Declining participation and ARU plans for the future

[WorkingClassRugger]

I think that commercial club or franchise sevens competitions would work best in sessions lasting 3 hours max (each team plays once), with say 3 competition days per week over a period of 4 or 5 weeks. It could be a pretty good TV product.

You could work with six franchises across five to six weeks consisting of both men's and women's squads. You could then run one competition round a week running over six games over a 3 hour timeframe. Over the 5-6 weeks each team would play each other once. The home team squads would play the last two games of each evening. Could play the games with the championship timing of 10 minute halves.

Alternatively they could go with an extended format like the one I've alluded to above. However, instead of going for 12 minute quarters it could be reduced to 7 minute quarters. With a men's and women's squad each franchise could run two 45 minute competition periods over a two hour TV window. Allow for 14 man game day squads with unlimited interchange. So if balanced each player will have 14 minutes on the field.

 

[Omar Comin']

Alternatively they could go with an extended format like the one I've alluded to above. However, instead of going for 12 minute quarters it could be reduced to 7 minute quarters. With a men's and women's squad each franchise could run two 45 minute competition periods over a two hour TV window. Allow for 14 man game day squads with unlimited interchange. So if balanced each player will have 14 minutes on the field.

I really don't like the extended format idea. You would get a lot of huge blow outs, 100-20 type scores and worse, with the game over very early. Also, the best players would be off the field for large amounts of time each match, and the intensity of play would drop. I think one of the best things about sevens is the fact you get the multiple contests one after the other every 25 minutes or so. Sometimes you get dud games or really one-sided matches, but you have others to look forward to.

 

[wamberal]

We also have to face the pretty obvious fact that if you are not pretty pacy, forget it.


Let's say it is a game for the fastest twenty percent? Or thirty?



That leaves out a lot of us.

 

[Highlander35]

Extended format would work if you don't go for anything but the finals guidelines, i.e. 10 minutes a half. Taking an 8 team, 9 round competion across 4 weekends, for the sake of argument, using the NRC,

Week 1:

Gameday 1: Thursday, Round 1 in Sydney
Gameday 2: Sunday, Round 2 in Newcastle/Country NSW

Week 2:
Gameday 3: Wednesday, Round 3 in Brisbane
Gameday 4: Saturday, Round 4 in Country Queensland/Gold Coast

Week 3:
Gameday 5: Tuesday, Round 5 in Perth
Gameday 6: Friday, Round 6 in Adelaide

Week 4
Gameday 7: Monday, Round 7 in Canberra
Gameday 8: Thursday Semi-finals in Melbourne
Gameday 9: Sunday, Finals in Sydney

Or something.

 

[Omar Comin']

Maybe, but not all sevens players are quick even at the highest level. DJ Forbes has had a pretty good sevens career for NZ and he's not fast. I doubt it discounts a significantly higher % of people than Aussie Rules for example. And the size of the field can be modified for different age groups and levels, which helps.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

I really don't like the extended format idea. You would get a lot of huge blow outs, 100-20 type scores and worse, with the game over very early. Also, the best players would be off the field for large amounts of time each match, and the intensity of play would drop. I think one of the best things about sevens is the fact you get the multiple contests one after the other every 25 minutes or so. Sometimes you get dud games or really one-sided matches, but you have others to look forward to.

That was one of the major issues people have had with the 12 minute quarters that were trialed by United World Sports in the US. The first half held up fine but as fatigue kicked in even with the unlimited interchange things got a lot more sloppy and the scores ramped up.

Sort of why I suggested that if you were to trial it then 7 minute quarters could be used. So instead of the 48 minutes of play in the UWS format it would only run for 28 mins. With 2-3 minute quarter time breaks and a 5-6 minute half time a game could be run in a 40 minute timeframe. With both a men's and women's squad with each franchise you could fit two games comfortably with all the sideshow in a two hour broadcast.

With 14 man game day rosters you could cycle players to ensure that the quality remains high as ideally no one would play more than 14 minutes. Squad management would also be important.

