Ireland v Wallabies - Sunday 1 Dec, 2:10 AEDT

[Derpus]

Back to back weeks of teams better than us with star players we didn’t want is a bit funny

Been over it a few hundred thousand times already but we definitely wanted Mack.

 

[Yoda]

Tom Thumb. Noah has been backed to be our starting 10 for the majority of Tests this year. He has hardly shot the lights out, especially with the last Test. He fluffed the first kick off right from the get go, was poor in line kicking and didn’t look good defensively with a couple of missed tackles. People say we have no one else. Donno gets 5 mins or so in these last 3 Tests on tour. How is that anyway to do anything? I’d start him.

 

[Tazzmania]

As per allrugby.com

 

[KOB1987]

Tom Thumb. Noah has been backed to be our starting 10 for the majority of Tests this year. He has hardly shot the lights out, especially with the last Test. He fluffed the first kick off right from the get go, was poor in line kicking and didn’t look good defensively with a couple of missed tackles. People say we have no one else. Donno gets 5 mins or so in these last 3 Tests on tour. How is that anyway to do anything? I’d start him.

My read on this is that his role is an actual reserve and not a planned substitute. The reason Joe doesn't empty the bench until 5 minutes to go is that we don't want to get caught in a situation where we have to play 20 minutes with 14 players because we don't have anyone left to cover an injury.

 

[stillmissit]

I don't think starting Donaldson is a major setback for Lolesio, more horses for courses. As Schmidt repeats often we need a team with some experience but how much experience has Donaldson got out of this tour? How will he be next season if lolesio goes down?
We need them both until a good 10 turns up.

 

[stillmissit]

My read on this is that his role is an actual reserve and not a planned substitute. The reason Joe doesn't empty the bench until 5 minutes to go is that we don't want to get caught in a situation where we have to play 20 minutes with 14 players because we don't have anyone left to cover an injury.

Good thinking KOB my only reply is that we are always open to that issue as you can't cover everyone in the team. All he's doing is reducing the odds and not doing what he states he wants. The game is risky and he is doing a balancing act but that ain't new in Aus rugby.

 

[Yoda]

My read on this is that his role is an actual reserve and not a planned substitute. The reason Joe doesn't empty the bench until 5 minutes to go is that we don't want to get caught in a situation where we have to play 20 minutes with 14 players because we don't have anyone left to cover an injury.

I totally agree and understand that KOB. I guess Donno and Edmed just have to relish playing 80 minutes of Super rugby next year for their franchises each week and play well to change Joe’s thinking.

 

[KOB1987]

I agree that against Wales when we were clearly going to win he could have taken the risk and given him more minutes. I guess the benefit of keeping Donaldson on the bench is that he is versatile and you could envisage a scenario where just about any injury aside from a front rower can be accomodated - it might mean something like Wilson goes into the row and Pietsch moves to flanker or something like that. I could see him covering even halfback adequately and I'm sure he'd train there some sessions.

 

[Yoda]

I don't think starting Donaldson is a major setback for Lolesio, more horses for courses. As Schmidt repeats often we need a team with some experience but how much experience has Donaldson got out of this tour? How will he be next season if lolesio goes down?
We need them both until a good 10 turns up.

A set back? He’s hardly outstandingly better than Donno imo.

 

[stillmissit]

I agree that against Wales when we were clearly going to win he could have taken the risk and given him more minutes. I guess the benefit of keeping Donaldson on the bench is that he is versatile and you could envisage a scenario where just about any injury aside from a front rower can be accomodated - it might mean something like Wilson goes into the row and Pietsch moves to flanker or something like that. I could see him covering even halfback adequately and I'm sure he'd train there some sessions.

Sensible KOB but something is nagging at the back of my mind. We went down that rabbit hole of putting our faith in him during Rennie's time and there has been little change.
I am not convinced Donaldson would have faired any better but we cannot go into a game where Lol is under serious pressure without a plan to deal with a poor performance from him. I would have thrown the dice and brought Donaldson on at the start of the second half last week.

