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Australia vs British and Irish Lions 2nd Test (Melbourne)

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Dai bando

Charlie Fox (21)
I must say the negativity here is amazing, whinging poms huh!! well boys you won and I cant see you loosing the last test with or without Horwill, we don't seem to have a game plan cant seem to bring our strike runners in against you.
Played a tight game without having the appropriate grunt, no lads don't worry, our set piece that was going to make you second best has failed miserably, selections are a lottery with players past their best walking in to the side, I despair.:(
 

Pfitzy

Nathan Sharpe (72)
Pfitzy - I won't both trying to explain my position to you. You constantly deride through use of sarcasm, invective and other highly evolved debating methods any contrary point of view.

Yes, I also find talking down to my audience a strain. So if you lift your game, I'll revert to my dizzying intellect and wit to prove how wrong you are.


However, for the sake of completeness, I did not forget that the Mackenzie plan at the Tahs was very limited. Indeed if you had done a modicum of research on my posts on the Tahs subject

The last two (possibly three) times you have drawn this ambitious arc between the Waratahs and the Wallabies under Deans, you have NOT referred to McKenzie. Its always the Hickey/Foley axis of evil.

This is to completely ignore the fact that crowds decreased as the win count faltered, and the NSWRU marketing machine went to sleep, and the politicking behind closed doors caused rucktions.

When we lost Bledisloe #1 in 2000 it was the greatest game ever. But everyone still remembers Eales slotting the winning goal in Bled #2 that same year, despite it being a fairly ordinary Test Match.


I don't think that anybody who is not a Rugby fanatic would be engaged by the games we have seen. they were gripping for the passion and intensity and closeness of the scoreline, but certainly not for the quality of the play.


Oh no I see that point - a friend at work who is a Bulldogs (NRL) fan said he thoroughly enjoyed the first half of Test #1, but was not as interested in the second half when both teams (BOTH) were trying to win with penalties.

But its not just about trying to please people who aren't rugby fans. Rugby fans want wins in big series. And once every 12 years is a big series.

If you want to look for evils, go lower than Wallaby level, and off the field - the lack of FTA coverage is what kills the game here..
 

Inside Shoulder

Nathan Sharpe (72)
I must say the negativity here is amazing, whinging poms huh!! well boys you won and I cant see you loosing the last test with or without Horwill, we don't seem to have a game plan cant seem to bring our strike runners in against you.
Played a tight game without having the appropriate grunt, no lads don't worry, our set piece that was going to make you second best has failed miserably, selections are a lottery with players past their best walking in to the side, I despair.:(


We have other fish to fry later in the year - or more likely to be fried by.
 

Casper

Bob McCowan (2)
Lions didn't deserve to win - why they didn't ever kick for the corners is beyond me. But I thought Joubert had a poor last 50 mins. There were decisions that were just completely wrong for both sides but the crucial ones went to AUS. Eg pic attached - lydiate clearly onside when genia has his hands on the ball. Pen given and lili slots it for 9-9. In normal pace he looked offside but quite clearly isn't.
ImageUploadedByTapatalk1372579738.415472.jpg


Oh well Sydney next week is gonna be epic!
 

Dai bando

Charlie Fox (21)
We have other fish to fry later in the year - or more likely to be fried by.
Absolutely if we were playing the All blacks they would have put 30 points on us, not taking anything away from your team but. NZ would have been far more clinical, with our limited game plan would have been easy for them, at least you were able to change your game,
 

Inside Shoulder

Nathan Sharpe (72)
Absolutely if we were playing the All blacks they would have put 30 points on us, not taking anything away from your team but. NZ would have been far more clinical, with our limited game plan would have been easy for them, at least you were able to change your game,

That's what is concerning me.
I just hope that rarity of Lions tours and the consequent uniqueness of the occasion is some explanation - which it may be for both teams.
 

It is what it is

John Solomon (38)
Why was the Lions deliberate tactic of laying down for a breather at every opportunity not addressed by Joubert?
The Lions conveniently had a player go down at far too many stops in play for scrums and lineouts, delaying restarts by over a minute per time.
It was like watching the Cheetahs of 2009-2012.
Where was Horwill bringing this to Jouberts attention?
It suits us to play an up tempo game and this Lions tactic kept them in the game.
 