If you had 8 franchises you could run a home and away set up. Games on Friday nights, doubleheader on Saturday and another on Sunday. Have a straight four team finals series for no more than nine weeks.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

Extended format would work if you don't go for anything but the finals guidelines, i.e. 10 minutes a half. Taking an 8 team, 9 round competion across 4 weekends, for the sake of argument, using the NRC,

Week 1:

Gameday 1: Thursday, Round 1 in Sydney
Gameday 2: Sunday, Round 2 in Newcastle/Country NSW

Week 2:
Gameday 3: Wednesday, Round 3 in Brisbane
Gameday 4: Saturday, Round 4 in Country Queensland/Gold Coast

Week 3:
Gameday 5: Tuesday, Round 5 in Perth
Gameday 6: Friday, Round 6 in Adelaide

Week 4
Gameday 7: Monday, Round 7 in Canberra
Gameday 8: Thursday Semi-finals in Melbourne
Gameday 9: Sunday, Finals in Sydney

Or something.

Something like that would work. Except to ensure you keep within a 3 hour window and involve the women's side of it you would have to reduce the number of teams to 6 each. Which isn't a bad idea. Could structure the teams one of two ones. Use the Super Rugby franchises. Add in either a Western Sydney or Adelaide squad for the 6 franchise or go with city names.

I wouldn't worry about a finals series. Just have each franchise host a game day. Similar to the WS were consistency across all the tournaments determines the winners.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

We also have to face the pretty obvious fact that if you are not pretty pacy, forget it.


Let's say it is a game for the fastest twenty percent? Or thirty?



That leaves out a lot of us.

At the elite level. Yeah, sure. But the beauty of Sevens is that it can be played by practically everyone. You just need to tailor the competition format to fit. You could run several 'divisons' to suit all shapes and sizes. You could for example have three divisions. Lightweight, Opens and Heavyweights. That way a whole range of people can be involved.

Structure it similar to how Reg posted. Set it up so that each team plays two games each competition day. I think running a longer season might be required. Say 10 weeks plus finals or something like that.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

Read the articles on here about capitalizing on women's sevens success and where to from here for men's 7's

Like when we won rwc in 99 or got to final last year in rwc 15 we need to make sure we capitalize on that success Asap from a marketing perspective as that is when got best short term opportunity window to do something whilst rugby in the spotlight.

Hence what I would like to see is a more equally reactive marketing strategy taken every time there is a success like this to create Marketing plans immediately after these successes to maximize opportunities to leverage maximum gains from this success. This would include if oz side wins super rugby comp or whatever but that this is driven centrally and co-ordinated with relevant franchises as applicable and other stakeholders). In other words every time we have such succes this immediately triggers at aru hq a specific marketing plan (aligned to broader strategy and marketing plans already in place) built around leveraging and maximizing the upside from that success from a marketing and profile perspective. And that responsibility for ensuring it happens driven centrally - does not mean aru would do most of the work as depends on what level success at where may be able to leverage other resource but ensure co-ordinated to ensure benefits flow across at all levels.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

Yes working class rugger the Shute shield on 7two been an interesting and innovative model. I normally don't watch a lot of Shute shield as with young family super rugby,Nrc,sevens and test rugby means my schedule pretty full but heard some radio adverts for Shute shield on 7two for finals so yep tuned in. Amazing what a little marketing will do but yes we need to find other ways to bring in money to the game to fund this as we have seen with the private venture who pulled together the plan to put the Shute shield on 7two. A good start to have some product on free to air but lot more to do here and yes these new products create more opportunities - maybe get those who have done Shute shield on seven two first dibs on national 7's product on free to air with promise of aru help to get sponsorship etc

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

Yes working class rugger the Shute shield on 7two been an interesting and innovative model. I normally don't watch a lot of Shute shield as with young family super rugby,Nrc,sevens and test rugby means my schedule pretty full but heard some radio adverts for Shute shield on 7two for finals so yep tuned in. Amazing what a little marketing will do but yes we need to find other ways to bring in money to the game to fund this as we have seen with the private venture who pulled together the plan to put the Shute shield on 7two. A good start to have some product on free to air but lot more to do here and yes these new products create more opportunities - maybe get those who have done Shute shield on seven two first dibs on national 7's product on free to air with promise of aru help to get sponsorship etc

Personally, I think Clubs have far too narrow an appeal for them to form a sustainable competition. That and you want to present an elite product. That means a less is more approach. Each and every club would want to be involved and you run the risk of diluting the quality by talent being spread too thin. At very least in the initial stages of its existence.

But they model they use is one that should be investigated. Another key will be pushing for a more beneficial timeslot to capture as much interest as possible.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

As to what product open to debate but the model yes is what I agree is worthy of more investigation. I was not suggesting clubs be behind the product as more the franchise model like nrc more viable. I am not that up with the entity behind Shute shield on seven two but if clubs have a stake in that than yes not right vehicle but rather model only

 

[half]

My two cents worth would be to open a Australia wide competition including Super Rugby and SS teams. Say 100 entries across teh country.

