Bledisloe 2 - Wallabies vs All Blacks, Wellington, 27 August 2016

[The torpedo]

Then you're sadder than I thought.

It was meant for a bit of a laugh.

 

[Brumby Runner]

Still a couple of areas I think need some work in terms of selections. Whole lot of work required on tactics, game plan and skills. But one thing at a time.

I subscribe to the view now that the Pooper is having little good effect on the game. I think we need a No 8 who plays closer to the ruck that MH does. In the absence of someone better I'd play Timani at 8 and Pocock at 7. Has a much stronger look to it than Hooper/Pocock.

It is time to see if we can do better at No 10 that we've been all year. Is Foley's poor recent form related to him playing in Japan during the off season? Quade won't win the game, but should do better than Foley has so far this year.

I still believe Kerevi/Kuridrani is potentially our most potent centre pairing. TK certainly hasn't played as poorly as many here claim - his stats are way better than most for Bledisloe 1. Maybe his diminishing attacking prowess has something to do with who's been playing inside at 10 and 12.

This side has some improvements over the last side, but I beleiev they will still struggle to be competitive. The ABs can be expected to improve significantly on last week as well as they get the cobwebs out of their game.

 

[hammertimethere]

I reckon the Kerevi selection is probably as much about emotion and attitude as it is form and ability. Yes it's true he's had a pretty great season, but more so I think Cheik is looking for him to bring out his natural love and joy and passion and fearless attitude. All year Kerevi has been a positive influence at the Reds, always smiling, different little secret handshakes with everyone after scoring. He's got no mental scars. We can't guarantee much this weekend (aside from a loss) but I'm very sure that Samu will love every fuckin second he's out there and play like it. With no Beale around who was like that for a long time, couple of losses in a row etc. I think it's just a great selection

 

[vidiot]

I'm not sure a faded and ripped Brisbane Broncos jersey will ever go out of fashion in Queensland.

Who needs invisible socks when you're wearing thongs?

I will have to show that ad to my 9 yr old, he dresses this way already and it may increase his interest in the wallabies.

Unfortunately he is a fairweather fan and I'm up against it when shouting obscenities at performances like last week.

 

[Lee Enfield]

Agreed. I hope to see that sometime this year. But surely if you made that decision you'd take the opportunity to pick a player at 15 who could kick. Like DHP, AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper), or hodge.
Foley doesn't have to be in the side if he's not picked at 10.

I only worked on players Cheika picked in the starting side....agreed with actually having someone other than Foley at 15.

 

[Slim 293]

I can't help but be a little pessimistic about this team - deckchairs, titanic and all that..............

Individually, Kerevi could provide a bit more attacking spark than Kuridrani, but he's part of a brand new 10-12-13 combination (obviously injuries have forced Cheika's hand at 12) that collectively could be a disaster............ together with DHP on the wing we could be exposed defensively.

Simmons and McCalman had to go, but I'm skeptical that the lineout will improve, particularly if it's now being run by Coleman.........

I at least hope that Fardy is given that role as he at least had some success with it in Super Rugby..........

Here's hoping for a miracle.

 

[Slim 293]

Arnold isn't injured he's been named for the Vikings

Sent from my FP2 using Tapatalk

It is his first game back from injury though.........

Still, hopefully he'll be returned to the squad soon as Douglas' form is not quite there yet (not surprising though after such a long time off) and it would be nice to have options (I would prefer him off the bench over Skelton).

 

[tragic]

Getting a bit sad if you have to bag the guy for wearing the team sponsor's gear.

I reckon they'd be bagging each other a whole lot more.

 

[Sully]

I can't help but be a little pessimistic about this team - deckchairs, titanic and all that......

Individually, Kerevi could provide a bit more attacking spark than Kuridrani, but he's part of a brand new 10-12-13 combination (obviously injuries have forced Cheika's hand at 12) that collectively could be a disaster.... together with DHP on the wing we could be exposed defensively.

Simmons and McCalman had to go, but I'm skeptical that the lineout will improve, particularly if it's now being run by Coleman...

I at least hope that Fardy is given that role as he at least had some success with it in Super Rugby....

Here's hoping for a miracle.

I agree. Cooper and to a lesser extent Kerevi are on a hiding to nothing. While Foley picked out of position has a built in out. ie: but he's out of position and has never played there.

 

[vidiot]

I like that we will get to see

10. Cooper
12. Foley

If they can keep it together defensively it could be pretty handy.

