposition 12/13 were now having to tackle the Joeys front rowers which saw in the end, holes open up when the ball was shifted again.

The changes were subtle to the naked eye, but you can see the change in attitude as well. Suddenly there was belief again as they were now using a style that most schools had no match to. Kings played an excellent game in 2020 against a very tired Joeys team who had been beaten up and bruised by View the week before. Who knows who would have won if Joeys had an easier match before?

Anyway, Ace this was a longer response than intended but I hope I have added to the discussion.
 
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wyvernboy

Banned
Hi Joker

Hook, Line and Sinker
Knew I'd get a response. Comment about "formula doesn't change at Hunter's Hill " was not meant as a negative but more an appreciation. You don't win 56 1st and 61 2nd by not doing something right. Joeys's do attack the 12/13 channel and do it better than most. Agree that all teams had to adjust to the "arms race" which came about in the late 2000's and Joeys have started to play more footy in the forwards. Their front row in 2021 was awesome. Agree that specific S&C training is vital to teams if they want ot prepare well.
As the great general Sun Tzu said "Know thy enemy, know thy self ". Don't let too many secrets out of the bag Joker. The apprentice has his own ways as well. We will have some fun this year.

Wyvernboy
 

Joker

Moderator
Staff member
No I was winger in our Keg Kickers 4th Grade Side.
I remember you guys. Wild bastards.. Would go "missing in action" though afterwards when we hosted you at Moran Oval. Must have been intimidated by the infamous Keg Shed. Our women's boat racing team actually beat the UNE Colleges mens teams one year. Never get between a teacher and alcohol.
 

Ace Ventura

Ted Fahey (11)
Anyway, Ace this was a longer response than intended but I hope I have added to the discussion.
Excellent post Joker! Bit concerned some of it might find its way cut & pasted into opposition training manuals, however. :rolleyes:

Last year's front row were the best I've seen in many a long year, led by the No2 and captain, but also rated was the relatively small tighthead who was a quiet achiever, especially at scrum time. The rep selectors, whose qualifications for judging talent are sometimes questionable, treated him unfairly, according to those who know. It'll be interesting to see how this year's front three shape up.

Joeys has five trials on consecutive weekends coming up, from 7 May: Kings (a), Barker (h), Knox (h), Scots (h) and Riverview (h).
 

Joker

Moderator
Staff member
Bit concerned some of it might find its way cut & pasted into opposition training manuals, however. :rolleyes:

No need to worry. They have been watching the same games we have, studying the video and still have not figured it out. There was plenty I also left out such as lineout strategy, scrum tactics, back-line running channels and the best of all....breakdown work which has improved dramatically. Just watch the Joeys v View last 4 minutes video to see how they can hold onto the ball for a long time (with a bit of luck though that day)
 

Black & White

Vay Wilson (31)
I remember you guys. Wild bastards.. Would go "missing in action" though afterwards when we hosted you at Moran Oval. Must have been intimidated by the infamous Keg Shed. Our women's boat racing team actually beat the UNE Colleges mens teams one year. Never get between a teacher and alcohol.

Hello Joker
Yes, Armidale police well prepared and in force on Friday/Saturday Nights, along that strip of Road, leading to UNE Colleges. Upon which they would test us to see if there was any blood in our alcohol. Many a Robb boy ( as did others), particularly, those Albies boys after they attended Mass)'became well acquainted with the back of the Police Van.
 

Big Papi

Herbert Moran (7)
Hey lads,

I am back from a season long break from AAGPS rugby, keen to hear some early predictions based on the recent trial games.

BP.
 

propsarespeedy

Ted Thorn (20)
Hey lads,

I am back from a season long break from AAGPS rugby, keen to hear some early predictions based on the recent trial games.

BP.
Newo vs Scots should see many great games and mixed results. Specific fixtures/team lists haven't been published yet to my knowledge but should be out quite soon. Firsts are playing at Newington main oval but i'm not sure what time they're on.
 

wyvernboy

Banned
Hi All

New v Scots at New. 2nds at 2pm, 1st at 3.15pm. 16A's at 12pm all on Johnson Oval. All A games at most other games are at Newington. Teams out Friday. Should be a good first trial for both teams. Hope both school's coaches mix it up a little and let their squads play. Tip: Newington by 14.


Wyvernboy
 

propsarespeedy

Ted Thorn (20)
Hi All

New v Scots at New. 2nds at 2pm, 1st at 3.15pm. 16A's at 12pm all on Johnson Oval. All A games at most other games are at Newington. Teams out Friday. Should be a good first trial for both teams. Hope both school's coaches mix it up a little and let their squads play. Tip: Newington by 14.


Wyvernboy
Are the Junior A's (13's 14's 15's) on the main oval or other ovals? Was a big topic of conversation last year.
 
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