Australian Rugby / RA

[Rugbynutter39]

Dear oh bloody dear. The sooner this charade is over the better. BTW, unless we are going to put all our eggs in Twiggy's basket (which would imply cutting ourselves loose from the rest of the actual rugby world) we are stuck with RA and NZRU. Not to mention World Rugby.

I would love to see a hybrid game developed, by the way. But that is a whole different issue. We are stuck with rugby.

I dream of private equity then these muppets which reflects how angry I am and will be if NZRU agree to this charade...it would outrank their other defining stupid moment when back in 2009 they decided to leave SA in super rugby.

 

[Omar Comin']

They did an exhibition schoolboy game 8 odd years ago.
keebra park (league) played St Augustine’s (rugby)
it was league rules in your own 1/2, rugby in the other 1/2.
pretty sure possession was based on a shot clock, so there was plenty of urgency throughout the match.

By far the best method of playing a hybrid game IMO

Yeah the rugby boys won that one. The same rules were played in a match between Wests Magpies and Randwick a few years ago, which was won by the leaguies who ran away with it in the 2nd half. They benefited from having a few recent NRL players in the team. My feeling is at a professional level that the rules should favour the union team more, but I guess you'd have to trial it to find out.

 

[waiopehu oldboy]

....back in 2009 [NZRU] decided to leave SA in super rugby.

Please elaborate.

 

[Quick Hands]

There's a distinction between the union and the players themselves though.

Justin Harrison is the main architect of all this, and his willingness to destroy the game to get his players ahead is baffling.

In big unions this has some validity, but not really in this case. RUPA would have a couple of hundred members at most and would be in regular contact with their leader/leaders. Harrison may well be the strategic brains behind the strategy, but I think it's fanciful to suggest that he doesn't have majority backing from his members. I note that there has been no statement from any group of dissident players against the RUPA view. Indeed the available evidence suggests that he has majority support.

Whether the strategy is the right one is another question, but I suspect that what we are seeing is this; the players have decided that this isn't going to be a one-off cut to wages but it's highly likely that the wages that they are used to will never return. This means that they are trying to salvage as much as the can before the ship goes belly up. I also suspect that many are positioning themselves to get on an early lifeboat.

 

[pnut]

Think the players point is admin staff should take the same % cut as the players. There happy if all accept 70% not for admin to return to normal with players shouldering all.

Painting them as greedy is a bit harsh.

 

[KOB1987]

In big unions this has some validity, but not really in this case. RUPA would have a couple of hundred members at most and would be in regular contact with their leader/leaders. Harrison may well be the strategic brains behind the strategy, but I think it's fanciful to suggest that he doesn't have majority backing from his members. I note that there has been no statement from any group of dissident players against the RUPA view. Indeed the available evidence suggests that he has majority support.

Whether the strategy is the right one is another question, but I suspect that what we are seeing is this; the players have decided that this isn't going to be a one-off cut to wages but it's highly likely that the wages that they are used to will never return. This means that they are trying to salvage as much as the can before the ship goes belly up. I also suspect that many are positioning themselves to get on an early lifeboat.

I don’t disagree but I’ll say it again - if the players concentrated on doing what they’re paid to do (play) rather than try to salvage a few thousand dollars out of the tail end of a season that was fucked up beyond recognition due to no fault of anyone, and actually create an entertaining product, the broadcasters might actually pay more for said product and consequently secure the players’ incomes for the next year and beyond.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

In big unions this has some validity, but not really in this case. RUPA would have a couple of hundred members at most and would be in regular contact with their leader/leaders. Harrison may well be the strategic brains behind the strategy, but I think it's fanciful to suggest that he doesn't have majority backing from his members. I note that there has been no statement from any group of dissident players against the RUPA view. Indeed the available evidence suggests that he has majority support.

Whether the strategy is the right one is another question, but I suspect that what we are seeing is this; the players have decided that this isn't going to be a one-off cut to wages but it's highly likely that the wages that they are used to will never return. This means that they are trying to salvage as much as the can before the ship goes belly up. I also suspect that many are positioning themselves to get on an early lifeboat.

Astute observation of what is the outcome of gross mismanagement and negligence regarding the management and oversight of rugby in Australia, SANZAAR and its members (read nzru needs to take centre stage here for neglect as no.1 on the field but abject failure to leverage this to use to influence positively to better the game in Asia Pacific means they are a shit and useless bunch of fuckers).

 

[Quick Hands]

I don’t disagree but I’ll say it again - if the players concentrated on doing what they’re paid to do (play) rather than try to salvage a few thousand dollars out of the tail end of a season that was fucked up beyond recognition due to no fault of anyone, and actually create an entertaining product, the broadcasters might actually pay more for said product and consequently secure the players’ incomes for the next year and beyond.

I don't think that the money is there for whatever product emerges, whether that product is Super Rugby involving Sth Africa, TT or purely domestic. I think that the players have worked out that below the Wallabies the next level i.e. Super Rugby will end up being semi-pro. The money just isn't there.

But bigger problems loom for the game, which does not yet have a competition structure for Super Rugby - or whatever takes its place - next year. Without that model, RA cannot sign a broadcast deal, which means it is impossible to make projections about player contracts and Super Rugby funding arrangements for 2021.
Whatever happens, the tight balance sheet of current broadcaster Foxtel means it is highly unlikely the code will be able to maintain its current player contracting and funding levels.