Quick Hands

David Wilson (68)
I must say the negativity here is amazing, whinging poms huh!! well boys you won and I cant see you loosing the last test with or without Horwill, we don't seem to have a game plan cant seem to bring our strike runners in against you.
Played a tight game without having the appropriate grunt, no lads don't worry, our set piece that was going to make you second best has failed miserably, selections are a lottery with players past their best walking in to the side, I despair.:(
I think that you're right and we'll win next week.

If I were a Lions fan, I'd be confused about why after receiving 2 consecutive penalties for collapsing mauls and 5 m from the Wallaby line, the Lions opted for 3 points. Even Marto realised the obvious opportunity for a try/penalty try off the next maul. I also agree about the lack of use of Bowe and North. After playing positively all tour, the Lions seemed to go into a very negative mode this match. A strange game plan.
 

Bullrush

Geoff Shaw (53)
If we've got two guys doing most of the work, why aren't they being picked with the 10 on their back instead?

Currently we have a guy who stands way too deep to receive the ball which stuffs up our ability to get back to the line and an inability to draw a defender then pass.

Did you see the only try that was scored in last night's game?!?
 

Sully

Tim Horan (67)
Staff member
Sexton tackled him as he should and Jonathan Davies fell off AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) so who did he draw?
 

barbarian

Phil Kearns (64)
Staff member
If I were a Lions fan, I'd be confused about why after receiving 2 consecutive penalties for collapsing mauls and 5 m from the Wallaby line, the Lions opted for 3 points. Even Marto realised the obvious opportunity for a try/penalty try off the next maul.

Agreed, it was a very strange decision, and I actually think it was a big blunder from the Lions. If they caught the ball clean from the lineout there was a strong chance of either a try or another penalty and yellow card.

In the end that was the closest they went to scoring all night, and I reckon if they had their time again they would make a different decision.
.
 

Bruce Ross

Ken Catchpole (46)
Why was the Lions deliberate tactic of laying down for a breather at every opportunity not addressed by Joubert?
The Lions conveniently had a player go down at far too many stops in play for scrums and lineouts, delaying restarts by over a minute per time.

Genuine curiosity, Iiwii. What do suggest the referee could have done about it?
.
 

Bullrush

Geoff Shaw (53)
Sexton tackled him as he should and Jonathan Davies fell off AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) so who did he draw?

Shiiiiiiit......are you kidding me? I'm not one to put something like this on here but you have no fucking clue about rugby if you don't think that O'Conner drew Davies. Davies didn't fall off AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper)....he was lucky to even get his hands on him. This is just bloody ridiculous........watch the freakn try again and see why Davies doesn't tackle AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper). Fuck me.......it's not like AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) jedi-mind-tricked Davies into thinking that he wasn't there. Bloody hell, it is stupid that I'm even having to defend this.

Honestly, if you do not think that O'Conner drew Davies and then passed to AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) for the try then you truly have no business talking about any kind of rugby strategy, positional play, basic rugby skills etc. Just sit there, read the posts quietly and you mite learn a thing or two.....
 

Scotty

David Codey (61)
Just watched the game again. A few comments:

Quality was better than I remembered, there were dropped balls but the game was fucking fast and physical.

I think JOC (James O'Connor) played pretty well. I remember him being average, and most people here have put the boot into him here and elsewhere. But I am going to swim against the tide. I thought he was a big improvement on Brisbane.

He didn't do anything particularly memorable, but he didn't need to. His distribution was crisp, and his defece solid. His kicking game was very god, and he had a couple of good runs (which IMO were the right option almost every time).

I reckon he made only two errors all night. A knock-on in the first half, and the out on the full kick in the last minutes.

I'd keep him at 10 in Sydney, and going forward. I thought our backline played bloody well all things considered, and if we can keep it fit and firing we will take apart plenty of sides. Lilo was a very nice addition.

As for the pigs, plenty of 'solid, but not outstanding' games. Mowen had some nice moments but gave away a few costly penalties (including the last one). Benny Robbo and Kev played a solid 80, but Hooper got through a tonne of work so gets my 'best forward' award.

Genia, Folau and AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) immense in the backs. All World XV players at the moment.
.

JOC (James O'Connor) was certainly better but still a long way from what our top flyhalves would offer. His clearing kicking was great, his defense satisfactory. Two QC (Quade Cooper) like errors though (glossed over by the QC (Quade Cooper) hate brigade).