 

[Lorenzo]

If we focus on field position (cooper doing the kicking) and defend out of our skins, we might make a game of it. If they faf around in their own half, and we probably ought not rule that out, it's going to be a very long afternoon.

Personally I think this 10-12 arrangement is going to be a disaster, but I hope otherwise.

 

[Froggy]

I',\m not convinced Foley is the defensive disaster many here seem to think. He's not an in-you-face knock-em-down type defender, but is pretty solid these days, certainly a lot better than we he first came to Super rugby.

I don't mind the team, not the one I would have selected (Slipper for Sio, TPN for Moore, Timani for Skelton) but not bad, considering who was available. I may have swapped Hodge & Foley, but that would have left an extremely inexperienced centre combination, and Hodge will get his chance.

I tend to agree with Seb V, 12 is probably a more natural position for Foley, given his running game. He only beame a 10 at Super rugby, I think his first start for the Tahs was at 13, then he spent a season at 15

 

[Micheal]

I',\m not convinced Foley is the defensive disaster many here seem to think. He's not an in-you-face knock-em-down type defender, but is pretty solid these days, certainly a lot better than we he first came to Super rugby.

It literally blows me away.

I don't understand the basis of it at all. Especially when you see comments in these threads and the front page saying something like "Put Quade at 10, atleast you won't have to hide your flyhalf in defence".

Unless I'm watching different games to you lot, Foley is quite a competent defender for a flyhalf. Like his offensive support game, hes often the one chasing a linebreak in defence and makes many critical, try-saving tackles. When facing an attacker front on, hes not as strong, but hes not bad by any means. He gets low with textbook technique and often pulls the tackle off.

Thats a lot more than you can say about Quade "Around the shoulders, one yellow card please, Ref" Cooper, although his physicality has certainly improved over the years as well.

I read a few other international forums as well, and they read Foley in a far different light to many of his antagonisers here, and many of them rate him a lot higher than we do from his international performances, which I find pretty interesting (some female posters also wont shut up about how attractive he is??? To me, that just further proves that women will never be understood).

The team looks good to me, the forward pack is one of the most physical we've offered in a long time without compromising workrate. We really, really need the lineout to fire though. We can't keep on forfeiting set piece ball against a team as dangerous as the All Blacks. I think with Fardy, Coleman and Douglas as our main jumpers and Hooper as an auxiliary we should be fine. It helps if I tell myself that anyway.

The backline likewise has a good mixture of attacking threats and defensive capability, with competent kickers across Foley, Quade, Two-Dads and Two-Dads 2.0. I also love the Quade / Foley combo, although I'll get to that later.

In terms of the bench, I wouldn't have had Skelton, Mumm or Kuridrani riding the pine. Kuridrani is too one dimensional and before any mentions it: I've seen the stats. Tom Carter was (perversely) often statistically the best centre in Australia at the height of his career, but we all know numbers can't tell the whole story. I want workrate and I want impact: one of the two won't cut it.

My complaint re: Mumm is that he is a powderpuff lock - he doesn't offer the physicality I want from my forwards. Skelton on the other hand offers the physicality I love, but he doesnt have the workrate required for an international lock. On the bench together, they could be the ying to the others yang. Who knows? We'll find out on Saturday.

Re: Quade at 10 and Foley at 12, I like it and I've suggested it for a while due to the success that the Foley / Beale combination had at the Waratahs and in the Wallabies during the RWC.

Both have good distributing games and can find a gap when they need to: whether its for themselves or for others. I'm also a huge fan of the dual playmaker set-up. I've had a good laugh at people suggesting that "no other country in the world uses it" throughout this thread. England just gave us a jolly good spanking by resolving their "Ford or Farrell at 10" dilemma by whacking them both on the field at the same time.

Why? Because flyhalf is a position endowed with huge amounts of pressure. Pressure can make diamonds, but it more often makes dust. Knowing that the other can slide into first receiver, both Quade and Foley will be able to play a man wider on the weekend, injecting themselves into the attacking line where they see opportunities. This is very different to trying to inject an opportunity into the attacking line.

For that very reason I think Quade, if he ends up at the Reds next year, will play best with a Paia'aua / Kerevi 12-13 combo. Too often he tries to change a game with every play. When the pressures off, he relaxes and he plays his natural game as he shows us the world class attacking genius he can be.