 

[Wilson]

Sensible KOB but something is nagging at the back of my mind. We went down that rabbit hole of putting our faith in him during Rennie's time and there has been little change.

Wait, are you trying to say that Rennie put faith in Lolesio here?

Because I'd argue that Rennie's mismanagement and generally dicking around of players, Lolesio more than most, was one of the major failings of his era.

 

[KOB1987]

Joe's brief is to provide a team that is competitive against the Lions so it's probably no coincidence that he's 5-1 against NH teams and 1-5 against SH teams. I am guessing that he sees Lolesio as the best fit for his strategy against the Lions, and said strategy being practiced against the AB's and Saffers was a dose of collateral damage that needed to occur in the interest of prioritising the longer term importance of the Lions tour. Once the Lions are out of the way, regardless of who the coach is we may see some of the other #10 contenders being given a bit more of an opportunity.

 

[stillmissit]

A set back? He’s hardly outstandingly better than Donno imo.

True and we have all seen that, but Lol was very poor against Scotland yet Schmidt gave Donaldson 5 mins, probably due to what KOB suggested.
At this time we have no idea if Donaldson would be better in tight situations. I think he doesn't have a better skill set than Lol but he is steadier in the tough stuff is my opinion. Lolesio is, as I have mentioned before, apt to lose his composure when we are on the back foot and against Ireland that is a killer.

 

[stillmissit]

Wait, are you trying to say that Rennie put faith in Lolesio here?

Because I'd argue that Rennie's mismanagement and generally dicking around of players, Lolesio more than most, was one of the major failings of his era.

I recollect that he started Lolesio a lot early on then went looking for better 10.

Searching Australia for talent is not limited to Rennie, most of the coaches since McQueen have tried many options looking for a decent 10, 6, 12, et al

 

[stillmissit]

I think Schmidt is backing Lolesio at 10 expecting that giving him time to settle into the position he will improve. I hope he's right but suspect Lol's problems are endemic to his personality ie he gets a bit gun shy when the going gets tough.

 

[Yoda]

Joe's brief is to provide a team that is competitive against the Lions so it's probably no coincidence that he's 5-1 against NH teams and 1-5 against SH teams. I am guessing that he sees Lolesio as the best fit for his strategy against the Lions, and said strategy being practiced against the AB's and Saffers was a dose of collateral damage that needed to occur in the interest of prioritising the longer term importance of the Lions tour. Once the Lions are out of the way, regardless of who the coach is we may see some of the other #10 contenders being given a bit more of an opportunity.

Well I hope Lolesio shoots the lights out against all his competitors in Super rugby because otherwise he won’t be lining up against the Lions.

 

[KOB1987]

Well I hope Lolesio shoots the lights out against all his competitors in Super rugby because otherwise he won’t be lining up against the Lions.

I think he has already made the call - I don't think he needs to shoot the lights out, just needs to be on par. Personally I would prefer Donaldson there as well but the evidence is mounting that that's not going to happen.

 

[whitefalcon]

Is Lolesio there as well for the combo with Ikitau and Wright who both now look to be amongst the first names on the team sheet

 

[stillmissit]

Is Lolesio there as well for the combo with Ikitau and Wright who both now look to be amongst the first names on the team sheet

Haven't seen much evidence of that combo.

 

[Tomthumb]

Tom Thumb. Noah has been backed to be our starting 10 for the majority of Tests this year. He has hardly shot the lights out, especially with the last Test. He fluffed the first kick off right from the get go, was poor in line kicking and didn’t look good defensively with a couple of missed tackles. People say we have no one else. Donno gets 5 mins or so in these last 3 Tests on tour. How is that anyway to do anything? I’d start him.

Oh I agree. I’m a Donaldson fan and think his ball playing and kicking game has a higher ceiling than Noah. But he’s been weak on the tackle so that isn’t a reason to start him