Ireland v Wallabies - Sunday 1 Dec, 2:10 AEDT

[JRugby2]

I wonder if the class of our 9s is directly correlated to the class of our forward pack.

This is absolutely true for Tate.

His pass is clearly the Achilles heel for him but with a dominant forward pack who give him either extra time or the option to pick and pass, it's then good enough to not hinder the team.

When his team is being beaten at the breakdown, he's severely muted

 

[Major Tom]

I will never be convinced this is anything other than refs swinging off the ABs nuts. As much as I rated him Owens was the worst for this.

You can't tell me TJP doesn't automatically annoy the fuck out of you merely for existing.

This is fair. I remember even Gregan used to get on the ref's tit for simply asking the ref a question! Would've been shot on the spot if he carried on like Aaron Smuth. Still, he was a frustratingly amazing player!

 

[Major Tom]

I wonder if the class of our 9s is directly correlated to the class of our forward pack.

It would be both surely. Part of the halfback's job is to effectively boss the forwards around to create that clean ball. When the piggies are on top that's when life is easy, and deficiencies are overlooked.

 

[Derpus]

This is absolutely true for Tate.

His pass is clearly the Achilles heel for him but with a dominant forward pack who give him either extra time or the option to pick and pass, it's then good enough to not hinder the team.

When his team is being beaten at the breakdown, he's severely muted

A good halfback is key in defusing pressure when it's applied IMO. Its not enough to be able to take advantage of forward dominance as this will never be the case for the entirety of a match.

Gordon did this very well at the start of the year with some really pinpoint clearing box kicks against Wales. Since then he has progressively worsened with Ireland being his nadir.

 

[Strewthcobber]

This is absolutely true for Tate.

His pass is clearly the Achilles heel for him but with a dominant forward pack who give him either extra time or the option to pick and pass, it's then good enough to not hinder the team.

When his team is being beaten at the breakdown, he's severely muted

It's chicken and egg for Tate though. His passes are so scattergun that a lot of the time it interrupts the forward runners, which means they get tackled short of the ad-line and then the opposition have an easier time slowing it down, which results on more pressure on the pass etc

 

[cyclopath]

A good halfback is key in defusing pressure when it's applied IMO. Its not enough to be able to take advantage of forward dominance as this will never be the case for the entirety of a match.

Gordon did this very well at the start of the year with some really pinpoint clearing box kicks against Wales. Since then he has progressively worsened with Ireland being his nadir.

I think all our 9s have looked worse with the accelerated timeframe for clearing the ball; where they had ages to fuck around behind the caterpillar, now they don't. Tate has probably been impacted the most.
I can't really see why Gordon's box-kicking went from the level of the Wales Test (very good distance and accuracy wise) to what we saw last weekend, although the increased pressure on the breakdown from Ireland (urgency and egregious lolly-gagging where they shouldn't) was probably a big factor. Kudos to Ireland.
As stated by someone earlier, better quality ball more on the front foot works wonders.
Longer term I think McDermott has the most upside of those in the squad now (if they can tidy up his passing options and delivery) ; others outside it will have chances...

 

[Rob42]

I think all our 9s have looked worse with the accelerated timeframe for clearing the ball; where they had ages to fuck around behind the caterpillar, now they don't. Tate has probably been impacted the most.
I can't really see why Gordon's box-kicking went from the level of the Wales Test (very good distance and accuracy wise) to what we saw last weekend, although the increased pressure on the breakdown from Ireland (urgency and egregious lolly-gagging where they shouldn't) was probably a big factor. Kudos to Ireland.
As stated by someone earlier, better quality ball more on the front foot works wonders.
Longer term I think McDermott has the most upside of those in the squad now (if they can tidy up his passing options and delivery) ; others outside it will have chances...

It's not just the "use it!" call that's changed - the 9 can no longer be protected by a blocker standing in front of them. A good change, it was previously just deliberate obstruction, but it really cuts down the time for scrum-half to kick once the ball is lefted.