For mine any of To'omua, Cooper, Foley or Lilo would have been better - and therein lies the point of most detractors - these four have all proven themselves better 10s at super level, whereas JOC (James O'Connor) has been average at best and is third choice for his Rebels team.

It isn't a matter of him being horrible it is that there are more proven options.

You could almost believe that Deans has the same opinion. JOC (James O'Connor) has been picked as a low mistake (hmmmm), good tackling and kicking option at 10, but he only plays first receiver about 50% of the time. He has has picked Beale and Lilo to also spend time at first receiver despite being rather critical of the Reds system of using Cooper at 15 in defense and 10 in attack.

So does Deans really think that JOC (James O'Connor) is the best 10 in this country?

My opinion is that he is doing a disservice to JOC (James O'Connor) by a) not using him in his most effective position and b) picking him at 10 then shifting him in and out of that spot on the field.

Further he is doing a disservice to our backline by not having the same player in the 10 position at least 90% of the time and he is making Genia's job much harder by giving him multiple different backline 'generals' to work with.
 

Sully

Tim Horan (67)
Staff member
Shiiiiiiit..are you kidding me? I'm not one to put something like this on here but you have no fucking clue about rugby if you don't think that O'Conner drew Davies. Davies didn't fall off AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper)..he was lucky to even get his hands on him. This is just bloody ridiculous....watch the freakn try again and see why Davies doesn't tackle AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper). Fuck me...it's not like AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) jedi-mind-tricked Davies into thinking that he wasn't there. Bloody hell, it is stupid that I'm even having to defend this.

Honestly, if you do not think that O'Conner drew Davies and then passed to AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) for the try then you truly have no business talking about any kind of rugby strategy, positional play, basic rugby skills etc. Just sit there, read the posts quietly and you mite learn a thing or two...
here is a picture of Davies being 'lucky to even get his hands on him'
367_DSC_7051_2013_06_29_2899.jpg
 

Bruce Ross

Ken Catchpole (46)
If the player is not essential to the next set piece, the ref could just call play on. The unforced stoppages annoy me too.

My impression is that when this tactic is used, almost invariably it is a tight forward who is in his death throes.
.
 

The_Brown_Hornet

John Eales (66)
Shiiiiiiit..are you kidding me? I'm not one to put something like this on here but you have no fucking clue about rugby if you don't think that O'Conner drew Davies. Davies didn't fall off AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper)..he was lucky to even get his hands on him. This is just bloody ridiculous....watch the freakn try again and see why Davies doesn't tackle AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper). Fuck me...it's not like AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) jedi-mind-tricked Davies into thinking that he wasn't there. Bloody hell, it is stupid that I'm even having to defend this.

Honestly, if you do not think that O'Conner drew Davies and then passed to AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) for the try then you truly have no business talking about any kind of rugby strategy, positional play, basic rugby skills etc. Just sit there, read the posts quietly and you mite learn a thing or two...


Yep, it was a great move and simple in its execution. The issue for me is that JOC (James O'Connor) doesn't have enough smarts in that position (at least not yet) to do it more often. Granted, that Lions defence was pretty airtight, but I want to see him bring other blokes into the play a bit more and not go as laterally as he does at present. His selection at 10 is really my only issue at the minute. It could be easily solved by swapping he and Lilo around too.
 

Inside Shoulder

Nathan Sharpe (72)
Shiiiiiiit..are you kidding me? I'm not one to put something like this on here but you have no fucking clue about rugby if you don't think that O'Conner drew Davies. Davies didn't fall off AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper)..he was lucky to even get his hands on him. This is just bloody ridiculous....watch the freakn try again and see why Davies doesn't tackle AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper). Fuck me...it's not like AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) jedi-mind-tricked Davies into thinking that he wasn't there. Bloody hell, it is stupid that I'm even having to defend this.

Honestly, if you do not think that O'Conner drew Davies and then passed to AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) for the try then you truly have no business talking about any kind of rugby strategy, positional play, basic rugby skills etc. Just sit there, read the posts quietly and you mite learn a thing or two...

http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-union/u...l-in-yet-another-thriller-20130629-2p4fv.html

I think Davies had no confidence in Sexton making his tackle but Davies got both hands to AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper).
A draw, by my definition, would have involved Davies actually committing to tackle JOC (James O'Connor) which i dont think he ever did.
Bad read by Davies because JOC (James O'Connor) just had to be Sexton's.
 
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