When I posted that on the Reds 2017 thread, many agreed with the logic but somehow the merits of the dual playmaker set up got lost in this thread. Rage often inhibits a person's clarity of thought and we Wallaby fans certainly have a lot to be miffed about.

However, I, for one, am quite optimistic about the future.

 

[Micheal]

Who had the bright idea to bring QC (Quade Cooper) back in NZ when he's had little rugby and they loathe him over there: setting him up for a fall, IMO.
Should be Ok though because its not like we weakened two positions to cover 1 or anything.
We've got a noted non-tackler in 12, a 10 who tries but who for most of his career has been shunted to right wing in defence, a 12 playing 13, an arguable 13 at 15, an arguable 15 at 11.
When Marto suggested we should play McMahon at 12 i thought he thought that was a joke but that will be next on this bizarre ride we've signed up for now.
We re no longer the wallabies we are the headless chooks.

IS is everything ok?

I don't think I've seen you post anything with a positive tone, or remnance of a positive message in it, since I joined this forum 4ish years ago.

You're going to give yourself an aneurysm.

You remind me of the bloke that sits to my right when I go to watch the Tahs play.

And my left.

And behind me.

And in front of me (and so on).

I even encountered a whole herd of these types when I saw the Wallabies play on the weekend. Imagine that! A whole stand full of people who paid good money to see the national team play when, as far as the rational eye could see, they fucking hate the sport.

I don't understand half the rugby fans in this country (says a Rugby fan complaining about other Rugby fans perpetually complaining).

I think we all need to step away and have a deep breath. The game isn't in the best place its ever been, the national team isnt in the best place its ever been, but vast improvements have been made since Pulver seized the helm and Cheika, whilst in a bit of a rut at the moment, has lead the team to some of the most inspiring footy I've seen played by a Wallabies side in 15ish years.

I think in the process of making observations and comments on the higher-ups in the code, we often forget that it is us, not the Wallabies, that are rugby union in this country. Times are certainly tough, but a collective bad attitude by the fans in this country won't help.

 

[Marcelo]

Foley at 12???? ABs by 100

Ay ay Cheika loves Foley, Moore, Mumm and Kuridrani. He can't drop them despite are the worst players ATM

 

[Chunderstruck]

Throwing QC (Quade Cooper) back in makes be very nervous. We've seen it before, the merry-go-round is spinning too fast and I want to get off.

I predict QC (Quade Cooper) will put in his usual mixed bag, with enough mistakes for the haters to jump on but a few good flashes for the fanbois to claim "he's awesome but Phipps can't pass" or whatever. We're going to lose, changing the 10 will just add more fuel to this shitty debate. I wish QC (Quade Cooper) and Foley would both retire.

In reality, Quade isn't going to have a massive influence. He's a solid player, just a different style to Foley. Even if you believe the hype about his ability to throw no-look quadruple cutout dummies to himself while moonwalking through half-gaps, that kind of shit doesn't win test matches against the Blicks. It's the other 101 areas we absolutely sucked at that makes the difference, the most important of which start in the forward pack.

 

[bigmac]

It literally blows me away.

I don't understand the basis of it at all. Especially when you see comments in these threads and the front page saying something like "Put Quade at 10, atleast you won't have to hide your flyhalf in defence".

Unless I'm watching different games to you lot, Foley is quite a competent defender for a flyhalf. Like his offensive support game, hes often the one chasing a linebreak in defence and makes many critical, try-saving tackles. When facing an attacker front on, hes not as strong, but hes not bad by any means. He gets low with textbook technique and often pulls the tackle off.

Thats a lot more than you can say about Quade "Around the shoulders, one yellow card please, Ref" Cooper, although his physicality has certainly improved over the years as well.

I read a few other international forums as well, and they read Foley in a far different light to many of his antagonisers here, and many of them rate him a lot higher than we do from his international performances, which I find pretty interesting (some female posters also wont shut up about how attractive he is??? To me, that just further proves that women will never be understood).

The team looks good to me, the forward pack is one of the most physical we've offered in a long time without compromising workrate. We really, really need the lineout to fire though. We can't keep on forfeiting set piece ball against a team as dangerous as the All Blacks. I think with Fardy, Coleman and Douglas as our main jumpers and Hooper as an auxiliary we should be fine. It helps if I tell myself that anyway.

The backline likewise has a good mixture of attacking threats and defensive capability, with competent kickers across Foley, Quade, Two-Dads and Two-Dads 2.0. I also love the Quade / Foley combo, although I'll get to that later.