 

[Derpus]

It's not just the "use it!" call that's changed - the 9 can no longer be protected by a blocker standing in front of them. A good change, it was previously just deliberate obstruction, but it really cuts down the time for scrum-half to kick once the ball is lefted.

I saw Ireland block at least once last match.

 

[John S]

It's almost as if the refs are still getting used to the new laws, not just the players!

 

[Pfitzy]

I thought he was reffing last year's interpretations for the first quarter

 

[TSR]

Thanks gents. I’m hoping a being a lifelong supporter of the Wallabies has me pretty battle hardened for first time fatherhood!

Sadly nothing can prepare you for that awful day when your kid runs onto the field and you realise they are playing wing.

You just try to be proud of them whilst wondering where you messed up.

 

[Yoda]

Well, the bookies had us as 14 point underdogs so the result shows we have come a long way from where people expect us to be.

Main takeaways from the game (and prob more suitable for Wobs 2025 thread) for me are:

- flyhalf is going to be the most heavily scrutinised super rugby position in 2025, it’s still definitely up for grabs. Noah was good enough in the series to get first dibs though if no one else is outstanding.
- JAS will just keep getting better and I think he will be a very complete player after SRP2025.
- For the benefit of the BIL series I’ll put my Red heart aside and if the likes of McReight, Wilson and Faessler need some rest to be fit for the Wobs, then fair enough. I think we need all three of those blokes in a team to actually win big games.

Agree on flyhalf Phil. Donno got little minutes and will have to play well in Super rugby. I just don’t see why Noah is being persisted with. When we needed him to get the backline going at the back end he didn’t. As many have brought up, his touch finding is below par compared to Donno’s. Maybe Joe didn’t want a revolving door and I totally get that. I just believe he has backed the wrong horse. Flyhalf is definitely up for grabs next season.

 

[Tomthumb]

I find the fact Tate McDermott has been a professional rugby player for 8 years and hasn’t bothered improving his passing or kicking at all is a bit of an indictment of his dedication (or lack thereof) to be honest

Feels like we have quite a few players like that. Make super rugby and just think they have made it and plateau and stop doing the extras to continue to improve

 

[Tomthumb]

Agree on flyhalf Phil. Donno got little minutes and will have to play well in Super rugby. I just don’t see why Noah is being persisted with. When we needed him to get the backline going at the back end he didn’t. As many have brought up, his touch finding is below par compared to Donno’s. Maybe Joe didn’t want a revolving door and I totally get that. I just believe he has backed the wrong horse. Flyhalf is definitely up for grabs next season.

While I’m not sold on Noah, Joe Schmidt seemingly is for some reason. Would be bizarre for him to drop Noah after backing him all year despite the underwhelming return

 

[Yoda]

While I’m not sold on Noah, Joe Schmidt seemingly is for some reason. Would be bizarre for him to drop Noah after backing him all year despite the underwhelming return

True, although if others have strong seasons in Super rugby and he doesn’t? As I said, this position is not locked in imo.

 

[Derpus]

I find the fact Tate McDermott has been a professional rugby player for 8 years and hasn’t bothered improving his passing or kicking at all is a bit of an indictment of his dedication (or lack thereof) to be honest

Feels like we have quite a few players like that. Make super rugby and just think they have made it and plateau and stop doing the extras to continue to improve

Maybe the fact that its multiple players across the whole of Australia indicates more of a systems issue?

 

[Tomthumb]

Maybe the fact that its multiple players across the whole of Australia indicates more of a systems issue?

Nah, they are grown adults and professional sportsmen. If they really wanted to improve they would spend the time and seek the coaching and put the hours in to become great at their craft

 

[Derpus]

Nah, they are grown adults and professional sportsmen. If they really wanted to improve they would spend the time and seek the coaching and put the hours in to become great at their craft

All personal failings then eh. Nothing we can do.

 

[Pfitzy]

Twaddle.

Narrow development pathways in player and coach development are responsible.

The competitions feeding them aren't fit for purpose e.g. schools is more lightweight than it ever has been.

 

[Tomthumb]

So Tate McDermott couldn’t improve his pass as a man in his mid twenties because our pathways aren’t great?