Broken down into regions and have either a knock out comp or some kind of competition to choose say the Sydney, the Newcastle region etc and then break it down to state champions and then play each state off against each other in either a knock out or competition format.

Most important the regional winners should be decided roughly two to three weeks out from player registration. with the finals etc around player registration.

Maybe challenge any league side to a big day out . Always for both boys and girls.

 

[Strewthcobber]

Speaking of league players, whatever happened to that Australian Schools Sevens championship that Keebra Park kept on winning?

Is it still going?

 

[p.Tah]

It appears so
http://www.redsrugby.com.au/GrassrootsRugby/Schools/AllSchoolsSevens.aspx

 

[half]

“She who must be obeyed” works as a teacher at a selective school in Parramatta.

She and another teacher in a class caught some kids watching something on their phone today while they were supposed to be doing some class work. The investigated and I have put the link below of what they were watching.

It was 3:18 minutes of highlights from a SFC V WSW game at the Alliance Stadium.

The link was taken from a phone and obviously had European voice doing the talking.

What “””stunned me””” was what appeared to be Union fans at the game, at 0.48 seconds in the centre right, the same group at 1.12 to about 1.16 [bottom right] at 2.57 and from about 3.06 to 3.12.

Apparently tickets for the same match this year went on sale today or yesterday from what the kids said and the match is at Homebush.

We are still almost 8 weeks away from this match, and social media vids, not the clever Fox vids the phone vids from the street are being shown on the street.

I then checked if FFA have anything on it and they have an article and in the middle a 30 second vid, and the vid is all about emotion.

Both are excellent IMO and we can learn and should copy, as I am sure its this kinda stuff that in part drives kids in particular to soccer.

The phone vid and look for the union fans I am sure are there. A Must watch IMO and also copy.

FFA promotional story what the 30 second vid. No big tackles it shows emotion very clever again copy.


http://www.a-league.com.au/article/...w-bucket-list-event/xqv4r2rlvdfp1v1fudkgo5hf1

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

“She who must be obeyed” works as a teacher at a selective school in Parramatta.

She and another teacher in a class caught some kids watching something on their phone today while they were supposed to be doing some class work. The investigated and I have put the link below of what they were watching.

It was 3:18 minutes of highlights from a SFC V WSW game at the Alliance Stadium.

The link was taken from a phone and obviously had European voice doing the talking.

What “””stunned me””” was what appeared to be Union fans at the game, at 0.48 seconds in the centre right, the same group at 1.12 to about 1.16 [bottom right] at 2.57 and from about 3.06 to 3.12.

Apparently tickets for the same match this year went on sale today or yesterday from what the kids said and the match is at Homebush.

We are still almost 8 weeks away from this match, and social media vids, not the clever Fox vids the phone vids from the street are being shown on the street.

I then checked if FFA have anything on it and they have an article and in the middle a 30 second vid, and the vid is all about emotion.

Both are excellent IMO and we can learn and should copy, as I am sure its this kinda stuff that in part drives kids in particular to soccer.

The phone vid and look for the union fans I am sure are there. A Must watch IMO and also copy.

FFA promotional story what the 30 second vid. No big tackles it shows emotion very clever again copy.


http://www.a-league.com.au/article/...w-bucket-list-event/xqv4r2rlvdfp1v1fudkgo5hf1

So, James Ruse?

 

[half]

^^^^^

No Parramatta High

 

[reddog64]

Here is the problem with Australian Rugby....

YOU!

You the Australian Rugby Fan. You are the problem.Not the ARU, Not Pulver, Not the States, Not the players. You.

Why? Because you consistently put up with the completely rotten culture of Australian Rugby, from top to bottom. You keep supporting it. You keep buying tickets, turning up, accepting it.
As an Australian I deplore it. I have zero pride when the Wallabies run out and play a test. Why? Because I know they are the face of a completely and utterly rotten culture and system. Don't like what I'm saying? Let's play a game.

Monday Aug 22nd, 2016 9am I'm the new CEO of the ARU and here's what I do.