In terms of the bench, I wouldn't have had Skelton, Mumm or Kuridrani riding the pine. Kuridrani is too one dimensional and before any mentions it: I've seen the stats. Tom Carter was (perversely) often statistically the best centre in Australia at the height of his career, but we all know numbers can't tell the whole story. I want workrate and I want impact: one of the two won't cut it.

My complaint re: Mumm is that he is a powderpuff lock - he doesn't offer the physicality I want from my forwards. Skelton on the other hand offers the physicality I love, but he doesnt have the workrate required for an international lock. On the bench together, they could be the ying to the others yang. Who knows? We'll find out on Saturday.

Re: Quade at 10 and Foley at 12, I like it and I've suggested it for a while due to the success that the Foley / Beale combination had at the Waratahs and in the Wallabies during the RWC.

Both have good distributing games and can find a gap when they need to: whether its for themselves or for others. I'm also a huge fan of the dual playmaker set-up. I've had a good laugh at people suggesting that "no other country in the world uses it" throughout this thread. England just gave us a jolly good spanking by resolving their "Ford or Farrell at 10" dilemma by whacking them both on the field at the same time.

Why? Because flyhalf is a position endowed with huge amounts of pressure. Pressure can make diamonds, but it more often makes dust. Knowing that the other can slide into first receiver, both Quade and Foley will be able to play a man wider on the weekend, injecting themselves into the attacking line where they see opportunities. This is very different to trying to inject an opportunity into the attacking line.

For that very reason I think Quade, if he ends up at the Reds next year, will play best with a Paia'aua / Kerevi 12-13 combo. Too often he tries to change a game with every play. When the pressures off, he relaxes and he plays his natural game as he shows us the world class attacking genius he can be.

When I posted that on the Reds 2017 thread, many agreed with the logic but somehow the merits of the dual playmaker set up got lost in this thread. Rage often inhibits a person's clarity of thought and we Wallaby fans certainly have a lot to be miffed about.

However, I, for one, am quite optimistic about the future.

Good post. Realistic and maybe even a bit optimistic. Doesnt take the easy way out and slag off QC (Quade Cooper).

 

[TOCC]

I'm honestly baffled by this weeks team..
The changes is the backline gloss over the lack of change in the forward pack, there are fundamental issues with Cheikas selection in the forward pack which he continues to ignore.

Also Folau at fullback needs to change, whilst Folau is a better player then DHP, I firmly believe that DHP as a package is a better fullback then Folau

 

[Quick Hands]

I don't really think that the selections will greatly change things either way. The best thing that's happened for the Wallabies is that it's rained for the past 3 days in Wellington, with more rain forecast for tomorrow. Might slow the ABs down a bit.

 

[KAOPointman]

Throwing QC (Quade Cooper) back in makes be very nervous. We've seen it before, the merry-go-round is spinning too fast and I want to get off.

I predict QC (Quade Cooper) will put in his usual mixed bag, with enough mistakes for the haters to jump on but a few good flashes for the fanbois to claim "he's awesome but Phipps can't pass" or whatever. We're going to lose, changing the 10 will just add more fuel to this shitty debate. I wish QC (Quade Cooper) and Foley would both retire.

In reality, Quade isn't going to have a massive influence. He's a solid player, just a different style to Foley. Even if you believe the hype about his ability to throw no-look quadruple cutout dummies to himself while moonwalking through half-gaps, that kind of shit doesn't win test matches against the Blicks. It's the other 101 areas we absolutely sucked at that makes the difference, the most important of which start in the forward pack.

Quade may make some mistakes on sat......but it'd be impossible to make more then Foley did last week. Not to mention how dull,slow and unimaganitive he often is.....and has been for ages for the wallabies. Foley even was poor for the Tahs all year. Oh and his kicking sucks.
What your foretelling could be applied to ANYONE in a loosing international! The haters just hate on Quade more because they're scared of what he can do!

I don't care about being nervous that Quades there.......at least he'll create opportunities if his team mates are up for it! Foley won't. He's been proving that.
Like it or not.....cheika moving him to 12 and Quade to 10 shows how much he rates foley at 10. Otherwise Quade would just be another 12 option.......not doing what ANYONE expected and moving foley to 12. 10 is the key position. Foley is lucky he's in the squad for mine! Veeeery lucky. Our next biggest issues will be the reff at scrumtime and our lineout accuracy! Aggression and tackles I'd imagine will be there in spades after last week.