That could leave Johnson, Clarke and the RA board with a stark choice: ask all players to take a cut on the value on their contracts in 2021 or ring-fence a group of 25 to 30 Wallabies and a second group of elite juniors, pay them full freight and allow market forces to dictate what happens to Australia's middle tier.
https://www.smh.com.au/sport/rugby-...super-rugby-opening-week-20200626-p556ki.html

 

[KOB1987]

Another thing - and I say this as a massive Michael Hooper fan - I don't mind if Michael gets released and takes up a huge overseas contract. It frees up a lot of cash and at the end of the day, if required, he can still be picked for the Wallabies. From a NSW/Tahs point of view it would be a huge loss, but we're going through a ground zero rebuild anyway so may as well go the full hog.

 

[Brumby Runner]

Another thing - and I say this as a massive Michael Hooper fan - I don't mind if Michael gets released and takes up a huge overseas contract. It frees up a lot of cash and at the end of the day, if required, he can still be picked for the Wallabies. From a NSW/Tahs point of view it would be a huge loss, but we're going through a ground zero rebuild anyway so may as well go the full hog.

That surprises me KOB, but I can see your point and it's easy to agree.

 

[Quick Hands]

I dream of private equity then these muppets which reflects how angry I am and will be if NZRU agree to this charade.it would outrank their other defining stupid moment when back in 2009 they decided to leave SA in super rugby.

When the dust settles, SANZAR should be the first organisation disbanded. With the impending demise of the pan-continental Super Rugby model it's an even more unnecessary bureaucracy than it ever was.

Any champions league type competition and international fixtures could certainly be arranged without SANZAR/SANZAAR.

 

[Derpus]

Another thing - and I say this as a massive Michael Hooper fan - I don't mind if Michael gets released and takes up a huge overseas contract. It frees up a lot of cash and at the end of the day, if required, he can still be picked for the Wallabies. From a NSW/Tahs point of view it would be a huge loss, but we're going through a ground zero rebuild anyway so may as well go the full hog.

This assumes a lot though. A)that he wants to go and b) thay he has offers on the table. They cant just 'releass' him if he doesnt want out.

 

[Forcefield]

I don’t disagree but I’ll say it again - if the players concentrated on doing what they’re paid to do (play) rather than try to salvage a few thousand dollars out of the tail end of a season that was fucked up beyond recognition due to no fault of anyone, and actually create an entertaining product, the broadcasters might actually pay more for said product and consequently secure the players’ incomes for the next year and beyond.

I tend to agree. If Rugby Australia goes belly up, it will undoubtedly influence New Zealand. The flood of 120+ players on the market is sure to drive down prices that other clubs are willing to pay. I don't envy their position, but I think salvaging a competition in Australia is in almost all players best interests. The exception are those at the end of their careers. On the other hand, players are seeing lost wages- what about potential increased earnings in future years because bodies have had lots of time for recovery this year and that might extend careers.

 

[KOB1987]

This assumes a lot though. A)that he wants to go and b) thay he has offers on the table. They cant just 'releass' him if he doesnt want out.

Of course, and I'm not making any assumptions, it's purely hypothetical. But if events were to dictate that his contract needs to be renegotiated downwards and he gets a better offer O/S, it's not going to be the end of the Rugby world in Australia. Realistically he really only has this RWC cycle left in him and we can still pick him anyway. There's also every chance that he would take the lesser amount anyway, I'm sure he likes the money but he also loves the gold.

 

[Derpus]

Yeah unless it was an extraordinary cut i kind of think he'd be the first to accept it. But could be wrong.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

Another thing - and I say this as a massive Michael Hooper fan - I don't mind if Michael gets released and takes up a huge overseas contract. It frees up a lot of cash and at the end of the day, if required, he can still be picked for the Wallabies. From a NSW/Tahs point of view it would be a huge loss, but we're going through a ground zero rebuild anyway so may as well go the full hog.

Article in the Australian by Wayne Smith about hard choices on which players to retain. Players like Tupou yes you go out to keep but players like hooper maybe not given quality 7s behind him like wright etc as yes hoopers $1m contract a year frees up lot of cash

 

[Derpus]

Accepting the loss of your best and most experienced players in the hope that youngsters will step up quickly is the fast track to dropping even further down the world rankings ladder.

We may have no choice - but if it comes to it we will suffer.

Id much rather keep players like TK, AAA and Hooper over having to rely solely on their younger counterparts in Petaia, Tupou and Wright/McRight.

Plus, it really just means that once they reach the level the olders guys were at - they'll leave as well.

 

[Slim 293]

AAA is only 26 years old, and still the better all round player......... I'd say he's massively underpaid after what Tupou received.

 

[dru]

That's right, everybody wins. Everybody walks away with their previous preferences confirmed. Nobody watches it and suddenly transforms from a league to a union fanatic or vice versa. It's purely an income generating novelty event.

Nobody watches it?

I’d imagine viewing numbers would be higher than any 2020 Bled if it is handled in anyway seriously.

 

[Dismal Pillock]

Another thing - and I say this as a massive Michael Hooper fan - I don't mind if Michael gets released and takes up a huge overseas contract. It frees up a lot of cash and at the end of the day, if required, he can still be picked for the Wallabies. From a NSW/Tahs point of view it would be a huge loss, but we're going through a ground zero rebuild anyway so may as well go the full hog.

The NSFW Tahs without Micheal Hooper would be plumbing bedrock.