1. I donate 100% of my ARU income to struggling grass roots Rugby clubs around Australian states (all of them)
2. I sack, on the spot, 70% of any underperforming ARU office and coaching staff. They walk. There is one person to run the ARU office plus the key manual workers required. There is one coach (MC for the moment) and a few training/support staff (runners). The rest go including M. Byrne.The FAT is removed in 1 hour. I cop on the chin any future fines/penalties.
3. I cancel any commercial sponsorship contracts with Qantas, BMW and others with the Wallabies brand and remove all naming/advertising rights from Monday onwards. I cop any fines/penalties on the chin.
4. I cancel all current Wallaby ARU contracts from Monday 10am onwards.
5. I announce any Australian Rugby player who is lucky enough to be selected to represent Australia, via the Wallabies, gets paid $30K a win and $1 a loss. There are no contracts with them. They play, they win, they get paid $30K. They lose they get $1
6. I instruct Cheika to sack 3/4's of the team that played last Saturday against NZ and to replace them with Australian Rugby players, under 24 years of age, who have never played for Australia at Wallaby level. I instruct him to select from all states and must have a minimum of 3 bolters from the bush. I instruct him not to select anyone from the past. I instruct him to make 100% sure of one thing for the coming test in NZ...make sure every single player selected to represent Australia..leaves it all on the park next Saturday and not to die wondering. If they do that, and it's obvious then MC gets another week as do the players.
7. I see out the RC series with this team of players and I stick with them.
8. Post RC I announce an Australian Rugby Future meeting and invite Mark Ella, Bob Dwyer, Rod McQueen, Wayne Bennett and Mal Meninga and Wally Lewis (yes you read that correctly). At the meeting we decide on the future of Australian Rugby and it's this:

- We cancel all Australian wide private school Rugby competitions (GPS, CAS, IAS etc...) and have 1 Australian wide schools competition, open to all schools, with state based play offs that lead into a national schools carnival week for the top 8 sides to play off till a winner is found. We arrange this schools carnival week to be televised on FTA each year, including the state finals proceeding them. We cancel all state school teams including the Australian Schoolboys.

- We cancel all state based Rugby organisations like NSW/QLD/ACT etc...and have one...the ARU which is fully authoritative across all states.

- From 2017 onwards we drop out of the Super Rugby competition. We cancel the Shute shield and whatever the club competition is in Qld, ACT, VIC and WA.

- We meet with the heads of the NRL/ARL ask work out a long term plan to partner with key domestic Rugby clubs with their clubs to share skills, systems, resources, facilities, coaches and most importantly up and coming players. Similar to the model that exists with some clubs in the UK. The main purpose of this is to learn from them and secure access to many young players who end up playing league. The agreement must be a win-win and I would do anything, and I mean anything, to make it happen. Tradition, history etc...out the window. New dawn, new way, new partnerships, new life.

- We copy whatever has been put in place with the Qld Origin side and apply it to the Wallabies.

- Inside 3 years we will have 10 very good players vying for each Wallaby position and the benefit of a partnership with the NRL and all the skills, resources, systems and coaching they could bring.

Now, at this point I know most of you reading this are having your 2nd or 3rd heart attack. Here's the thing....nothing changes unless YOU change it. Have the guts to make the change and see what happens. Can it be any worse than what you currently have?

PS: I'm a Queensland League man but a proud Australian and it hurts me to see the drivel served up by the Wallabies and the ARU organisation. It's un-Australian and no longer acceptable. On top of that I'm sick of reading your moaning and crap ever week about the state of Rugby in Australia.

I've given you the plan and as luck has it...I'm looking for a new job.
I'm available to start tomorrow at 9am.

Time for big moves, dangerous moves, exciting moves, scary moves.

The problem is YOU Mr/Mrs Australian Rugby fan. You accept this tripe served up and then complain about it and do nothing. Now is your chance to take ownership and do something about it. Get off your couch and do something about it.
At 9am tomorrow morning stick your head out the nearest window and say really really loudly
"I'm as mad as hell and I'm not going to take it anymore"

First you got to get MAD!!!!

Reddog (Crazy and ready to unleash it)

 

[Quick Hands]

People need to brace themselves for an uncomfortable reality.

We are unlikely to beat the All Blacks on a regular basis for the foreseeable future. Our player base is too narrow and our development programmes are inadequate for the players that we do have.

The ANC's enforcement of racial quotas is the only thing likely to keep us remotely competitive with South Africa.

England have a huge and expanding player base and the cashed-up RFU is spending millions on grass roots development as well as elite programmes.

We are going to occupy a place in the rugby universe at about the same level as Scotland and Argentina in the next few years.

There is at least a 10 year time lag between anything that the ARU can do about it and on-field results.