Australian Rugby / RA

[Wallaby Man]

You don't think the Tahs, Reds and Brumbies wouldn't be more competitive with:

Props: Robertson, Gibbon, Fa'amausili, Talakai
Hookers: Faainga'a, Kaitu'u, Mafi, Uelese
Locks: Rodda, Philip, Canham
Backrow: Anstee, Naisarani, Wells, Warren-Vosayaco, Kemeny, Leota, Wilkin,
9s: Sorovi, Fines-Leleiwasa, Robertson
10s: Gordon, Pasitoa, Burey, Kuenzle, Stewart,
Centres: Ili
Wings/FB: Anderson, Kellaway, Hodge,

I understand the revenue issue, but any revised Super Rugby competition must include an increased season length.

But the problem is in 2023 guys have opportunities to be the first choice guy at an overseas club earning more money, than playing back up. Unlike 10-15yrs ago where the next best option couldn’t go anywhere and you have exceptional depth, you aren’t going to get a good player be happy to sit around and play 4-5 games a year because they are back up, on back up money. Especially when they could be earning 3x overseas and playing regularly.

 

[Highlander35]

Regardless, folks are missing the point.

The cuts are sugar rushes. Even if you cut the Rebels and Force tomorrow and retained "everyone" you wanted to, that works for 2 years, maybe 5 at the most, then you end up in a similar position: players who can't semi-regularly get a start will leave. But instead of being players 120-200 in the churn it will be players 80-120. That's your WOBS future, that's your veterans, that's your first drop options.

 

[HooperPocockSmith]

To be clear, when you guys reference a club comp, do you mean existing SS/Hospital Cup/Dewar clubs? Or the creation of new clubs?

 

[Rugrat]

Rugby Australia made this complete disaster and they better be in the office owning it.

If Rugby wasn’t teetering on the edge of irrelevance in Australia it’s certainly sprinting towards it.

I hope this shows everyone there is no justification to keep our current strategies in place and big change is required to move the Wallabies forward.

I think they are all working remotely from the Lyon, branch office.

 

[Wallaby Man]

Why would Talataina stay in Australia if the alternative is a cash-strapped national competition? He may as well download Duo Lingo and start to get a taste for Bordeaux Cab Sauvs.

Of course, we want to keep as many kids from Vic and WA playing rugby. But we need to think about the harsh financial reality of casting the net out far and wide.

I don’t even think it’s the WA and Vic kids, it’s the QLD and NSW ones as well. We saw during Covid when the contractual deals came through several jump ship from the Reds because they weighed it up. Kellaway isn’t going to head back to the Tahs and play back up, and if he’s offered the starting jersey then Pietch, Nawaqanitawase or Donaldson isn’t going to stick around and play back up. You are always going to lose 1 or these 4 and then you end up with the Alex Newsome’s playing back up instead of the intended quality.

 

[Wallaby Man]

Regardless, folks are missing the point.

The cuts are sugar rushes. Even if you cut the Rebels and Force tomorrow and retained "everyone" you wanted to, that works for 2 years, maybe 5 at the most, then you end up in a similar position: players who can't semi-regularly get a start will leave. But instead of being players 120-200 in the churn it will be players 80-120. That's your WOBS future, that's your veterans, that's your first drop options.

It’s the thought process that’s hampered Aus rugby, constantly fighting what what happened in the good old days versus what happens in 2023 in a rugby world with loads of cash and ultra professionalism

 

[The Ghost of Raelene]

I think they are all working remotely from the Lyon, branch office.

Sadly you’re right. They better be on the horn then and arranging some in person interviews.

 

[Wallaby Man]

Nobody has mentioned it yet, but if the Italians beat NZ then Super Rugby is in the shit.

One of the issues (and it’s clearly evident on these threads) one party the pro club has thought the expansionist group has had their way for too long, while the expansionist party has thought the pro club group has played blocker and deliberately sabotaged the game moving forward. We all want the same thing which is the wallabies winning. But both parties think the other is at fault for the demise

 

[PhilClinton]

Rugby Australia made this complete disaster and they better be in the office owning it.

If Rugby wasn’t teetering on the edge of irrelevance in Australia it’s certainly sprinting towards it.

I hope this shows everyone there is no justification to keep our current strategies in place and big change is required to move the Wallabies forward.

Everyone keeps forgetting we now have Phil Waugh running the show.

We'll be fine.

 

[Members Section]

could we possibly look at the nfl model as a point of difference in aus

Friday night high school game
sat club footy with game of the week saturday night (every 2nd game have rivalry game then the other week the best game)
sunday have wall to wall professional game

this way we can support our fav local grass roots club then come sunday doesnt clash with anything

 

[dru]

Nobody has mentioned it yet, but if the Italians beat NZ then Super Rugby is in the shit.

One of the issues (and it’s clearly evident on these threads) one party the pro club has thought the expansionist group has had their way for too long, while the expansionist party has thought the pro club group has played blocker and deliberately sabotaged the game moving forward. We all want the same thing which is the wallabies winning. But both parties think the other is at fault for the demise

OK, so I've got my fingers crossed for the Azzuri. It won't happen though. With any luck Super is dead anyway.

