Ballymore Redevelopment

[Wilson]

With the rise in Women's sports Brisbane is probably going to need 2 15-20k seaters in the next decade or two, but the answer there is Ballymore first and then look to the second one as the demand builds.

There are also upgrades happening to the public transport network around the olympics and cross river rail that should improve access to Ballymore.

 

[Strewthcobber]

I reckon a CBA comparing the two would be a lot more favourable to Perry Park, with the uplift possible in Bowen Hills that is just not there around Ballymore.

You could imagine a bunch of new pubs/restaurants/ entertainment options springing up around that precinct.

I agree that neither are particularly likely though.

And the tax payer should own either option if government provides the funding.

 

[JRugby2]

Eh - from what I've seen it wont really improve it all that much. Exhibition will become a full time station but its still a 2.4km walk to Ballymore through small suburban streets. Wilston station is closer but it would require a significant upgrade to facilitate moving 15-20k people.

I also haven't seen any word re: improving bus access to Ballymore.

 

[LeCheese]

...but the answer there is Ballymore first and then look to the second one as the demand builds.

Especially no need for a second one just down the road. The money would be better spent on a stadium (and supporting infrastructure) in a growth area such as between Logan and Coomera or out towards Ipswich, imo

 

[JRugby2]

Capacity is an interesting one. Perry Park is saying the stadium would hold between 15-20k. My understanding of a proposed Ballymore redev of the eastern stand is that it would effectively mirror the new Mclean stand (maybe being slightly larger).

That would realistically only add an additional ~4000 seated pax to the current 3000 of the mclean stand + the hill (guessing 1000pax there) so we're looking at a total stadium pax of just under 10K (generously). The cost argument is interesting but we're not really comparing apples and apples here with size and potential. Hard to see how a professional team could play out of a stadium with less than 15k capacity - even if they don't draw those numbers now - it would significantly limit their growth.

 

[Adam84]

The days of a 20k at Ballymore are done.

QRU recently said that Ballymore's future is a 10-12k stadium, and that will be done with a new bus interchange at Ballymore. Anything above that puts too much stress on the surrounding area in terms of transport and access.

 

[JRugby2]

Which is where I think Perry Park has a better argument. Costs aside - it could facilitate a larger capacity with its existing transport infrastructure (other than the question of how do you funnel 15-20k people across Abbotsford road safely, efficiently).

Any Transport Engineers in the chat?

 

[LeCheese]

A pedestrian bridge (or two) a la Suncorp to Milton station is the obvious answer - anything's possible really, it's just a question of cash

 

[Wilson]

Part of the benefit of Exhibition is the precinct panned around it - it's near enough to support entertainment pre and post game with improved bus links to support stadium access. Exhibition also opens up easier access from more of Brisbane.

I believe there are also general plans around improving pedestrian access from both Exhibition and Wilston stations but nothing concrete yet, it's all a bit dependent on Olympic planning.

 

[JRugby2]

2.5ks is still a decent hike to Exhibition and Wilston station is tiny and being an 'island station' would could be very risky for large crowds. Re buses, the streets around Ballymore can't really get wider for buses. Would need a creative solution for sure.

 

[SouthernX]

i don’t buy the argument ballymore isnt accessible.

they spent 100s of millions of dollars on that busway out to Chermside and there’s a huge interchange station at the hospital at the end of butterfield street.

granted Perry park has a train station just across the road and is superior choice for connectivity.

 

[Strewthcobber]

...how do you funnel 15-20k people across Abbotsford road safely, efficiently).

You close it to through traffic during events

 

[Ignoto]

From what I've seen, there's only one or two lines that would go through to Exhibition state, whereas Bowen Hills has all bar the two North-South lines.

I would leave Ballymoore as the development centre which can host smaller overflow matches and try and get Perry Park operational.

 

[JRugby2]

You close it to through traffic during events

You wouldn't - it's a major thoroughfare. Be like closing Milton Road for games at suncorp

 

[JRugby2]

i don’t buy the argument ballymore isnt accessible.

It's objectively less accessible than perry park, and by a significant margin. Even the bus station is 1.8km from ballymore - it's a long walk through quiet suburban streets for 15k people every match day.

 

[SouthernX]

Yes I am in agreeance with you about Perry park.

But if there’s an event on at ballymore. That busway provides traffic less option to filter fans to venue from a centrally local area like cbd - along bus way and then down to ballymore via butterfield

the comment about Herston being inaccessible is more of a super 10s hottake when reds played at ballymore and there was no busway infrastructure built yet

 

[Wilson]

2.5ks is still a decent hike to Exhibition and Wilston station is tiny and being an 'island station' would could be very risky for large crowds. Re buses, the streets around ballymore can't really get wider for buses. Would need a creative solution for sure

It's closer to 2km though, about the same distance as Wilston is currently and the goal of pedestrian improvements is to bring that down or improve the quality of it. It's also a very good spot for a high frequency bus link on event days. There are long term arguments about Wilston station needing upgrades as part of an push for increased density in the suburb, particularly along Newmarket Rd, but that's a much larger and longer term conversation then what happens for Ballymore.

I'm not saying the access will be as good as Perry Park, but it doesn't need to be. It just has to be reasonably accessible and that is still very achievable.

 

[Ignoto]

Couple things to note Wilson.

That 2-2.5km walk after a few beers will have a few bladders needing to be drained. I don't think its fair on the locals to deal with that.

The suburban streets and side walks aren't really built for the foot traffic that would need to walk along it. And the other major roads aren't really built for safely moving the volume of spectators.

But, who knows what will happen after this state election. Perhaps if Miles comes to his senses and follows the Quirk report and builds a entertainment centre at Vic Park, these issues will be sorted.

 

[JRugby2]

the comment about Herston being inaccessible is more of a super 10s hottake when reds played at ballymore and there was no busway infrastructure built yet

It's really not - Butterfield street is narrow, winding and while it was like that in the 90s and 00's nothing has changed. The Busway along the northern corridor did nothing to change this. The busway services the hospital, not Herston.

 

[Adam84]

From what I've seen, there's only one or two lines that would go through to Exhibition state, whereas Bowen Hills has all bar the two North-South lines.

A bit unrelated.. but CRR(Exhibition Station) will feature the Sunshine Coast and Beenleigh/Gold Coast lines, it's going to be a pretty substantial route that represents about 50% of current patronage across the network.

That aside, the fact the Ipswich line or Redcliffe wont use Exhibition station wont be prohibitive, the transport network is slowly shifting towards an emphasis on interchange between services (as it should).