 

[HooperPocockSmith]

Would I be correct in saying that one potential strategy some on this forum would support would be an 8-10 team domestic competition with the Drua in the mix? You'd have 40 or so centrally contracted players directly topped up by RA. The teams would have autonomy in certain areas, but ultimately list management decisions/S&C would have to be managed by RA. Regarding teams, there would be 2 x Sydney, 2 x Brisbane, Melbourne, and Perth as definites. I'm not sure where the balance would come from. Each team would have an academy and geographical areas to manage. RA would work with the clubs to develop the game at the local/school level.

 

[The Ghost of Raelene]

Everyone keeps forgetting we now have Phil Waugh running the show.

We'll be fine.

Guess we have to give him a chance….

He does have an opportunity to do something huge. Never get a chance like now to be drastic as well.

 

[Wallaby Man]

Would I be correct in saying that one potential strategy some on this forum would support would be an 8-10 team domestic competition with the Drua in the mix? You'd have 40 or so centrally contracted players directly topped up by Rugby Australia. The teams would have autonomy in certain areas, but ultimately list management decisions/S&C would have to be managed by Rugby Australia. Regarding teams, there would be 2 x Sydney, 2 x Brisbane, Melbourne, and Perth as definites. I'm not sure where the balance would come from. Each team would have an academy and geographical areas to manage. Rugby Australia would work with the clubs to develop the game at the local/school level.

I’m firmly in the belief of the current 5 teams playing NZ and Drua. But want more rugby beyond this, either a longer Super Rugby season (which won’t happen) or we playing a SRAU at the end of it to get more pro games in to our guys.

I remember a podcast from maybe 2 years ago from the English guy that’s taken over the Drua. He mentioned that rugby in Australia is the only country where the players just don’t play enough rugby and it’s a major concern for our development. Basically said we were professional trainers. He’s formerly a co-owner of Melb Storm, ran Saracens in the UK etc. so knows his stuff

 

[HooperPocockSmith]

I’m firmly in the belief of the current 5 teams playing NZ and Drua. But want more rugby beyond this, either a longer Super Rugby season (which won’t happen) or we playing a SRAU at the end of it to get more pro games in to our guys.

I remember a podcast from maybe 2 years ago from the English guy that’s taken over the Drua. He mentioned that rugby in Australia is the only country where the players just don’t play enough rugby and it’s a major concern for our development. Basically said we were professional trainers. He’s formerly a co-owner of Melb Storm, ran Saracens in the UK etc. so knows his stuff

I mean, in theory, the NRC is/was a great concept. It was the perfect opportunity to supplement the Super Rugby season with some decent-quality rugby.

It comes back to the tyranny of distance. How good would it be to have a competition with Super Rugby and the Japanese Top League sides?

I mean one suggestion would be to run an NRC-style competition alongside the NPC in NZ but at the start of the year (Feb-Jun). Then you could run Super Rugby off the back of it. That way your top-line players would be getting some decent minutes. Whether you would have 5 Aussie sides I'm not sure. The only problem here is you'd nuke club rugby in Brisbane and Sydney.

 

[The Ghost of Raelene]

There an echo on here?

Everyone acknowledges our players don’t play enough. In the most important development years our players can get maybe 10-15 games in them a year. This needs to be 25. We need players getting to around 23-24 years old and have 100 games of at least a 1st grade standard if you are to just keep up with Super Rugby.

 

[Pfitzy]

Guess we have to give him a chance….

He does have an opportunity to do something huge. Never get a chance like now to be drastic as well.

?

 

[The Ghost of Raelene]

At this point why not?

God, I just imagened them paying some consulting firm to come up with a plan and it’ll be called Project Phoenix or some shit.

Speaking of the Simpsons I wonder what Hans Moleman is going to bring to the press this week.

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

Hopefully the board and executive of RA will meet in short order and agree that the present situation cannot continue. The next five years present a massive opportunity for the game here and that the entrenched interests need to be prepared to compromise for the good of all. If they aren't then we might as well fold up the card table go back to being amateur.

I think the recent moves around development pathways is a positive one and moving to a model where club footy, especially at underage level, has a greater role is also needed. The idea of playing schools footy mid-week and club on the weekend is a good one for mine.

The domestic pro comp also needs addressing. I'm not sure SRP (Super Rugby Pacific) can continue as it is, it's clearly not working for us or frankly for the Kiwis. Perhaps going back to the NZ having the NPC (plus Moana), us having our state rep teams plus the Drua or the Drua plus Force, Rebels, Brumbies, Sydney, NSW Country, Brisbane, QLD Country - and then having the top couple of sides in each conference play off in a round robin plus final format.

It all leads to more footy and a clearer pathway from club to elite level. I acknowledge that there are probably holes everywhere with this, but frankly staying with the status quo leaves us worse off.

Myself and probably plenty of other GAGR's have been involved in turning around dysfunctional organisations, so our ideas probably aren't going to suck any more than RA's

 

[Goosestep]

I mean, in theory, the NRC is/was a great concept. It was the perfect opportunity to supplement the Super Rugby season with some decent-quality rugby.

It comes back to the tyranny of distance. How good would it be to have a competition with Super Rugby and the Japanese Top League sides?

I mean one suggestion would be to run an NRC-style competition alongside the NPC in NZ but at the start of the year (Feb-Jun). Then you could run Super Rugby off the back of it. That way your top-line players would be getting some decent minutes. Whether you would have 5 Aussie sides I'm not sure. The only problem here is you'd nuke club rugby in Brisbane and Sydney.

Maybe Brisbane and Sydney clubs could join the npc ? …a reverse wahs